6 ms·
Why Are Men More Vulnerable to Depression in Fatherhood?
- jtwoodhouse 2y agoThe economic reality is both parents are usually working these days. Parenting responsibilities are a lot more shared than they used to be while men identify strongly with how they perform at work. It’s a squeeze.
- anonzzzies 2y agoNot sure it is these days; in my youth in the 80s-90s, at least 5 fathers of friends committed suicide (4 by hanging, 1 by gassing himself in his car). Might be more I don't know about. No sure about the stats / difference.
- lotsofpulp 2y agoI am going to guess your group of friends was quite the outlier. Or you considered a ton of people to be your friends.
- bean-weevil 2y ago> Or you considered a ton of people to be your friends. That's an awful way to write that. You're insinuating that maybe their friends weren't true. How could you know?
- dambi0 2y agoI think you are maybe looking for offense. If I say “I consider them a good friend” it doesn’t bring into question the strength of the friendship.
- bean-weevil 2y agoYou're totally right. I didn't think of it that way.
- anonzzzies 2y agoI didn't say good friends; I was in school; guys in my class are my friends unless they are my enemies. And I included that I don't know the stats or data on it, but hearing from others now, many years later, it was not rare. I also had 2 family members and 2 good friends commit suicide over my lifetime: no idea about stats again, but I know a lot of people (and I live in a completely different country now) who had similar stats.
- sellmesoap 2y agoI've also experienced this (sample of 1 in the 2000's) but it is devastating for all who are near.
- bobxmax 2y agoThis is the real problem IMO. I live in a very religiously conservative country with pretty strict gender roles in marriages. Having lived in the West before, I definitely see a lot less dysfunction or mental health issues here, at least from my peers. But there's also a lot of collectivism here - village to raise a child sort of thing and most people live in joint families. The human being is still adapting to a very new and very foreign reality.
- toomuchtodo 2y agoIt should be obvious that having children is going to cause a negative impact, for an extended a duration, on a relationship. I find folks jump into being a parent with rose tinted glasses, not fully grasping what a 20+ year commitment looks like (trying to juggle a career and the economics, a partner, and children in what is essentially perpetuity). https://ericalayne.co/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/kidhappy.gif https://ericalayne.co/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/kidhappy.gi... https://www.ted.com/talks/rufus_griscom_alisa_volkman_let_s_talk_parenting_taboos https://www.ted.com/talks/rufus_griscom_alisa_volkman_let_s_... https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/parents-under-pressure.pdf https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/parents-under-pressu... (parent)
- WarOnPrivacy 2y ago> 20+ year commitment I'm 33y into mine and I don't know how long it/me will last.
- ta12653421 2y agosad to say: YES, this is absolutely true. Esp the 20 year commitment if you get separated and if there are children and if you just cant see the other person anymore after years of relationship before the children arrived.
- ablation 2y agoMany, many years into my “commitment” and it’s been the best time of my life. And my partner’s, too. I’d do it all again in a heartbeat, even the tougher times. YMMV, but such is life.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- toomuchtodo 2y agoCongrats on winning the lottery, most people do not.
- 2y ago
- Quinzel 2y agoBecause being a parent is hard.
- sublinear 2y agoyes and something I vaguely remember about $5 bills
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- alphan0n 2y ago[flagged]
- sabbaticaldev 2y ago[dead]
- alxjrvs 2y ago[flagged]
- Jerrrry 2y agoMaybe a male Jack the Ripper as well
- sameoldtune 2y agoJustice for men! Then finally alphan0n could come out of the closet as the true alpha he has been this whole time
- alphan0n 2y agoMy name is Alphanso.
- alphan0n 2y agoSome of us aren’t political aspirants, we just want our kids, or safety from violent partners, or fair government protections, or to not be discarded when we come back from war broken, dignity without being mocked. For all the good every male president we’ve ever had has been in those departments.
- alxjrvs 2y agoYes, there are many problems that are unique to men that society does not address. I would not say that is because men are not adequately represented in the halls of power, or because society does not adequately cater to men's needs. "Second class citizen" is patently absurd.
- boogerlad 2y agoIt has been 5 years and while it's getting better, I still regret every single day. I never wanted one since I believe I'm unsuitable to be a parent, yet everyone around me assured me it would be ok. It wasn't. I don't spend more than 10 consecutive minutes of quality time with my wife each day and I have lost all desire to do anything. That doesn't really matter though, because I can't do anything. I feel like my ability to execute has been reduced so much. My kid isn't even bad. I think they are quite good. I am the problem. This makes me feel even worse because my kid loves me and I can't return it.
- xandrius 2y agoSorry to hear you're going through that. It does sound like having someone to open up and talk to, even someone you pay (i.e. A therapist), could help. This is especially true if many crucial things around you sound to be positive. All the best and don't forget that it can get better!
- sellmesoap 2y agoHaving someone you pay is actually key here (at least for me.) Never do I want to fix something more then when there's money on the line. I'm sure that getting lucky in finding a therapist that can understand you and provide a hint as to change your approach or bolster you when you're correct but unsure. Free advice can be perfectly correct, but when you're paying maybe you take it more seriously.
- ablation 2y agoSorry to hear this. I urge you to seek some kind of help and support for this, because what you’re describing rings of depression, whatever the root cause (even if it feels obvious).
- JoBrad 2y agoBy no means an I an expert, but in my experience, engaging with your family and learning to open up to them (even about your feelings of inadequacy) results in a much richer relationship. It’s like listening to a sad song when you’re sad. You may find that they are yearning to be closer to you, even if you don’t think you’re what they need. Best of luck, friend. :)
- K0balt 2y agoI wonder if this is just because it’s hard, and your expectations will likely be unmet, or if there is another reason? Is there an “evolutionary biology “ reason? As a parent of 6.9 children, parenting is a huge commitment. But I have lived my entire life since 27 raising children, so to me it’s life as usual. A key factor is making time for your relationship and maintaining intimacy. Intimacy in its many forms is sooo foundational, anyone that ignores or neglects it is likely asking for serious challenges down the road.
- xandrius 2y agoI'd love to hear so much more from your experience! I'm on the fence about this topic and hearing from someone who has had more than 2 might help generalise how having a kid could be. For me, it feels like one of the few things I've experienced in life on which I won't have much control over after the first decision (of having a kid). Almost everything else is me deciding every day to do or not do something. This is different.
- noworriesnate 2y agoI have five. It is the most utterly fulfilling aspect of my life. I'm going to (mis)quote John Deloney about this issue: You know how when you're single and making money hand over fist and you have a lot of money (compared to you as a teen), and it's awesome? And then you first get married, together you're pretty poor but you're having tons of sex, and it's a different kind of awesome? And then you have children, and you're sleep deprived and sex is kind of weird and the baby is pooping on stuff, but you see your own child--and again, it's a different kind of awesome.
- xandrius 2y agoNot very useful but thanks for the attempt :)
- noworriesnate 2y agoLOL sorry, wish you the best either way!
- LUmBULtERA 2y agoIt’s the no sleep thing compounded with stress of an extra dependent. I love being a father, but that first year in particular was tough.
- tsss 2y agoThe answer is obvious: Because children suck and those parents realize that they have ruined their lives entirely by choice and are now stuck chained to some kid for the next 18 years at least. The more interesting question is why this was not even considered a possible explanation in the article? We all know the reason.
- billy99k 2y agoWhen you are in the final stages of life and have nobody to visit you, you will regret this type of thinking.
- decafninja 2y agoWhile the notion of spending your twilight years with your beloved children is wonderful, what I see happening just as often is seniors ending up in a nursing home, seeing their children and grandchildren only a few times a year, if even that. This seems especially true in American society versus other countries. And that’s not even counting the cases where your children can’t stand you, if not estranged and outright hate you. Which if you read suggestions that ever dare to suggest that you can indeed live with your parents beyond the age of 18, seems to happen quite often too. The first scenario is the good ending, and would definitely be worth the effort of raising children. The second ending? I think I’d rather just not have kids at all if that’s my fate.
- Jerrrry 2y agoPost term abortion isnt cheap
- billy99k 2y agoI have two kids and while I was never depressed, I can see how it can happen. You get virtually no sleep for at least a year after the kid is born and you have to completely change your life routine (no more last-minute weekend trips for my wife and I). You also don't see your friends as much and it can feel isolating. This also leads to more stress for you and your partner. Many people divorce/break up during this time because of the this. I wouldn't change a thing though. I love being a father.
- mmh0000 2y agoI love all the "helpless" internet advice in this thread by people who are oblivious to what depression is. "Oh you're depressed and suffer from making executive decisions. Why don't you just make a decision and fix this?! You know therapists exist right!? Fuck you're so fucking dumb, you piece of shit. Just be happy, it's not that hard!"
- caeril 2y agoYou might also be oblivious to what depression IS, because clinical psychologists are, as well. Depression is a cluster of symptoms, for all intents and purposes. There is some evidence that SSRIs help these symptoms, but direct causal seratonin deficiency hypotheses have yet to be supported. There's scant evidence that modern non-pharmaceutical therapeutic interventions (with the exception of niche interventions like CBT) are even effective, yet the advice "go to therapy" gets tossed around constantly as if it's Science(tm) with a capital S. You can claim that the "depression is just a matter of perspective bro" is an ignorant take, but according to the literature, "depression is a chemical imbalance", or any other definitive "depression is X" claim is equally ignorant. We still don't really know. We're still searching.