3 ms·

I'm reasonably confident WhatsApp never caught on in the USA because most American phone plans had unlimited SMS in the early 2010s when WhatsApp's popularity w

by Zak 2y ago

I'm reasonably confident WhatsApp never caught on in the USA because most American phone plans had unlimited SMS in the early 2010s when WhatsApp's popularity was growing elsewhere. International messaging was probably also a big driver in Europe, but less relevant in other markets.

hocuspocus 2y ago
International messaging is still relevant in many parts of the world that don't necessarily need to message neighboring countries, but have a big diaspora.
- Zak 2y ago
  Sure. Americans with close or many international contacts almost certainly use an internet-based chat/voice app with those contacts. That's not a large enough percentage than any one messaging app is a viable option for a group chat involving a dozen randomly-selected Americans. Almost every time, one or two of them will steadfastly refuse to install any app and insist on using MMS.
- toast0 2y ago
  Yeah, but the US is pretty insular. Times are different now, but my grandparents who immigrated basically didn't communicate with the old country in my lifetime. If roughly 15% of the US population is immigrants [1], and not all of them communicate across borders, and very few non-immigtants communicate cross borders there's not a whole lot of demand for a product that reduces costs of cross border messaging in the US. As an early employee if anyone knew about WhatsApp, they almost certainly were a younger immigrant. Everyone else was like 'why would I use that?, I have unlimited texts' or they were using BBM. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/27/u-s-immigrant-population-in-2023-saw-largest-increase-in-more-than-20-years/sr_2024-09-26_immigrant-growth-2023_chart/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/27/u-s-immig...
kazen44 2y ago
yes, roaming coasts where still a thing inside the EU, so messaging relatives or friends while on holiday sucked because of the enormous pricing for roaming. (even while using SMS!. I remember paying rougly 30 euros to send a couple of hundred text messages and have a couple of minutes ( like half an hour or something) while on holiday in france. thankfully, roaming got abolished in the first half of the 2010's thank to an EU directive, but at that time whatsapp was already very large across the EU.
- vladvasiliu 2y ago
  Roaming is abolished but not international fees. This means we now have this funny situation where if you’re abroad, sending international texts or calls is included in your plan. But if you’re in your own country, calling or texting someone in a different country is not.
crazygringo 2y ago
You are correct, this is exactly the reason. Other countries charged per SMS so everyone had good reason to use an app instead. The US didn't charge, so why would anyone download an app?
- ethbr1 2y ago
  The US did have SMS caps/charges, but pre-2008-iPhone+AppStore. (from memory) Consequently, I don't remember much of a timespan when US customers had both (a) SMS caps/charges and (b) smartphones with open-enough app stores to distribute something like WhatsApp. For much of the rest of the world, including international communication, that was a more extended period.
- oefrha 2y ago
  > The US didn't charge More like charged so exorbitantly up front so there’s no reason to additionally charge per use. My AT&T phone bill in the early 2010s was ~$80 as a single line or ~$50 per line as part of a family, which was several times over what I paid elsewhere with per-minute/text pricing. I later switched to a cheap MVNO (PureTalk) which did charge per text.
ianburrell 2y ago
Another reason is that the Nokia Symbian and Series 40 phones weren't popular in the US.
lxgr 2y ago
It’s that, and the fact that MMS is still not free on most plans (if it even is still available; I know operators that just don’t support it, because nobody uses it).

by Zak 2y ago

hocuspocus 2y ago

International messaging is still relevant in many parts of the world that don't necessarily need to message neighboring countries, but have a big diaspora.

Zak 2y ago
Sure. Americans with close or many international contacts almost certainly use an internet-based chat/voice app with those contacts. That's not a large enough percentage than any one messaging app is a viable option for a group chat involving a dozen randomly-selected Americans. Almost every time, one or two of them will steadfastly refuse to install any app and insist on using MMS.
toast0 2y ago
Yeah, but the US is pretty insular. Times are different now, but my grandparents who immigrated basically didn't communicate with the old country in my lifetime. If roughly 15% of the US population is immigrants [1], and not all of them communicate across borders, and very few non-immigtants communicate cross borders there's not a whole lot of demand for a product that reduces costs of cross border messaging in the US. As an early employee if anyone knew about WhatsApp, they almost certainly were a younger immigrant. Everyone else was like 'why would I use that?, I have unlimited texts' or they were using BBM. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/27/u-s-immigrant-population-in-2023-saw-largest-increase-in-more-than-20-years/sr_2024-09-26_immigrant-growth-2023_chart/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/27/u-s-immig...

kazen44 2y ago

yes, roaming coasts where still a thing inside the EU, so messaging relatives or friends while on holiday sucked because of the enormous pricing for roaming. (even while using SMS!. I remember paying rougly 30 euros to send a couple of hundred text messages and have a couple of minutes ( like half an hour or something) while on holiday in france. thankfully, roaming got abolished in the first half of the 2010's thank to an EU directive, but at that time whatsapp was already very large across the EU.

vladvasiliu 2y ago
Roaming is abolished but not international fees. This means we now have this funny situation where if you’re abroad, sending international texts or calls is included in your plan. But if you’re in your own country, calling or texting someone in a different country is not.

crazygringo 2y ago

You are correct, this is exactly the reason. Other countries charged per SMS so everyone had good reason to use an app instead. The US didn't charge, so why would anyone download an app?

ethbr1 2y ago
The US did have SMS caps/charges, but pre-2008-iPhone+AppStore. (from memory) Consequently, I don't remember much of a timespan when US customers had both (a) SMS caps/charges and (b) smartphones with open-enough app stores to distribute something like WhatsApp. For much of the rest of the world, including international communication, that was a more extended period.
oefrha 2y ago
> The US didn't charge More like charged so exorbitantly up front so there’s no reason to additionally charge per use. My AT&T phone bill in the early 2010s was ~$80 as a single line or ~$50 per line as part of a family, which was several times over what I paid elsewhere with per-minute/text pricing. I later switched to a cheap MVNO (PureTalk) which did charge per text.

ianburrell 2y ago

Another reason is that the Nokia Symbian and Series 40 phones weren't popular in the US.

lxgr 2y ago

It’s that, and the fact that MMS is still not free on most plans (if it even is still available; I know operators that just don’t support it, because nobody uses it).