4 ms·

(12 months from now) We switched from Astro to SkibidiJS

oliwarner 2y ago
Maybe, but that does that devalue the positive progress today? I understand what you're saying, people framework hop and what's popular does change frequently, but we're not all using Frontpage still, are we? That process of changing to something better (as evidenced by TFA) has value in itself.
- alabhyajindal 2y ago
  Yes there's value in changing to something better. The frequency of change is the real issue here.
  - yen223 2y ago
    When was the last time datocms changed?
    - mat_jack1 2y ago
      The Nextjs site lasted 4 years. Before that we had a Gatsby one: https://github.com/datocms/old-website/ https://github.com/datocms/old-website/
      - yen223 2y ago
        A 4-year lifespan for a marketing website doesn't seem so bad
  - chimen 2y ago
    "better" is just fashion nowadays. There's nothing astro does that NextJs can't. Worked with both and still work with both.
    - marcosdumay 2y ago
      > There's nothing astro does that NextJs can't. That's exactly the Turing tarpit argument.
    - Capricorn2481 2y ago
      It can do SSG while letting you use any framework you want. You don't need to use React. That's a pretty big difference in a thread where people complain about churn. Personally, I don't see Astro as a must have because SSR + Interactivity can be done with a lot of tech. PHP, C#, etc. But it has a lot of sane defaults around markdown and static generation that I can recommend it.
- johnchristopher 2y ago
  > I understand what you're saying, people framework hop and what's popular does change frequently, but we're not all using Frontpage still, are we? yeah, we switched to WordPress. I am glad we didn't follow up on our web agency 5 years ago to switch to gasby. Our wordpress is still running fine. I am glad we are not considering switching to Astro, since wordpress will still be there in 5 years.
  - oliwarner 2y ago
    Will WordPress be there in 5 years? Regardless, it has a cost. It's hard to compound a conversation about cost on the backdrop of agencies. A lifetime ago I worked at agencies that predominantly leaned on WordPress. WP is a complex, dynamic webapp, running 24/7. A long history of security holes both in itself but more in the fleet of community plugins that agencies install by default, and the "one click" hosting software they lean on (cpanel et al) to avoid hiring actual operations teams all cause problems. Deployments are objectively awful and demand scrappy maintenance work over an amount of regular server time. Once a static Astro site is built, that HTML is static and safe, forever. Cloudflare, AWS, Github, and a hundred others will host it for you, for free. Just pay for the domain. We charged clients £100pm+ just for treading water with WP and there wasn't profit in that. WP does allow clients to make changes themselves but in my experience agency clients need brand and graphics support. The cost of updating a website is insignificant to regular graphics work. I can't say what sort of client you are, but we're looking at a cost saving of £6k in five years by not having some underqualified junior babysit a server. The output is better on Astro too. Usually. I'm sure an agency could find a way to make an awful Astro site.
    - ValentineC 2y ago
      > Will WordPress be there in 5 years? Regardless, it has a cost. WordPress will probably be around in 5 years, but I don't think anyone can say that the plugin ecosystem and open source community that WordPress heavily depends on would, especially with what has been going on in the past months.
- 0xblinq 2y ago
  One thing is framework hopping, which one can decide to do or not do. The problem here is that even staying within the same framework it feels like you're changing it every 6 months. Look at Next (pages vs app router) or Remix (now react-router). There's literally zero stability and you need to rewrite everything constantly. The worst part, as it happens at my job, is when you have people newer to the industry that think that if you're not on the latest and coolest then "everything is shit" and they live in this mindset where everything has to be rewritten constantly or otherwise they cannot be happy at work. Fuck your users, your product and everything else. Latest cool trend is the only thing that matters to them.
spyder 2y ago
Or more like: to AIJS, which automatically rewrites your site to the latest trendy framework. :-)
user432678 2y ago
This new stuff is bussing, no cap! Astro is so last year, cringe.
codelikeawolf 2y ago
My brain has been so fried from working in frontend for several years that I actually googled SkibidiJS before I realized it was a joke.

Maybe, but that does that devalue the positive progress today? I understand what you're saying, people framework hop and what's popular does change frequently, but we're not all using Frontpage still, are we? That process of changing to something better (as evidenced by TFA) has value in itself.

alabhyajindal 2y ago
Yes there's value in changing to something better. The frequency of change is the real issue here.
- yen223 2y ago
  When was the last time datocms changed?
  - mat_jack1 2y ago
    The Nextjs site lasted 4 years. Before that we had a Gatsby one: https://github.com/datocms/old-website/ https://github.com/datocms/old-website/
    - yen223 2y ago
      A 4-year lifespan for a marketing website doesn't seem so bad
- chimen 2y ago
  "better" is just fashion nowadays. There's nothing astro does that NextJs can't. Worked with both and still work with both.
  - marcosdumay 2y ago
    > There's nothing astro does that NextJs can't. That's exactly the Turing tarpit argument.
  - Capricorn2481 2y ago
    It can do SSG while letting you use any framework you want. You don't need to use React. That's a pretty big difference in a thread where people complain about churn. Personally, I don't see Astro as a must have because SSR + Interactivity can be done with a lot of tech. PHP, C#, etc. But it has a lot of sane defaults around markdown and static generation that I can recommend it.
johnchristopher 2y ago
> I understand what you're saying, people framework hop and what's popular does change frequently, but we're not all using Frontpage still, are we? yeah, we switched to WordPress. I am glad we didn't follow up on our web agency 5 years ago to switch to gasby. Our wordpress is still running fine. I am glad we are not considering switching to Astro, since wordpress will still be there in 5 years.
- oliwarner 2y ago
  Will WordPress be there in 5 years? Regardless, it has a cost. It's hard to compound a conversation about cost on the backdrop of agencies. A lifetime ago I worked at agencies that predominantly leaned on WordPress. WP is a complex, dynamic webapp, running 24/7. A long history of security holes both in itself but more in the fleet of community plugins that agencies install by default, and the "one click" hosting software they lean on (cpanel et al) to avoid hiring actual operations teams all cause problems. Deployments are objectively awful and demand scrappy maintenance work over an amount of regular server time. Once a static Astro site is built, that HTML is static and safe, forever. Cloudflare, AWS, Github, and a hundred others will host it for you, for free. Just pay for the domain. We charged clients £100pm+ just for treading water with WP and there wasn't profit in that. WP does allow clients to make changes themselves but in my experience agency clients need brand and graphics support. The cost of updating a website is insignificant to regular graphics work. I can't say what sort of client you are, but we're looking at a cost saving of £6k in five years by not having some underqualified junior babysit a server. The output is better on Astro too. Usually. I'm sure an agency could find a way to make an awful Astro site.
  - ValentineC 2y ago
    > Will WordPress be there in 5 years? Regardless, it has a cost. WordPress will probably be around in 5 years, but I don't think anyone can say that the plugin ecosystem and open source community that WordPress heavily depends on would, especially with what has been going on in the past months.
0xblinq 2y ago
One thing is framework hopping, which one can decide to do or not do. The problem here is that even staying within the same framework it feels like you're changing it every 6 months. Look at Next (pages vs app router) or Remix (now react-router). There's literally zero stability and you need to rewrite everything constantly. The worst part, as it happens at my job, is when you have people newer to the industry that think that if you're not on the latest and coolest then "everything is shit" and they live in this mindset where everything has to be rewritten constantly or otherwise they cannot be happy at work. Fuck your users, your product and everything else. Latest cool trend is the only thing that matters to them.

spyder 2y ago

Or more like: to AIJS, which automatically rewrites your site to the latest trendy framework. :-)

user432678 2y ago

This new stuff is bussing, no cap! Astro is so last year, cringe.

codelikeawolf 2y ago

My brain has been so fried from working in frontend for several years that I actually googled SkibidiJS before I realized it was a joke.