6 ms·

Rust: Tools (early access edition)

59 points by gus_leonel 2y ago

nixpulvis 2y ago
ngl, the prose around the hello world example at the start really turned me off to this $35 resource.
- wk_end 2y ago
  Could you elaborate a little bit? I also don't quite like it, although I'm not sure if it's for the same reasons as you. It's nothing so bad that I'd go out of my way to comment that it "really turned me off", so I'm curious what others think. (In my case: it seems a little paid-by-the-word - the writer kind of goes around in circles, philosophizing and pontificating and asking rhetorical questions a bit too much.)
  - nixpulvis 2y ago
    Hard to put a finger on, but it feels like they are trying to be clever, but forgot the clever part. I don't like being tricked while I read unless it challenges my thinking. I'm sorry if this is overly critical.
written-beyond 2y ago
Can you please give regional pricing to SEA? It really helps with providing access to a larger audience!
- Arcuru 2y ago
  I’m not the author but which SEA are you referring to? Southeast Asia? Southeast Africa? I assume you’re not talking about Seattle. It’s important to be specific when you’re trying to localize things. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_(disambiguation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_(disambiguation)
  - written-beyond 2y ago
    Well according to steam it's South East Asia
alexpetros 2y ago
I'm sorry to be a little rude, but the AI-generated cover (the left crab is missing an eye, for starters) is a negative quality indicator. If you weren't willing to take the time to put together a thoughtful cover, why should readers expect the book's content to be assembled any more carefully?
- 0x696C6961 2y ago
  I love how the top comment is a guy literally judging a book by it's cover.
  - nkrisc 2y ago
    It is pretty amusing, but I actually have to agree. Unless your book is about generative AI, using it for the cover makes me question the effort put into the rest of the book - which is really unfortunate if the author did in fact put a lot of effort into their book! Yes, don’t judge a book by its cover - but lots of people do anyway.
    - 0x696C6961 2y ago
      Oh please. Don't pretend like this has anything to do with "effort". If the book cover was some generic stock image you wouldn't even blink.
      - nkrisc 2y ago
        If it was a particularly bad stock image, I would. The only reason I even noticed here is because the image is bizarre and uncanny if you look at it for even a moment. If the AI produced something indistinguishable from a good stock photo, then no, I would probably not have noticed. But it didn’t, and they still put it on top of their hard work. If the AI image sucks, don’t use it!
    - thanksgiving 2y ago
      Don't judge a book by the cover is an advice for us, the readers. It is NOT an advice for the writers or the marketing department. a tasteful public domain image of a crab or something like hundreds of years old but then detailed enough kind of like one of those O'Reilly's books and then make the whole cover white with some text that stands out... It has all been done before and I anal but I doubt O'Reilly's can copyright or trademark that design feeling. Edit: unless the authors are trying to crowd source the proof reading and peer review by releasing an early access copy? This cover draws attention from the average reader who is drawn to comment about the book because there is something to criticize? Maybe this is some kind of advanced 3D chess?
joshdavham 2y ago
Congrats on the new book! Also some minor feedback: I know you're not supposed to judge a book by its cover, but obviously generated AI images give a lot of people 'the ick' so I'd recommend changing the cover (or modifying it).
IshKebab 2y ago
> This is amusingly known as bebugging I have never heard of this (though Wikipedia does say it was called that in the 70s). I think this would actually be called "mutation testing".
lionkor 2y ago
The samples are interesting, I wouldn't buy it (I just did the first few chapters of the rust book instead), but it seems cool. Get rid of the cover tho.
PeterWhittaker 2y ago
Hmm, hard to read on mobile (in portrait), had to zoom in a bit (but then text went out the window, so it was a bit of a balancing act)... ...so I rotate my phone. DON'T DO THAT! I'm directing that at both HN readers (you're welcome) and at the web author/admin (dude, TF?): a sudden explosion of additional content that I could not find a way to dismiss, when all I wanted to do was see the excerpts properly. Seconding other comments re the poor quality crab, when your presentation is that poorly thought out and your prose that amateurish, it makes me want to save even more and dismiss this from my mind. So thank you? I think?
bitbasher 2y ago
I know this is just an early access, but it seems very underwhelming from the sample. This is all very basic Rust and the $35 price tag is not for an entry level book. You can literally read The Rust Book for free and it's more detailed.
- sshine 2y ago
  Yes, I'm also curious about who the audience is. I hold monthly Rust hack nights, and occasionally the theme is beginner-friendly. I usually point them to Rustlings, and participants are having a great time. For teaching a class in Rust, I'd prefer a free book. The Rust Book currently advertises an experimental fork of the book: https://rust-book.cs.brown.edu/ https://rust-book.cs.brown.edu/ It features some opt-in anonymised datamining for improving the book. What more am I getting for $35 than Rustlings and Rust Book?
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
sshine 2y ago
So... why should I buy a $35 introductory programming book in 2024? Here are some free introductory Rust books: - The Rust Book: https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/ - Rust 101: https://www.ralfj.de/projects/rust-101/main.html - Rust by Example: https://doc.rust-lang.org/rust-by-example/ - Easy Rust: https://dhghomon.github.io/easy_rust/ - A Gentle Introduction to Rust: https://stevedonovan.github.io/rust-gentle-intro/ Although I typically show people Rustlings, because it teaches programming workflow. What am I getting for $35 that isn't covered excellently for free already? Here are some books I spent money on in the last 5 years: - Functional Design and Architecture, by Alexander Granin - Production Haskell, by Matt Parsons - Thinking with Types, by Sandy Maguire Being a seasoned developer, I would pay money for someone to fast-forward me through advanced concepts. Here are some examples of free Rust books covering advanced examples: - The Rustonomicon: https://doc.rust-lang.org/nightly/nomicon/ - Rust Design Patterns: https://rust-unofficial.github.io/patterns/ - Effective Rust: https://www.lurklurk.org/effective-rust/ - Rust Atomics and Locks: https://marabos.nl/atomics/foreword.html - The Little Book of Rust Macros: https://danielkeep.github.io/tlborm/book/index.html - Burn: Deep Learning Framework: https://burn.dev/burn-book/ - API Development with Rust: https://rust-api.dev/docs/front-matter/preface/ - Rust Compiler Development Guide: https://rustc-dev-guide.rust-lang.org/getting-started.html I'd pay money for any of those. Not sure about an introductory book, considering the availability of good, free books.
- tejinderss 2y ago
  > Here are some books I spent money on in the last 5 years Would you recommend these books?
  - sshine 2y ago
    They are great in each their way, but they're niche. Production Haskell is for people who want to take their academic Haskell and turn it commercial. There's a lot of practical advice, both coding and non-coding. Thinking with Types is a very good introduction to type-driven , but the later chapters assume very strong type systems (type-level functions, higher-kinded types, etc.) so you may not be able to apply this kind of modelling outside of Haskell, PureScript, Idris, LEAN, etc. The book that translates best into any environment is Granin's Functional Architecture. I can warmly recommend that one even if you're not venturing into FP as a whole. I can't compare it to a whole lot of other software architecture books, though.

59 points by gus_leonel 2y ago

nixpulvis 2y ago

ngl, the prose around the hello world example at the start really turned me off to this $35 resource.

wk_end 2y ago
Could you elaborate a little bit? I also don't quite like it, although I'm not sure if it's for the same reasons as you. It's nothing so bad that I'd go out of my way to comment that it "really turned me off", so I'm curious what others think. (In my case: it seems a little paid-by-the-word - the writer kind of goes around in circles, philosophizing and pontificating and asking rhetorical questions a bit too much.)
- nixpulvis 2y ago
  Hard to put a finger on, but it feels like they are trying to be clever, but forgot the clever part. I don't like being tricked while I read unless it challenges my thinking. I'm sorry if this is overly critical.

written-beyond 2y ago

Can you please give regional pricing to SEA? It really helps with providing access to a larger audience!

Arcuru 2y ago
I’m not the author but which SEA are you referring to? Southeast Asia? Southeast Africa? I assume you’re not talking about Seattle. It’s important to be specific when you’re trying to localize things. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_(disambiguation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_(disambiguation)
- written-beyond 2y ago
  Well according to steam it's South East Asia

alexpetros 2y ago

I'm sorry to be a little rude, but the AI-generated cover (the left crab is missing an eye, for starters) is a negative quality indicator. If you weren't willing to take the time to put together a thoughtful cover, why should readers expect the book's content to be assembled any more carefully?

0x696C6961 2y ago
I love how the top comment is a guy literally judging a book by it's cover.
- nkrisc 2y ago
  It is pretty amusing, but I actually have to agree. Unless your book is about generative AI, using it for the cover makes me question the effort put into the rest of the book - which is really unfortunate if the author did in fact put a lot of effort into their book! Yes, don’t judge a book by its cover - but lots of people do anyway.
  - 0x696C6961 2y ago
    Oh please. Don't pretend like this has anything to do with "effort". If the book cover was some generic stock image you wouldn't even blink.
    - nkrisc 2y ago
      If it was a particularly bad stock image, I would. The only reason I even noticed here is because the image is bizarre and uncanny if you look at it for even a moment. If the AI produced something indistinguishable from a good stock photo, then no, I would probably not have noticed. But it didn’t, and they still put it on top of their hard work. If the AI image sucks, don’t use it!
  - thanksgiving 2y ago
    Don't judge a book by the cover is an advice for us, the readers. It is NOT an advice for the writers or the marketing department. a tasteful public domain image of a crab or something like hundreds of years old but then detailed enough kind of like one of those O'Reilly's books and then make the whole cover white with some text that stands out... It has all been done before and I anal but I doubt O'Reilly's can copyright or trademark that design feeling. Edit: unless the authors are trying to crowd source the proof reading and peer review by releasing an early access copy? This cover draws attention from the average reader who is drawn to comment about the book because there is something to criticize? Maybe this is some kind of advanced 3D chess?

joshdavham 2y ago

Congrats on the new book! Also some minor feedback: I know you're not supposed to judge a book by its cover, but obviously generated AI images give a lot of people 'the ick' so I'd recommend changing the cover (or modifying it).

IshKebab 2y ago

> This is amusingly known as bebugging I have never heard of this (though Wikipedia does say it was called that in the 70s). I think this would actually be called "mutation testing".

lionkor 2y ago

The samples are interesting, I wouldn't buy it (I just did the first few chapters of the rust book instead), but it seems cool. Get rid of the cover tho.

PeterWhittaker 2y ago

Hmm, hard to read on mobile (in portrait), had to zoom in a bit (but then text went out the window, so it was a bit of a balancing act)... ...so I rotate my phone. DON'T DO THAT! I'm directing that at both HN readers (you're welcome) and at the web author/admin (dude, TF?): a sudden explosion of additional content that I could not find a way to dismiss, when all I wanted to do was see the excerpts properly. Seconding other comments re the poor quality crab, when your presentation is that poorly thought out and your prose that amateurish, it makes me want to save even more and dismiss this from my mind. So thank you? I think?

bitbasher 2y ago

I know this is just an early access, but it seems very underwhelming from the sample. This is all very basic Rust and the $35 price tag is not for an entry level book. You can literally read The Rust Book for free and it's more detailed.

sshine 2y ago
Yes, I'm also curious about who the audience is. I hold monthly Rust hack nights, and occasionally the theme is beginner-friendly. I usually point them to Rustlings, and participants are having a great time. For teaching a class in Rust, I'd prefer a free book. The Rust Book currently advertises an experimental fork of the book: https://rust-book.cs.brown.edu/ https://rust-book.cs.brown.edu/ It features some opt-in anonymised datamining for improving the book. What more am I getting for $35 than Rustlings and Rust Book?

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

sshine 2y ago

So... why should I buy a $35 introductory programming book in 2024? Here are some free introductory Rust books: - The Rust Book: https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/ - Rust 101: https://www.ralfj.de/projects/rust-101/main.html - Rust by Example: https://doc.rust-lang.org/rust-by-example/ - Easy Rust: https://dhghomon.github.io/easy_rust/ - A Gentle Introduction to Rust: https://stevedonovan.github.io/rust-gentle-intro/ Although I typically show people Rustlings, because it teaches programming workflow. What am I getting for $35 that isn't covered excellently for free already? Here are some books I spent money on in the last 5 years: - Functional Design and Architecture, by Alexander Granin - Production Haskell, by Matt Parsons - Thinking with Types, by Sandy Maguire Being a seasoned developer, I would pay money for someone to fast-forward me through advanced concepts. Here are some examples of free Rust books covering advanced examples: - The Rustonomicon: https://doc.rust-lang.org/nightly/nomicon/ - Rust Design Patterns: https://rust-unofficial.github.io/patterns/ - Effective Rust: https://www.lurklurk.org/effective-rust/ - Rust Atomics and Locks: https://marabos.nl/atomics/foreword.html - The Little Book of Rust Macros: https://danielkeep.github.io/tlborm/book/index.html - Burn: Deep Learning Framework: https://burn.dev/burn-book/ - API Development with Rust: https://rust-api.dev/docs/front-matter/preface/ - Rust Compiler Development Guide: https://rustc-dev-guide.rust-lang.org/getting-started.html I'd pay money for any of those. Not sure about an introductory book, considering the availability of good, free books.

tejinderss 2y ago
> Here are some books I spent money on in the last 5 years Would you recommend these books?
- sshine 2y ago
  They are great in each their way, but they're niche. Production Haskell is for people who want to take their academic Haskell and turn it commercial. There's a lot of practical advice, both coding and non-coding. Thinking with Types is a very good introduction to type-driven , but the later chapters assume very strong type systems (type-level functions, higher-kinded types, etc.) so you may not be able to apply this kind of modelling outside of Haskell, PureScript, Idris, LEAN, etc. The book that translates best into any environment is Granin's Functional Architecture. I can warmly recommend that one even if you're not venturing into FP as a whole. I can't compare it to a whole lot of other software architecture books, though.