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What do you mean by outdated? Companies are already designing chips for their 1.8nm process, in addition to Intel's mid-late 2025 chips switched back to Intel f

What do you mean by outdated? Companies are already designing chips for their 1.8nm process, in addition to Intel's mid-late 2025 chips switched back to Intel fabs, for 6 months from now. TSMC is still working on their 2nm process. The only players in that market are Samsung, TSMC, and Intel. It'd be crazy to let one of the three global EUV lithography manufacturers disappear because their R&D costs have lowered net revenue temporarily. People act like Intel has nothing to offer, when they're one of a low single-digits number of companies who are even capable of making modern microchips. Even China won't likely crack EUV for the next 5 years. Throwing all of the money on pure R&D would be madness. And the chips act is investing in a major R&D facility in upstate NY for next gen stuff anyway. Scrapping their last gen process to focus on 1.8nm was a long term play, and all signs point out to it working out well. Not to mention, it'll be nice to have at least this one US company making modern microchips, in case the many fabless US microchip companies ever need to switch to domestic production, due to economic or geopolitical reasons that are clearly on the short term horizon.

Dalewyn 2y ago
>and all signs point out to it working out well. Intel has always had great "signs" but fell completely apart once the time came for execution. Which is to say, I'll believe it when I see it. I say that as an Intel fanboi, too. If Trump/DOGE comes in and slashes Intel funding one way or another, even better.
- FooBarBizBazz 2y ago
  I was about to write, "yeah, but Intel has good long-term-oriented leadership now in Pat Gelsinger, so while it'll take time, it'll eventually bounce back. Because, under him, it's finally been investing in R&D instead of coasting and doing stock buybacks." And then I Googled (to check the spelling of "Gelsinger"), and found this: https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-is-out.html https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-is-o... https://techcrunch.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-retires/ https://techcrunch.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-re... The man's retiring. Hm. Damn. So who are David Zinsner and Michelle Johnston Holthaus? They seem to be money and product people, not foundry people or architects? I'll need to look more closely, but to my mind this doesn't bode well for the long term. I see that the stock is up 5%, but I don't trust investors to think long-term enough. Investors are also happy when you Boeing the shit out of a company.
  - Dalewyn 2y ago
    That news came out after I wrote my comment, but that vindicates my apprehension towards Intel's ability to execute. Only believe them after they deliver.
  - FooBarBizBazz 2y ago
    I guess this other thread is where additional conversation will be happening: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42296067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42296067
coliveira 2y ago
If you think Intel will fix itself just because it received $8 Billion I have a bridge to sell you.
- verelo 2y ago
  Intel is so fucked it’s not even slightly funny. Anyone who disagrees, do the most basic research possible by reviewing their benchmarks. It’s like going back in time.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 2y ago
    https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks Top 5 in single core performance are Intel chips.
    - Octoth0rpe 2y ago
      Which is not particularly important without the context of price, heat, availability, multicore perf, etc. As a whole, there appear to be better values on most fronts, though necessarily when all is combined in some opinionated way. There are certainly good values to be found in the intel world, but I can't think of a time where they have been so comprehensively challenged.
      - 2OEH8eoCRo0 2y ago
        Maybe. My point was more that it's complicated. For example: I couldn't care less about how much power my desktop uses.
        coliveira 2y ago
        Single desktop chips are becoming a niche market. What matters is mobile and server, and both cases require low power consumption.
    - adrian_b 2y ago

Dalewyn 2y ago

>and all signs point out to it working out well. Intel has always had great "signs" but fell completely apart once the time came for execution. Which is to say, I'll believe it when I see it. I say that as an Intel fanboi, too. If Trump/DOGE comes in and slashes Intel funding one way or another, even better.

FooBarBizBazz 2y ago
I was about to write, "yeah, but Intel has good long-term-oriented leadership now in Pat Gelsinger, so while it'll take time, it'll eventually bounce back. Because, under him, it's finally been investing in R&D instead of coasting and doing stock buybacks." And then I Googled (to check the spelling of "Gelsinger"), and found this: https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-is-out.html https://www.cnbc.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-is-o... https://techcrunch.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-retires/ https://techcrunch.com/2024/12/02/intel-ceo-pat-gelsinger-re... The man's retiring. Hm. Damn. So who are David Zinsner and Michelle Johnston Holthaus? They seem to be money and product people, not foundry people or architects? I'll need to look more closely, but to my mind this doesn't bode well for the long term. I see that the stock is up 5%, but I don't trust investors to think long-term enough. Investors are also happy when you Boeing the shit out of a company.
- Dalewyn 2y ago
  That news came out after I wrote my comment, but that vindicates my apprehension towards Intel's ability to execute. Only believe them after they deliver.
- FooBarBizBazz 2y ago
  I guess this other thread is where additional conversation will be happening: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42296067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42296067

coliveira 2y ago

If you think Intel will fix itself just because it received $8 Billion I have a bridge to sell you.

verelo 2y ago
Intel is so fucked it’s not even slightly funny. Anyone who disagrees, do the most basic research possible by reviewing their benchmarks. It’s like going back in time.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 2y ago
  https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks Top 5 in single core performance are Intel chips.
  - Octoth0rpe 2y ago
    Which is not particularly important without the context of price, heat, availability, multicore perf, etc. As a whole, there appear to be better values on most fronts, though necessarily when all is combined in some opinionated way. There are certainly good values to be found in the intel world, but I can't think of a time where they have been so comprehensively challenged.
    - 2OEH8eoCRo0 2y ago
      Maybe. My point was more that it's complicated. For example: I couldn't care less about how much power my desktop uses.
      - coliveira 2y ago
        Single desktop chips are becoming a niche market. What matters is mobile and server, and both cases require low power consumption.
  - adrian_b 2y ago