5 ms·

And the verge blog post about it. https://www.theverge.com/2024/12/12/24319528/google-android-xr-samsung-project-moohan-smart-glasses https://www.theverge.com/

by dagmx 2y ago

And the verge blog post about it. https://www.theverge.com/2024/12/12/24319528/google-android-xr-samsung-project-moohan-smart-glasses https://www.theverge.com/2024/12/12/24319528/google-android-... Seems like a very similar direction to visionOS. I’m glad Apple normalized the ability to run mobile apps spatially. I do wonder how this affects Meta’s plans for horizonOS. Are access to Meta’s game library more important than access to androids ecosystem.

world2vec 2y ago
That Verge article has at least a rendering of some VR/AR/XR headset, original post doesn't show or talk about any hardware.
jsheard 2y ago
> Seems like a very similar direction to visionOS. A crucial difference is that Android XR apparently has first-class support for 6DoF controllers (like Horizon OS) in addition to eye and hand tracking (like Vision OS) so it's aiming to compete on both fronts. Google thankfully didn't cargo-cult Apples decision to rely on eye and hand tracking, which is far from ideal for VR games.
- dagmx 2y ago
  I think Apple picked the right direction to launch with as their primary interaction method. Controllers would be nice but as a secondary input. Google are apparently not mandating eye tracking or hand tracking. Which is nice for flexibility but you’re going to have a mishmash of interaction models for native apps.
  - MBCook 2y ago
    There is a recent rumor that they have been working with Sony to bring the PSVR 2 controllers to work on visionOS. Given Apple has not focused on gaming I think the decision they made was a good one too. You shouldn’t NEED special controllers to use the device like early VR headsets. However there are definitely things that would work better with controllers. Not just gaming but things where you need very fine input or having multiple buttons to switch modes or something would be good. So I hope the rumor turns out to be true.
  - archagon 2y ago
    How did you come to that conclusion? Vision Pro sales seem to be quite poor and there's very little developer buy-in. The biggest use case for VR today is gaming, and Apple essentially decided to opt out of that market with their flagship VR product.
- cube2222 2y ago
  Fwiw HorizonOS does support hand tracking (at least in the Quest 3 which I have) and you can navigate the UI without controllers. It works quite well. The Quest Pro also supports eye tracking, though not sure how well-integrated that is into the experience. I believe it's used to achieve foveated rendering with steam link, though.
  - wkat4242 2y ago
    > (at least in the Quest 3 which I have) Yup and the Quest 2 and even the Quest 1 got it too! Though the Quest 1 is a bit behind the latest improvements though since it no longer receives OS updates. I have some of all 3 models :)
- threeseed 2y ago
  But Apple’s approach is fantastic for everything else. As it allows you to use the device without having to move your arms around.
- kalleboo 2y ago
  Rumors are that Apple are caving on there "no controllers" thing https://www.macrumors.com/2024/12/08/sony-vr2-controllers-apple-vision-pro-support/ https://www.macrumors.com/2024/12/08/sony-vr2-controllers-ap... I think requiring the gestures as the baseline control scheme is smart though since for something like a VR headset, having the controllers around and keeping them charged as well adds a lot of friction to using it. They should be an option though since basically any game requires it.
klausa 2y ago
I can't get over how much that Samsung headset is just "sure yeah copy my homework, just change a couple of things" version of Vision Pro.
- cubefox 2y ago
  > Project Moohan felt like a mix between a Meta Quest 3 and Vision Pro headset. > In the Moohan headset, I can say, “Take me to JYP Entertainment in Seoul,” and it will automatically open Google Maps and show me that building. If my windows get cluttered, I can ask it to reorganize them. I don’t have to lift a finger. While wearing the prototype glasses, I watch and listen as Gemini summarizes a long, rambling text message to the main point: can you buy lemon, ginger, and olive oil from the store? I was able to naturally switch from speaking in English to asking in Japanese what the weather is in New York — and get the answer in spoken and written Japanese.
- oldpersonintx 2y ago
  [dead]
- freedomben 2y ago
  To be fair, a lot of the Vision Pro is a copy of all the AR/VR things that came before it. Even the eye tracking and gesture tracking is/was not new by any extent when Apple implemented it. That's kind of how these things work (whether it should or not is a different discussion). There's very little actual innovation because innovation is risky, and the bigger the company the less real appetite there is for risk because that's how executives get fired. The direction flows down from there. Most engineers at these companies who have good ideas and really want to innovate have to (and often want to) leave and do their own startup. These big companies are quite happy to let the startups do the innovating and take all the risk, and then just buying them out or ripping them off once there's a demonstration that there's a market. With increased regulatory scrutiny, the latter seems to be getting more common, but that's also a different discussion. Also relevant, queue the spiderman pointing at spiderman meme.
  - philistine 2y ago
jayd16 2y ago
Its amazing how much undeserved credit Apple gets... The article just shows web pages, something that has been in XR headsets for long before VisionOS and in much greater numbers in the Quest to boot. So what has been normalized? Who is buzzing about VisionOS apps?
- dagmx 2y ago
  Perhaps you could actually read my sentence and say that it allows running Android apps natively as a first class citizen. Which is also part of the linked press release. That they showed it with just Chrome is a presentation issue on their part, but it’s definitely a value add when you’re not constrained to the limited subset of the apps for a fledgling platform.
  - jayd16 2y ago
    The meta headsets actually do run Android apps. The main issue is every major app uses Google Play Services. It's true that Google and Apple are in a unique position to leverage their walled gardens. I'm not sure that needs normalizing.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
- interpol_p 2y ago
  In this case I think they are missing a lot of deserved credit. A ton of UI paradigms, established by visionOS, are taken wholesale in XR. Even down to the styling of the developer docs Good thread outlining the comparison https://mastodon.social/@stroughtonsmith/11364102418590280 https://mastodon.social/@stroughtonsmith/11364102418590280
  - jayd16 2y ago
    Broken link?
    - 2y ago

by dagmx 2y ago

world2vec 2y ago

That Verge article has at least a rendering of some VR/AR/XR headset, original post doesn't show or talk about any hardware.

jsheard 2y ago

> Seems like a very similar direction to visionOS. A crucial difference is that Android XR apparently has first-class support for 6DoF controllers (like Horizon OS) in addition to eye and hand tracking (like Vision OS) so it's aiming to compete on both fronts. Google thankfully didn't cargo-cult Apples decision to rely on eye and hand tracking, which is far from ideal for VR games.

dagmx 2y ago
I think Apple picked the right direction to launch with as their primary interaction method. Controllers would be nice but as a secondary input. Google are apparently not mandating eye tracking or hand tracking. Which is nice for flexibility but you’re going to have a mishmash of interaction models for native apps.
- MBCook 2y ago
  There is a recent rumor that they have been working with Sony to bring the PSVR 2 controllers to work on visionOS. Given Apple has not focused on gaming I think the decision they made was a good one too. You shouldn’t NEED special controllers to use the device like early VR headsets. However there are definitely things that would work better with controllers. Not just gaming but things where you need very fine input or having multiple buttons to switch modes or something would be good. So I hope the rumor turns out to be true.
- archagon 2y ago
  How did you come to that conclusion? Vision Pro sales seem to be quite poor and there's very little developer buy-in. The biggest use case for VR today is gaming, and Apple essentially decided to opt out of that market with their flagship VR product.
cube2222 2y ago
Fwiw HorizonOS does support hand tracking (at least in the Quest 3 which I have) and you can navigate the UI without controllers. It works quite well. The Quest Pro also supports eye tracking, though not sure how well-integrated that is into the experience. I believe it's used to achieve foveated rendering with steam link, though.
- wkat4242 2y ago
  > (at least in the Quest 3 which I have) Yup and the Quest 2 and even the Quest 1 got it too! Though the Quest 1 is a bit behind the latest improvements though since it no longer receives OS updates. I have some of all 3 models :)
threeseed 2y ago
But Apple’s approach is fantastic for everything else. As it allows you to use the device without having to move your arms around.
kalleboo 2y ago
Rumors are that Apple are caving on there "no controllers" thing https://www.macrumors.com/2024/12/08/sony-vr2-controllers-apple-vision-pro-support/ https://www.macrumors.com/2024/12/08/sony-vr2-controllers-ap... I think requiring the gestures as the baseline control scheme is smart though since for something like a VR headset, having the controllers around and keeping them charged as well adds a lot of friction to using it. They should be an option though since basically any game requires it.

klausa 2y ago

I can't get over how much that Samsung headset is just "sure yeah copy my homework, just change a couple of things" version of Vision Pro.

cubefox 2y ago
> Project Moohan felt like a mix between a Meta Quest 3 and Vision Pro headset. > In the Moohan headset, I can say, “Take me to JYP Entertainment in Seoul,” and it will automatically open Google Maps and show me that building. If my windows get cluttered, I can ask it to reorganize them. I don’t have to lift a finger. While wearing the prototype glasses, I watch and listen as Gemini summarizes a long, rambling text message to the main point: can you buy lemon, ginger, and olive oil from the store? I was able to naturally switch from speaking in English to asking in Japanese what the weather is in New York — and get the answer in spoken and written Japanese.
oldpersonintx 2y ago
[dead]
freedomben 2y ago
To be fair, a lot of the Vision Pro is a copy of all the AR/VR things that came before it. Even the eye tracking and gesture tracking is/was not new by any extent when Apple implemented it. That's kind of how these things work (whether it should or not is a different discussion). There's very little actual innovation because innovation is risky, and the bigger the company the less real appetite there is for risk because that's how executives get fired. The direction flows down from there. Most engineers at these companies who have good ideas and really want to innovate have to (and often want to) leave and do their own startup. These big companies are quite happy to let the startups do the innovating and take all the risk, and then just buying them out or ripping them off once there's a demonstration that there's a market. With increased regulatory scrutiny, the latter seems to be getting more common, but that's also a different discussion. Also relevant, queue the spiderman pointing at spiderman meme.
- philistine 2y ago

jayd16 2y ago

Its amazing how much undeserved credit Apple gets... The article just shows web pages, something that has been in XR headsets for long before VisionOS and in much greater numbers in the Quest to boot. So what has been normalized? Who is buzzing about VisionOS apps?

dagmx 2y ago
Perhaps you could actually read my sentence and say that it allows running Android apps natively as a first class citizen. Which is also part of the linked press release. That they showed it with just Chrome is a presentation issue on their part, but it’s definitely a value add when you’re not constrained to the limited subset of the apps for a fledgling platform.
- jayd16 2y ago
  The meta headsets actually do run Android apps. The main issue is every major app uses Google Play Services. It's true that Google and Apple are in a unique position to leverage their walled gardens. I'm not sure that needs normalizing.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
interpol_p 2y ago
In this case I think they are missing a lot of deserved credit. A ton of UI paradigms, established by visionOS, are taken wholesale in XR. Even down to the styling of the developer docs Good thread outlining the comparison https://mastodon.social/@stroughtonsmith/11364102418590280 https://mastodon.social/@stroughtonsmith/11364102418590280
- jayd16 2y ago
  Broken link?
  - 2y ago