5 ms·

As someone currently on a strict ketogenic diet (gotta cut and get ready for the Christmas fattening) I can say ketones are something else in the brain. I sat

As someone currently on a strict ketogenic diet (gotta cut and get ready for the Christmas fattening) I can say ketones are something else in the brain. I sat at my desk today for 6 hours straight without even getting so much as a drink of water. I didn't even think about eating. Just in the zone and hyper focused. A very weird and pleasant experience, that alas can't be sustained forever given how delicious carbs are.

epsilonic 2y ago
This is something I've been experiencing as well, and I just started exogenous Ketone supplementation three days ago.
- IAmGraydon 2y ago
  Exogenous ketone supplementation? Are you drinking acetone or something?
  - epsilonic 2y ago
    Not quite. I've been taking Beta-hydroxybutyrate (BHB) salts in powder form, mixed with water. Here is some interesting literature discussing its benefits as a metabolic regulator of proteostasis in aged and Alzheimer-diseased brains: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37461525/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37461525/ (same research article referenced in the post link) I personally take it to manage brain fog due to long-Covid.
    - debacle 2y ago
      This is why I come to HN.
    - declan_roberts 2y ago
      Have you tried a ketogenic diet? Ketones from your own fat cells for free.
    - mogashe 2y ago
      did it help? also, before covid did you not have brain fog?
    - Imanari 2y ago
      are you taking BHB along with being on a ketogenic diet or do you else eat carbs?
    - LinuxBender 2y ago
      I use that as well. I found that it was a great way to slowly ween myself off caffeine while avoiding the caffeine withdrawals. My sleep is improving a little and I remember more dreams, not sure why.
    - jamisteven 2y ago
      Interested to know if this ends up helping you long term, thanks.
matthewdgreen 2y ago
Except for the fact that my memory goes to crap for a few days every time I go on a keto diet. Is this just me?
- thenayr 2y ago
  Totally normal the first days even weeks are a bit fuzzy. Your body is adapting to a completely different metabolic system. It’s very stressful.
- 01100011 2y ago
  Just going calorie negative did this to me. I still eat carbs and it doesn't seem to help.
- declan_roberts 2y ago
  A common phenomenon called keto flu. Especially pronounced the first time. I suggest high electrolyte food, such as a nice salty soup. Seems to help.
  - astrange 2y ago
    I like to do lazy keto (which is easy, just forget to buy snacks after you run out) but always find I'm thirsty and specifically always want miso soup. Maybe that's why.
- tdpvb 2y ago
  Don't forget electrolytes while fasting / in ketosis (all three: sodium, magnesium, and potassium).
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
123yawaworht456 2y ago
>A very weird and pleasant experience, that alas can't be sustained forever given how delicious carbs are. why not? it's just a matter of having access to decent meat/fish, discipline, and ignoring peer pressure at social gatherings. for me, it takes at least two weeks to recover from SAD-like diet and go back to the kind of state you're describing - high energy, mental clarity, complete absence of hunger, etc. the first week is particularly unpleasant - low energy and constant carb cravings, etc.
- ternnoburn 2y ago
  I've struggled with "but factory farmed meat and dairy conflict with my moral beliefs" when trying keto. It's nice, but very challenging to do sustainably if you have dietary limits like that.
  - codr7 2y ago
    There are better products. Likely more expensive, but possible.
    - ternnoburn 2y ago
      [dead]
  - declan_roberts 2y ago
    Go on craigslist and search for cow, beef, and lamb share. You can go visit the farm and verify the animals are happy, pasture-raised cattle. Our beef came from a cow we can see from our backyard.
    - ternnoburn 2y ago
      [dead]
  - dgfitz 2y ago
    [flagged]
Mountain_Skies 2y ago
I used to do a very low carb diet that kept me in ketosis. For the most part it was great but the sleep difference concerned me. At the time my life was structured to where I didn't need to be awake at any particular time so my body would wake up when it had enough sleep instead of when an alarm went off. While I usually sleep seven to eight hours when eating a standard American diet, when on low carb, it would end up being only five to six hours, usually closer to five than six. I'd feel completely rested and fine but most days I'd need to take a short ten to fifteen minute nap, during which I'd quickly fall into REM sleep. When waking up from that nap, I'd feel fine, no post-nap grogginess, but it made me wonder if I was getting shorted on REM sleep during my primary sleep period.
- arresin 2y ago
  It sounds very primal. Sleeping short times in the cave and then catching a cat nap when you can.
Semaphor 2y ago
> A very weird and pleasant experience, that alas can't be sustained forever given how delicious carbs are. I’ve been doing Keto for over a decade now, with one cheat day a year (Christmas market mulled wine with family). I can guarantee you it can easily[0] be sustained if one is so inclined. OTOH, 6 hours without water sounds neither healthy, nor like something I’d ever want to do. [0]: With the caveat, that your circumstances need to allow it. I’ve been working from home and cook all meals myself.
- inglor_cz 2y ago
  There are so many caveats to your "guarantee" that it isn't really guaranteeing anything. People are wildly diverse when it comes to food traditions, actual state of intestines and also cravings. What worked for you may not work for a Vietnamese guy who ate rice for 50 years of his life. Extrapolating carelessly from N == 1 is a bad idea.
  - Semaphor 2y ago
    You are extrapolating from my message. I disputed can't be sustained. For which a counter example is enough. But I'm not interested in nitpicking phrasing.
- dalyons 2y ago
  "easily be sustained" - for you maybe. I have done keto for long periods, 4 times in my life, and i find it personally extremely unsustainable. Boring, extremely restricting in social situations, and cuts you off from one of the greatest joys in life - the vast array of food, tastes and experiences available to the modern human existence. Casting wide generalizations from your own personal experience is bad, and unfortunately par for the course in any internet discussion of diet.
  - Semaphor 2y ago
    I wrote "can". As opposed to OPs "can’t". Not "is always". I also find it hilarious that you assume I’m cut off from one of the greatest joys in life - the vast array of food, tastes and experiences available to the modern human existence. Talk about generalizing from your experience, eh?
thenayr 2y ago
I was diehard keto for over a year straight. Chronic inflammation that I’ve lived with my entire life disappeared totally after a few weeks. I became pretty dogmatic about the whole thing and eventually my body started to suffer. I don’t believe it to be a long term sustainable diet, at least not at the level i was doing it (sub 20g carbs a day). My blood tests got very worrying towards the latter part of the year and I started to have regular panic attacks and what I can only presume is chronic low blood sugar that ultimately left me feeling pretty lifeless and scared. Anyways just my personal anecdote to remain cautiously optimistic
- declan_roberts 2y ago
  What did you see in your labs?
- 123yawaworht456 2y ago
  all exclusive diets (vegan/carnivore/keto/etc) are deficient in some vitamins, minerals, and maybe other things (omega-3, specific amino acids, etc). were you using supplements? on keto in particular, a decent multivitamin and some extra vitamin C, magnesium, and potassium are a must.
- Modified3019 2y ago
  My mistake was I gravitated to eating mostly fatty pork and chicken after a year. Turns out those are very high in omega-6’s. Does not play well with my mental health, skin (exacerbated my pollen allergy related eczema), resulted in starting to regain weight around my stomach despite maintaining a loss of 50 pounds for two years, and becoming cold all the time (yes, my thyroid and calories were fine). After some research on wtf might be going on, I had my suspicions and took an omegaquant test which revealed my circulating phospholipid omega-6 levels were crazy high, just a few percent below their max reference range. Moving to beef only halted my issues after 1-2 months. I like beef and monotony, but even I can’t eat just beef. I now cycle between keto and carbs (mostly potatoes, carrots, onions and glass noodles, sometimes pasta or bread buns). I generally have carbs near workout days. Now that I’ve shed the omega-6 pounds, I have some tolerance again but end up still mostly use beef, eggs, and frozen seafood blends (no fish, which when farmed tends to be high in omega-6). Oh, and if you are looking for a salad dressing that isn’t just flavored vegetable oil (high omega-6), give the “skinny girl” brand a try.
krzat 2y ago
There is a book about effect of keto on the brain: https://www.amazon.com/Brain-Energy-Revolutionary-Understanding-Health/dp/1637741588 https://www.amazon.com/Brain-Energy-Revolutionary-Understand... Not sure how much evidence is for claims, but sounds somewhat reasonable.

epsilonic 2y ago

This is something I've been experiencing as well, and I just started exogenous Ketone supplementation three days ago.

IAmGraydon 2y ago
Exogenous ketone supplementation? Are you drinking acetone or something?
- epsilonic 2y ago
  Not quite. I've been taking Beta-hydroxybutyrate (BHB) salts in powder form, mixed with water. Here is some interesting literature discussing its benefits as a metabolic regulator of proteostasis in aged and Alzheimer-diseased brains: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37461525/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37461525/ (same research article referenced in the post link) I personally take it to manage brain fog due to long-Covid.
  - debacle 2y ago
    This is why I come to HN.
  - declan_roberts 2y ago
    Have you tried a ketogenic diet? Ketones from your own fat cells for free.
  - mogashe 2y ago
    did it help? also, before covid did you not have brain fog?
  - Imanari 2y ago
    are you taking BHB along with being on a ketogenic diet or do you else eat carbs?
  - LinuxBender 2y ago
    I use that as well. I found that it was a great way to slowly ween myself off caffeine while avoiding the caffeine withdrawals. My sleep is improving a little and I remember more dreams, not sure why.
  - jamisteven 2y ago
    Interested to know if this ends up helping you long term, thanks.

matthewdgreen 2y ago

Except for the fact that my memory goes to crap for a few days every time I go on a keto diet. Is this just me?

thenayr 2y ago
Totally normal the first days even weeks are a bit fuzzy. Your body is adapting to a completely different metabolic system. It’s very stressful.
01100011 2y ago
Just going calorie negative did this to me. I still eat carbs and it doesn't seem to help.
declan_roberts 2y ago
A common phenomenon called keto flu. Especially pronounced the first time. I suggest high electrolyte food, such as a nice salty soup. Seems to help.
- astrange 2y ago
  I like to do lazy keto (which is easy, just forget to buy snacks after you run out) but always find I'm thirsty and specifically always want miso soup. Maybe that's why.
tdpvb 2y ago
Don't forget electrolytes while fasting / in ketosis (all three: sodium, magnesium, and potassium).
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

123yawaworht456 2y ago

>A very weird and pleasant experience, that alas can't be sustained forever given how delicious carbs are. why not? it's just a matter of having access to decent meat/fish, discipline, and ignoring peer pressure at social gatherings. for me, it takes at least two weeks to recover from SAD-like diet and go back to the kind of state you're describing - high energy, mental clarity, complete absence of hunger, etc. the first week is particularly unpleasant - low energy and constant carb cravings, etc.

ternnoburn 2y ago
I've struggled with "but factory farmed meat and dairy conflict with my moral beliefs" when trying keto. It's nice, but very challenging to do sustainably if you have dietary limits like that.
- codr7 2y ago
  There are better products. Likely more expensive, but possible.
  - ternnoburn 2y ago
    [dead]
- declan_roberts 2y ago
  Go on craigslist and search for cow, beef, and lamb share. You can go visit the farm and verify the animals are happy, pasture-raised cattle. Our beef came from a cow we can see from our backyard.
  - ternnoburn 2y ago
    [dead]
- dgfitz 2y ago
  [flagged]

Mountain_Skies 2y ago

I used to do a very low carb diet that kept me in ketosis. For the most part it was great but the sleep difference concerned me. At the time my life was structured to where I didn't need to be awake at any particular time so my body would wake up when it had enough sleep instead of when an alarm went off. While I usually sleep seven to eight hours when eating a standard American diet, when on low carb, it would end up being only five to six hours, usually closer to five than six. I'd feel completely rested and fine but most days I'd need to take a short ten to fifteen minute nap, during which I'd quickly fall into REM sleep. When waking up from that nap, I'd feel fine, no post-nap grogginess, but it made me wonder if I was getting shorted on REM sleep during my primary sleep period.

arresin 2y ago
It sounds very primal. Sleeping short times in the cave and then catching a cat nap when you can.

Semaphor 2y ago

> A very weird and pleasant experience, that alas can't be sustained forever given how delicious carbs are. I’ve been doing Keto for over a decade now, with one cheat day a year (Christmas market mulled wine with family). I can guarantee you it can easily[0] be sustained if one is so inclined. OTOH, 6 hours without water sounds neither healthy, nor like something I’d ever want to do. [0]: With the caveat, that your circumstances need to allow it. I’ve been working from home and cook all meals myself.

inglor_cz 2y ago
There are so many caveats to your "guarantee" that it isn't really guaranteeing anything. People are wildly diverse when it comes to food traditions, actual state of intestines and also cravings. What worked for you may not work for a Vietnamese guy who ate rice for 50 years of his life. Extrapolating carelessly from N == 1 is a bad idea.
- Semaphor 2y ago
  You are extrapolating from my message. I disputed can't be sustained. For which a counter example is enough. But I'm not interested in nitpicking phrasing.
dalyons 2y ago
"easily be sustained" - for you maybe. I have done keto for long periods, 4 times in my life, and i find it personally extremely unsustainable. Boring, extremely restricting in social situations, and cuts you off from one of the greatest joys in life - the vast array of food, tastes and experiences available to the modern human existence. Casting wide generalizations from your own personal experience is bad, and unfortunately par for the course in any internet discussion of diet.
- Semaphor 2y ago
  I wrote "can". As opposed to OPs "can’t". Not "is always". I also find it hilarious that you assume I’m cut off from one of the greatest joys in life - the vast array of food, tastes and experiences available to the modern human existence. Talk about generalizing from your experience, eh?

thenayr 2y ago

I was diehard keto for over a year straight. Chronic inflammation that I’ve lived with my entire life disappeared totally after a few weeks. I became pretty dogmatic about the whole thing and eventually my body started to suffer. I don’t believe it to be a long term sustainable diet, at least not at the level i was doing it (sub 20g carbs a day). My blood tests got very worrying towards the latter part of the year and I started to have regular panic attacks and what I can only presume is chronic low blood sugar that ultimately left me feeling pretty lifeless and scared. Anyways just my personal anecdote to remain cautiously optimistic

declan_roberts 2y ago
What did you see in your labs?
123yawaworht456 2y ago
all exclusive diets (vegan/carnivore/keto/etc) are deficient in some vitamins, minerals, and maybe other things (omega-3, specific amino acids, etc). were you using supplements? on keto in particular, a decent multivitamin and some extra vitamin C, magnesium, and potassium are a must.
Modified3019 2y ago
My mistake was I gravitated to eating mostly fatty pork and chicken after a year. Turns out those are very high in omega-6’s. Does not play well with my mental health, skin (exacerbated my pollen allergy related eczema), resulted in starting to regain weight around my stomach despite maintaining a loss of 50 pounds for two years, and becoming cold all the time (yes, my thyroid and calories were fine). After some research on wtf might be going on, I had my suspicions and took an omegaquant test which revealed my circulating phospholipid omega-6 levels were crazy high, just a few percent below their max reference range. Moving to beef only halted my issues after 1-2 months. I like beef and monotony, but even I can’t eat just beef. I now cycle between keto and carbs (mostly potatoes, carrots, onions and glass noodles, sometimes pasta or bread buns). I generally have carbs near workout days. Now that I’ve shed the omega-6 pounds, I have some tolerance again but end up still mostly use beef, eggs, and frozen seafood blends (no fish, which when farmed tends to be high in omega-6). Oh, and if you are looking for a salad dressing that isn’t just flavored vegetable oil (high omega-6), give the “skinny girl” brand a try.

krzat 2y ago

There is a book about effect of keto on the brain: https://www.amazon.com/Brain-Energy-Revolutionary-Understanding-Health/dp/1637741588 https://www.amazon.com/Brain-Energy-Revolutionary-Understand... Not sure how much evidence is for claims, but sounds somewhat reasonable.