4 ms·
I didn't read the entire paper, but what I was really curious to hear about was battery chemistry, and I didn't see much in there (unless I just missed it.) I'v
by jchw 2y ago
I didn't read the entire paper, but what I was really curious to hear about was battery chemistry, and I didn't see much in there (unless I just missed it.) I've been bullish on LiFePO4 because of the ostensible safety benefits, but it would be interesting if anyone has taken a look at the safety risks of different battery chemistries head-to-head.
I don't necessarily think that lithium ion batteries are inherently unsafe, but even if their safety properties are in fact acceptable on a societal level, it's hard to grapple with how horrifically violent battery fires can be. There was a video going around of a battery fire where someone got trapped in an elevator with, apparently, an e-bike battery that went into thermal runaway. It's hard to overstate how utterly mangled their body was. Even as someone who grew up with access to LiveLeak and other things I shouldn't have seen, that video and the decimated (shockingly alive, but not for much longer) corpse pulled out of the elevator will be sticking with me for a long time (and reminding me to not bring potentially sketchy high-capacity batteries onto elevators, for whatever it's worth...)
- Melatonic 2y agoHow large was the elevator ? Scary but I wonder if you had time to react if you could shove the bike to the opposite side and maybe be relatively fine
- MisterTea 2y agoI saw the video. It was a very small car, the kind you would see in a small apartment building - something like 4 feet square or 1.25m square, if even. Basically a closet. Edit: to add it wasn't the whole bike but the battery pack itself. It was in his hand.
- jchw 2y agoPretty small, but I'm not sure if it matters. If any battery starts out-gassing when you're in an elevator, you're probably as good as dead, because the hydrogen fluoride release will quickly cause tremendous damage to you or just flat out kill you; I doubt there's much you can do about it. So I definitely think that the moral of the story is simply never, ever take a large battery onto an elevator Maybe solid state batteries can some day give us more peace of mind.
- moritonal 2y agoThe video shows the entire elevator being engulfed in fire, fumes and light. It was a small lift, but I'd doubt any part of any normal lift would have a safe spot.
- zamadatix 2y agoHere's a NSFL link of what appears to be the video for those wanting to see just how engulfing it was https://streamable.com/y47pm1 https://streamable.com/y47pm1 For those wanting to stick to descriptions: the entire elevator (albeit a smaller one) is goes from normal to completely filled with burning toxic gasses in 2 seconds. If it were a large elevator and a phone battery you could probably escape most of the damage by being at the opposite end and exiting quickly after. With a batter that large though it's a bit of a different story.
- saltcured 2y agoBeing trapped in an enclosed space with something like that, which supplies its own oxidizer and burns very hot, would be a nightmare. It's like wondering if your food can retreat to the safe corner of your oven or BBQ, away from the burner. As stupid kids, my friends and I found an unused emergency road flare and played with it, outside on a sand pile, where we thought it safe. I still managed to get give myself some lung injury from inhaling a shallow breath from the invisible convection gases rising off it about 3 feet above.
- zackify 2y agoYeah lifepo4 will not combust badly. Look up will prose on YouTube he does a lot of tests
- Joel_Mckay 2y agoIndeed, they also can produce toxic smoke... should be in an outdoor pit. =3