7 ms·
A washing machine for human beings, from 1970
- SoftTalker 2y agoHow many hundreds of gallons of water for a bath, then? I didn't see that in the story.
- do_not_redeem 2y agoIf it works anything like a modern dishwasher, it would use less water than a normal bath or shower.
- iancmceachern 2y agoBut if it worked that way (using a small amount of water over and over to clean) would be gross and unsanitary in this case. One could filter it but that costs a lot of energy and changing a filter weekly on your shower pod would not be very green.
- _ZeD_ 2y agoit's not unsanitary on your plates, why should it be on your skin?
- sitharus 2y agoYour plates can be washed with temperatures that would scald you and with chemicals that dissolve your skin. But you don’t want to sanitise your skin, just get the dirt off, so I don’t see any real issues.
- ashoeafoot 2y agoAnd your colon lining if not washed away thoroughly
- iancmceachern 2y agoThe issue is that water would be so dirty and gross. The same water that washed your rear end will then be sprayed on your face. If you are only using a few gallons (not like a bath which has dozens) that's pretty gnarly.
- eru 2y ago> But if it worked that way (using a small amount of water over and over to clean) would be gross and unsanitary in this case. Have you ever taken a bath?
- iancmceachern 2y agoYes. Imagine bath water but with the same amount of dirt that would be in 50 gallons in a bath in 5 gallons in this thing. It would be 10x grosser.
- eru 2y agoWhat kind of crazy big baths are you taking?
- iancmceachern 2y agoIf you google "average bath size" you find 30-70 gallons. 50 is right in the middle.
- eru 2y agoI suspect those numbers are for filling the tub to the brim? Is that normal?
- iancmceachern 2y agoAre you a manager? It seems like you can answer these questions for yourself rather than asking a stranger on the internet. Let us know what you find.
- eru 2y agoThis was a polite way of me telling you that I don't think that's normal, and that quoting the bathtub max capacity is fairly meaningless.
- SoftTalker 2y agoIt looks like it completely fills and drains that big chamber at least a couple of times. If it were just a sprayer mechanism yeah that could be somewhat water-efficient.
- ExoticPearTree 2y agoIt doesn’t matter. Really doesn’t. We are talking about a device from 50 years ago where concerns were wildly different than the ones today. Water was cheap and plentiful.
- seeknotfind 2y agoAs someone reading this while taking a shower, I'm questioning how this could be redesigned to work today. How are you supposed to use your phone if your head is sticking out?
- do_not_redeem 2y agoMount the phone on the top in front of your head. Every day alternate which arm you wash, and which one you scroll with.
- fluorinerocket 2y agoHow are you browsing HN in the shower?
- Brajeshwar 2y agoI’d instead like to ask why! “Why is Gamora?”
- readyplayernull 2y agoBeware of the LED! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42259278 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42259278
- eru 2y agoYou have nothing to fear, if you are recording anyway.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- drivingmenuts 2y agoI can see why this didn't catch on, but on the other hand, I kinda want one.
- rawgabbit 2y agoYou are in luck. If you attend the Osaka Expo next year. You can see the updated version. https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/15482351 https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/15482351
- ndjdjddjsjj 2y agoOk im sold
- veunes 2y ago15 minutes and no hair-washing
- thestuntman 2y ago[flagged]
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- freediver 2y agoTruly remarkable creative thinking in a way that does not exist today. This was a year after humans landed on the Moon, and I can understand the inspiration that drove the 70s.
- markus_zhang 2y agoReminds me the early periods of personal computers.
- quitit 2y agoI don’t think we’ve lost the willingness to test products that push human/mechanical boundaries. I think rather it is about not retreading on the learned boundaries that we’ve already established or “solved”. So now we see concepts that test different kinds of human/machine integration. Such as worn AI devices, headsets, and the future idea of brain chips. As for automatic washers: The idea isn’t totally gone - enclosed automated pet washers are around. (Despite being clearly terrifying for some pets.)
- veunes 2y agoIt’s interesting to consider how our priorities have shifted
- makeitdouble 2y agowe have actual adaptive beds that auto adjust your position, firmness, temperature and fully monitor your sleep to improve it. But they sure don't have a funky 70s style design, perhaps that's the part that's missing for most people ?
- csomar 2y agoJust look at the old design/production and the new one. Japan has simply regressed in design and manufacturing. I'll not pretend that I know why, and I don't think anybody does. But they had a nice run during which they got "dreamy" about the future and then... the bubble burst. Here hoping that China gives us another run since the US of A has decided the take the back seat, financialize everything and put MBA/Bureaucrats in every corner of the process.
- latkin 2y agoIt's the robot bath from Roujin Z, but in real life https://youtu.be/X5i0JU_NsZU?t=464 https://youtu.be/X5i0JU_NsZU?t=464
- totetsu 2y agoYes, that and the start of the 1999 Chinese film shower https://youtu.be/pxeOQVBLcvM?si=_g0_cHz4LPliGuMR&t=59 https://youtu.be/pxeOQVBLcvM?si=_g0_cHz4LPliGuMR&t=59
- Brajeshwar 2y agoThis should have multiple stepper sizes, and I will use the kids' settings regularly for my kids. Yes, I know the security concerns, and I will watch them, talk to them, or read a book while they are being washed.
- Animats 2y agoReminds me of my high school, where the gym showers were a car-wash arrangement, a corridor of sprays through which all the guys were herded nude after gym class.
- peterpost2 2y agoOh wow, where was this? If I would have to guess Soviet Russia?
- SoftTalker 2y agoAt my high school it was a large tiled room with stainless steel columns in the middle. Each column had 6 showerheads around the top. Basically no matter which way you stood, it was full monty exposure to/from almost everyone else in the room.
- jandrese 2y ago> After five minutes of that, the machine would then fill the chamber with hot water for a three-minute ultrasonic bath. This was followed by a two-minute hot rinse cycle. Next, the chamber would drain and the user was blasted with warm air to dry off. They were additionally exposed to both infrared and ultraviolet light to kill germs. All in all, it was a 15-minute cycle. It's apparently also a tanning booth. 15 minutes means it takes about 3 times longer than a shower, and it doesn't seem to do your hair.
- maronato 2y agoAnd uses orders of magnitude more water
- TeMPOraL 2y agoIs that a problem though? The other day I got a whole lecture on HN, complete with math, proving that keeping the water running entire time while showering isn't meaningfully wasteful... I still can't believe it on an emotional level, but the math checks out...
- MrDrMcCoy 2y agoLink?
- distances 2y agoWas that about water, or about energy spent on heating the water? My gut feeling is that keeping the water running would roughly double the amount of water, so double the energy.
- eru 2y agoYes, unless you take cold showers.
- bayindirh 2y agoA nominal water aerator limits water around 5L-6L/min levels. For every minute I don't use the water, I spend approximately two full kettles of water. With every 5L of water I can - Cook 4 servings (~400 grams) of pasta. - Brew 5L of tea/coffee - Water all the plants at home two times. - Possibly wash most of my handwash-only dishes in one go. - etc. So it's not not meaningfully wasteful. However, I can't turn off the water in the winter, because I feel very cold otherwise. However, this doesn't mean I don't waste any water or happy about what I'm doing. My only (half) relief is this water is somehow processed and reused by city for other needs, at least one more time.
- aitchnyu 2y agoWhat does the ultrasound do?
- gregschlom 2y agoOn solid objects at least (like jewelry) it dislodges particles of grime / dirt. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_cleaning https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_cleaning. No idea if this also works on soft tissue. Edit: the Wikipedia page above says "the ultrasonic action is relatively benign to living tissue but can cause discomfort and skin irritation.". So maybe it was just a gimmick. Ultrasound cleaning was fairly new at the time, so maybe it sounded modern.
- at_a_remove 2y agoOh, ultrasonics can definitely harm flesh if focused. Yes, I am the guy who tested it with a room humidifier. I knew it would hurt, I did it anyway.
- BlueUmarell 2y agoThanks for your contribution to science. On a related topic, I guess there are more than 1 person that tried looking directly into a laser, though. And multiple times.
- aaron695 2y ago[dead]
- wyclif 2y agoBefore I clicked through, I was hoping this was going to be about right-to-repair washing machines for clothing.
- veunes 2y agoInstead, it’s a quirky look at the technological optimism of the '70s
- shiroiushi 2y agoYep, a time when things were getting generally better, not worse.
- bowsamic 2y agoDo we have to complain about the title of every single post here?
- dtgriscom 2y agoI thought it would be about clothes washing machines, but designed to be easily used by people.
- mdtrooper 2y agoAnd the hair?
- veunes 2y agoI think that's the reason why it didn’t catch on
- alejohausner 2y agoThat’s very funny. Good one.
- veunes 2y agoIt makes me wonder about maintenance and how users felt about being "washed" in such a detached, mechanical way...
- t-3 2y agoI mean, washing isn't some kind of profoundly enjoyable experience, is it? The soaking in hot water is what feels good, and this lets you do that without any of the annoying scrubbing and such.
- bargle0 2y agoI think the application for this is to return some dignity and independence to people who have physical trouble washing themselves. Of course the form factor of the 1970 prototype wouldn’t do that, but that can be fixed.
- maronato 2y agoIt fills with (hot) water up to the neck, which feels like a huge risk for unattended disabled people
- skynet97 2y ago[flagged]
- gsck 2y agoMust be a sad world living in a state of permanent victim hood
- maronato 2y agoYou’re right, and I’m sorry for not being more specific. I was thinking of people who have trouble washing themselves, since that’s what GP was talking about. I’ll be more mindful of the diversity of disabilities in the future.
- spondylosaurus 2y agoThere was a similar (contemporary?) Japanese model shared on here a few days ago, which was basically the same sans ladder. As long as there's nothing to stumble over on your way in, and it's not too hard to get situated in the chair, one of those would be amazing for people with mobility issues. There was a New Yorker short story I read years ago about an elderly woman in a nursing home, and this wasn't the point of the story at all, but the main thing I remember is how the woman wanted to live with her daughter until her daughter pointed out that assisted/accessible bathing would be impossible in the daughter's tiny apartment shower.
- skynet97 2y ago
- TeMPOraL 2y agoAh, those beautiful times when people actually cared and believed the future will be better. I guess this is where Star Trek got the idea of "sonic showers" from?
- vasco 2y ago> Ah, those beautiful times when people actually cared and believed the future will be better Thinking the future will be worse with all the available evidence is of a huge ego. How main character you have to be to think that it's just as you're alive that a trend of millenia will inverse.
- smackay 2y agoTechnologists' very existence is based on the idea of improvement, and, as a result, making the lives of others better. Compared to other approaches, nothing has delivered quite on the same scale, though it's not without its costs.
- vasco 2y agoYep, and there's no stopping technological progress. Whoever thinks things will get worse is just being what internet investing lingo calls "gay bears" - waiting for the doom that can justify their constant state of depression and existential dread. In fact people will get upset if you don't agree with them that the world is going to shit (and prove they are smart by predicting it).
- js8 2y agoI am not sure about this, but it depends on definition of "technologist". Is Gates or Musk a "technologist"? I think that social democratic movement in 20th century, and also Chinese communist government, made many people's lives better, by improving their material conditions. It often involved technology, true, but the technology is not much if it's not applied en masse. (Communist government of my home country, Czechoslovakia, had famously huge success in eradicating polio.) And I am not convinced that free market dispersal of technology is more efficient in providing it en masse than government-directed dispersal. For a striking example, watch the ending of "scientific horror story" from Angela Collier: https://youtu.be/zS7sJJB7BUI?si=rrBJPb6bHASNrPEY&t=2991 https://youtu.be/zS7sJJB7BUI?si=rrBJPb6bHASNrPEY&t=2991
- skalarproduktr 2y agoCame here with the idea of this being about how someone made terrible pre-1970 washing machine UX into something much better. Can’t say I’m disappointed though! I’m wondering if cleaning-intensity ultrasound could cause issues for humans?
- qball 2y ago>cleaning-intensity ultrasound could cause issues for humans? Apart from it being loud as fuck? (They say it's ultrasonic, but there's some harmonic around 15,000 Hz that they all exhibit for some reason- both the bucket cleaners and the plaque picks at the dentist's office- and if you can still hear that frequency it is quite unpleasant.) Most of the cleaning action of this thing is just mechanically being sprayed; I think they threw the ultrasonic cleaning action in just because they could. I'm sure it makes you feel cleaner though.
- ginko 2y agoBack in high school lab I remember we were told not to put our hands into ultrasonic cleaners because it messes with your bones or joints or something like that. Was that just bullshit?
- sneak 2y agoBefore I clicked, I thought it was going to be a washing machine with a three position knob that says “hot wash, cold wash, off”. modern washing machine UI is terrible.
- eru 2y agoOur Miele washing machine isn't too bed, if you ever had even a brief look at the manual. The main annoyance I can find is that it's overly cautious about when it lets you open the door. I guess they take mild annoyance and waiting for the user, over Miele being responsible for major water spills.
- ndjdjddjsjj 2y agoOn/off would do! Just make delicate 30C all the things. If you need sterilization, use a powder that does that.
- sneak 2y ago30C is a bad choice for colors/dyed fabrics. Cold wash is important.
- ndjdjddjsjj 2y agoNever done cold and been OK, but anything I care enough I would take to a professional dry cleaner anyway.
- 71bw 2y ago...I wash everything on a 40*C program designed for cotton fabrics and have never had an issue with anything. Even better, been complemented by a family member recently that they have never seen a wool blanket be washed this well... lol
- Freak_NL 2y agoThe future of the past looked so much more interesting. Not practical, but certainly interesting. I'm curious why the author of this piece decided to use the gender neutral pronoun for the women who modelled this odd machine. They wrote: > The demonstration model would climb into the six-foot-tall machine via ladder, then enter the chamber, with their head sticking out of the top. They'd set the water temperature, then the machine would start spraying them with jets of warm water, like the pre-wash cycle at a car wash. These models were all women. This was the 1970s, and the photos support the reasonable assumption that this was not a demonstration where male models were used. Using gender neutral pronouns is sensible in many cases — I didn't go as far as to look into the author's biography for example, so I refer to them as they for the nonce — but is doing so when the gender is known (and possibly relevant given the social context of that time) now on the rise, or is this just hypercorrection?
- makeitdouble 2y ago> gender neutral pronoun I can't speak for the author, but it can just be easier to just go for a more impersonal tone. At no point do you need to keep in my the gender of the people and the writing is a lot clearer (the models being women has no impact on the subject, which is the machine, so it's noise in this case)
- Freak_NL 2y ago> the models being women has no impact on the subject It's part of the context; design doesn't exist in isolation. Was this prototype aimed at women? Was it just sexism or its off-shoot 'sex sells'? Or were there actually male models, but the author isn't mentioning it? I would also argue that explicitly ignoring the fact that these models were women amounts to erasure, which is probably not intended, but a consequence of doing this.
- makeitdouble 2y agoIf we get back to how it was originally presented: https://www.expo70-park.jp/cause/expo/sanyo/ https://www.expo70-park.jp/cause/expo/sanyo/ It was part of a world expo, and from the text we can see it was set as a futuristic vision targeted at anyone that could use the apparatus. The official description also has no focus on the models or who it should be used for in any specific detail. I get your point on the models all being women, but as that has more to do to the period than the machine itself, it isn't remarkable in itself. It would be like commenting on the show guides being sexy women when discussing Mercedes' prototype at 90s cars. Pointing at the sexism and gender gap doesn't help the subject.
- raffraffraff 2y agoTIL Panasonic bought Sanyo in 2009. We had a lot of Sanyo stuff when I was a kid, presumably because it was cheaper :/
- riiii 2y agoI'm pretty sure if the automatic mixer/heat adjustment on the shower were to be invented today it would be a subscription add-on.
- rkagerer 2y agoAnd it would interrupt the cycle every few minutes with an ad.
- ndjdjddjsjj 2y agoAnd their public mongodb hacked into 6 months later causing the company to go bust 12 months later. 18 months later there is a Github project that impersonates the server as a workaround.
- mikro2nd 2y agoI'm disappointed. Where's the ashtray?
- standardUser 2y agoI for one like the voyeuristic/exhibitionist aspect of all of these devices.
- hhhAndrew 2y agoThis thing would be a nightmare to clean. If you have ever had a jetted bath you will know what I mean.
- mikeweiss 2y agoMy question is why don't we have self cleaning bathrooms yet. Imagine a starbucks restroom that cleans it's self every few hours or so.
- krapp 2y agoPaying someone with a mop and broom minimum wage to clean the bathrooms and everything else is always going to be more cost effective. You aren't making money on customers or employees using the toilet so there's no incentive for investment beyond the bare minimum. Businesses wouldn't have bathrooms at all if it were legal.
- ponderings 2y agoI went to the toilet in a very understaffed kfc and it was so dirty that I will never eat there again. The kitchen cant possibly be any better than the restroom.
- ponderings 2y agoI think you can just buy them in japan. I've had this vision where we create a niche in a building for restroom placement by fork lift. For the low end ones the interior can be 3d printed melted down and recycled. They can be pressure washed with high pressure steam. For the high end ones you can have the marble finish with gold trimmings then when it tickles your fancy have it replaced with a different color marble, different light and different ornaments. You can do various lease formulas where you get to enjoy the fancy designs until you [need to] downgrade to the economy version. That formula could also allow exotic designs that wouldn't sell as permanent installations. You could have a different marvel character theme every week/month while you wait for the steam punk and Victorian units to become available. Star wars, startrek etc. I mean, you wouldn't want a ycombinator themed restroom permanently but for a week or~so it would be hilarious. https://google.com/search?q=themed+restroom&udm=2 https://google.com/search?q=themed+restroom&udm=2
- solatic 2y agoThey exist: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanisette https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanisette
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- kazinator 2y agoWords from the second image: マッサージボール massage balls 回転いす kaiten isu rotating seat 排水 haisui drainage/wastewater 石けんすい sekkensui soapy water 超音波 chōonpa ultrasound/ultrasonic waves 温風 onpū hot air 湯 yu hot water I have acquired blurry kanji reading superpowers.
- tomcam 2y agoI have a severely handicapped adult son and would very much like one of these. I ended up having one of those sit-down tubs for senior citizens installed for a mere $17,000 but this would be better. Have to admit I don’t love handwashing him.