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This is why Trump wants to repeal the chip act. A company like Intel should not survive in the free market, and now will be propped up by the government while r

This is why Trump wants to repeal the chip act. A company like Intel should not survive in the free market, and now will be propped up by the government while remaining inefficient.

janalsncm 2y ago
I don’t think the fault line is forming on free vs non-free market. Tariffs aren’t free market either. Both parties have shown some openness to putting their finger on the scale. JD Vance even likes Lena Khan. It’s hard to understand tbh.
Cornbilly 2y ago
Yeah, I believe that coming from the guy that pushed the Foxconn scam deal in Wisconsin.
2c2c2c 2y ago
there's an obvious national security angle to this
energy123 2y ago
This has nothing to do with bailing a company out. Intel, along with every other chip company, do not want to build any chip plants in the US. It makes no business sense for them. But this is bad for the US given that chip making is a critical defense industry. That's why the CHIPS Act exists, to onshore a critical defense industry so that if war breaks out, at least it's secure.
- edflsafoiewq 2y ago
  Why is chip making a critical defense industry?
  - ikiris 2y ago
    Because literally everything modern needs chips.
  - tivert 2y ago
    > Why is chip making a critical defense industry? Go fight a war with 1960s technology against a modern adversary and find out. I'd suggest you do some of your own research to get up to speed, because your question is akin to "why to people need to eat food?"
    - Dalewyn 2y ago
      >Go fight a war with 1960s technology against a modern adversary and find out. Not a great argument considering Afghanistan, Iraq, and Yemen (read: Houthis), and further back Vietnam and North Korea all wrecked the US military one way or nine anothers. The US military has historically fucking sucked at fighting underteched enemies. If we are concerned about national security, I would look into why we can't win wars against bass ackwards goat herders and jungle men instead of silicon that won't even see military applications for at least a few more decades.
      - kcb 2y ago
        Now go look at the casualty ratios in all those wars.
        Dalewyn 2y ago
        Look: If the American casualty count is bigger than zero then we fucking failed, let alone if we outright lose the war too. Why? Because we are supposedly so fucking advanced that we are worried about silicon toys that we don't even use to kill people with. In case you missed the memo: The US Navy admits the Houthis are giving them the hardest time since World War II and they don't even fucking have warships. We spent over two decades in Afghanistan and Iraq to end up losing them. China only has to send weather balloons to draw F-22s out. The pullout from Vietnam is still one of the biggest embarrassments in American history. The moral of picking a fight using 1960s technology is: You will win. End of. Turns out the best way to kill someone is to just fire shit their way and kill them, who knew.
        kcb 2y ago
  - lancesells 2y ago
    Chips are the new oil. They run everything and without them you would be outdroned in the case of a war.
    - edflsafoiewq 2y ago
      Do drones need cutting edge chips? Why are old nodes not enough?
      - lancesells 2y ago
        I have no idea but look at it from the perspective of the US Department of Defense. Also, companies like Google make ~$8B in profit every three months for selling ads. Is it really that crazy they awarded this amount of money to try and have US-made chips? I'm not advocating for war, weapons, defense budgets, etc., but this doesn't seem like a bad thing if it's providing jobs and chip alternatives for the US and the world. It seems like Taiwan is going to cease being independent at some point.
someothherguyy 2y ago
No, it isn't. Trump says he wants to repeal the CHIPS Act because it makes for a good a partisan talking point: https://www.cnbc.com/2024/11/07/trump-likely-to-uphold-chips-act-despite-his-campaign-rhetoric-experts-say.html https://www.cnbc.com/2024/11/07/trump-likely-to-uphold-chips... Bernie Sanders on the other hand: https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/news-sanders-opposes-all-blank-checks-to-chip-companies/ https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/news-sanders-o...
hindsightbias 2y ago
If they repeal it, they’ll just rename it the Trump Strong Chips Act and it will be the greatest thing ever.
high_na_euv 2y ago
Free market does not exist. Especially in semiconductor industry, its history is full of subsidies

This is why Trump wants to repeal the chip act. A company like Intel should not survive in the free market, and now will be propped up by the government while remaining inefficient.

janalsncm 2y ago

I don’t think the fault line is forming on free vs non-free market. Tariffs aren’t free market either. Both parties have shown some openness to putting their finger on the scale. JD Vance even likes Lena Khan. It’s hard to understand tbh.

Cornbilly 2y ago

Yeah, I believe that coming from the guy that pushed the Foxconn scam deal in Wisconsin.

2c2c2c 2y ago

there's an obvious national security angle to this

energy123 2y ago

This has nothing to do with bailing a company out. Intel, along with every other chip company, do not want to build any chip plants in the US. It makes no business sense for them. But this is bad for the US given that chip making is a critical defense industry. That's why the CHIPS Act exists, to onshore a critical defense industry so that if war breaks out, at least it's secure.

edflsafoiewq 2y ago
Why is chip making a critical defense industry?
- ikiris 2y ago
  Because literally everything modern needs chips.
- tivert 2y ago
  > Why is chip making a critical defense industry? Go fight a war with 1960s technology against a modern adversary and find out. I'd suggest you do some of your own research to get up to speed, because your question is akin to "why to people need to eat food?"
  - Dalewyn 2y ago
    >Go fight a war with 1960s technology against a modern adversary and find out. Not a great argument considering Afghanistan, Iraq, and Yemen (read: Houthis), and further back Vietnam and North Korea all wrecked the US military one way or nine anothers. The US military has historically fucking sucked at fighting underteched enemies. If we are concerned about national security, I would look into why we can't win wars against bass ackwards goat herders and jungle men instead of silicon that won't even see military applications for at least a few more decades.
    - kcb 2y ago
      Now go look at the casualty ratios in all those wars.
      - Dalewyn 2y ago
        Look: If the American casualty count is bigger than zero then we fucking failed, let alone if we outright lose the war too. Why? Because we are supposedly so fucking advanced that we are worried about silicon toys that we don't even use to kill people with. In case you missed the memo: The US Navy admits the Houthis are giving them the hardest time since World War II and they don't even fucking have warships. We spent over two decades in Afghanistan and Iraq to end up losing them. China only has to send weather balloons to draw F-22s out. The pullout from Vietnam is still one of the biggest embarrassments in American history. The moral of picking a fight using 1960s technology is: You will win. End of. Turns out the best way to kill someone is to just fire shit their way and kill them, who knew.
        kcb 2y ago
- lancesells 2y ago
  Chips are the new oil. They run everything and without them you would be outdroned in the case of a war.
  - edflsafoiewq 2y ago
    Do drones need cutting edge chips? Why are old nodes not enough?
    - lancesells 2y ago
      I have no idea but look at it from the perspective of the US Department of Defense. Also, companies like Google make ~$8B in profit every three months for selling ads. Is it really that crazy they awarded this amount of money to try and have US-made chips? I'm not advocating for war, weapons, defense budgets, etc., but this doesn't seem like a bad thing if it's providing jobs and chip alternatives for the US and the world. It seems like Taiwan is going to cease being independent at some point.

someothherguyy 2y ago

No, it isn't. Trump says he wants to repeal the CHIPS Act because it makes for a good a partisan talking point: https://www.cnbc.com/2024/11/07/trump-likely-to-uphold-chips-act-despite-his-campaign-rhetoric-experts-say.html https://www.cnbc.com/2024/11/07/trump-likely-to-uphold-chips... Bernie Sanders on the other hand: https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/news-sanders-opposes-all-blank-checks-to-chip-companies/ https://www.sanders.senate.gov/press-releases/news-sanders-o...

hindsightbias 2y ago

If they repeal it, they’ll just rename it the Trump Strong Chips Act and it will be the greatest thing ever.

high_na_euv 2y ago

Free market does not exist. Especially in semiconductor industry, its history is full of subsidies