4 ms·

Why is European productivity so poor and how can it be improved?

9 points by peweet 2y ago

peweet 2y ago
Mario Draghi proposed a new Marshall plan in investmemnts from national governments. Mario Draghi wrote a report on European productivity and on why there is such a glaring disparity in productivity with the US. Mario Draghi is an Italian economist and statesman, who was credited with saving the Euro back in 2012. He made a famous speech saying the European Central Bank would "do whatever it takes to save the Euro", which is credited which restoring faith in the European financial institutions underwriting the Eurozone. Until 2009-11 EU productivty and GDP was broadly comparable with the US. In the 1990s/2000s Europe had a chance to compete with the US in IT but in todays world that has largely ended. The chance of creating an European hyperscaler for cloud computing as an example looks to be extremely remote. Draghi mentions that the educational institutions are not competitive enough and that captial markets need to be integrated. Also that Europe needs to give up trying to create a new Apple or Google and just focus on using the innovations generated by the IT revolution such as LLM's to just leapfrog into future industries and Green technologies. To retain key competencies in cloud computing but not allocating billions in the hope of creating a trillion dollar enterprise. What would any posters here propose? Please refrain from doomerism or that it is hopeless.
- rgbswan 2y ago
  Well, Draghi et al are not the only reason(s) why Europe refused IT independence. It's simply how the Germans and German immigrants raised their children in the past 20+ years, so it's all a lot of talk for TV and the radio and to elevate the US even more so that talent moves to work for and/or in the US. German leaders deliberately slowed innovation to make more money in the short-term ( oh wow, whaaaat? ) and capitalise on the data-hungry US economy whose people and last remaining noble characters have much less respect for privacy and security than their European counterparts. All that is a great opportunity for journalists and buffs to investigate these European leaders cooperative networks, which are all tied tight in the US. There is no room for Doomerism or hopeless talks. The path is clear and almost entirely disconnected from anything Europeans "have not" done or "have done" to end up in their position, which is also totally fine because there is no European or even German thinking or economic identity, not in the cities, not in villages [ exceptions exist of course ] and that's all because even educated voters have not realised who blinded them and how [ von der Leyen is just one boring example ] ... 30 years of making lots of money and despite great opportunity, this entire area hasn't changed one bit and the cognitive decline or rather lack of 'evolution' is brutal, which can be said about many places, of course, but it's almost shocking that it happened to the Germans. So all in all, foreign money, lower supply chain quality, an even lower product quality, less privacy and security, lower educational levels in all generations and a cultural demise accelerated by The Rights deliberately misdirected focus ( kindly supported by the liberals and conservatives ) will open the continent up for all the ways that made America what it is now. We are already seeing an increase in heavy drug use, more and more teens end up in psychiatric institutions and are fed meds that slow down their brains and organs. Hospitals are closing because no German with money cares about anything "German" or their "Heimat". Meanwhile the US Military is increasing presence and infrastructure and we are all quite happy that they do. Something happened to the German population ( including immigrants ) and there's no reason to believe that the German or European rich will ever want to compete with the US anywhere. They compare themselves only to the bottom, only to whats below or behind them, it's funny. They are perfectly fine winning against those with less opportunity/resources, even if that puts them far behind their actual competitors in terms of competence, business sense, strategy, and grandeur and beauty of their orbit/ sphere of control ( German: "Machtbereich" ). So just spare peoples minds with nonsensical talk about > European hyperscaler for cloud computing or > Europe needs to give up trying to create a new Apple or Google and just focus on using the innovations generated by the IT revolution such as LLM's to just leapfrog into future industries and Green technologies.
CraigRo 2y ago
Very rigid labor markets combined with high marginal tax rates and generous subsidies for the young. If you are ambitious, you channel your energies into non commerical things, emigrate, or quickly realize that making 2x what your friends make doesn't actually improve your quality of life
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- gatinsama 2y ago
  I would close the comments section after this. Perfect summary.
- RGamma 2y ago
  What very generous subsidies are you talking about? Cheaper tuition?
- foldr 2y ago
  The US having significantly higher productivity than Europe as a whole is a relatively recent phenomenon (since around 2005), and there are a number of individual European countries (e.g. France and Germany) that have similar productivity to the US. So I don't think it can be that simple. If having governments that are left of center (by US standards) killed productivity, then we'd see a different historical and present day picture.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
walthamstow 2y ago
Clickbait title. That phrase never appears in the web page or report linked Please rename to "The future of European competitiveness: A competitiveness strategy for Europe" which is the name of the report. @dang
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- peweet 2y ago
  Unfortuantely I am unable to alter the title.
palata 2y ago
The European economy has been slowing down since the peak of conventional oil production, around 2007. The US are producing a lot of oil. I think it's not completely weird to think that it is related.
voidr 2y ago
As a European I have an idea: fire the people in charge and try a different approach because clearly what they have been doing so far is not working, unfortunately they are likely going to just do more of the same things that made the EU fail before it had a chance to become superpower that can afford these inefficiencies.
- karmakurtisaani 2y ago
  That's a completely ridiculous suggestion, I hope you're aware of that.
  - voidr 2y ago
    Because it will never happen due to entrenchment of the establishment or because you believe that the EU leadership were doing the right thing and the EU is going into decline despite them making 100% the right choices the whole time?
    - palata 2y ago
      > the EU is going into decline despite them making 100% the right choices the whole time? There is a valid point to be made in that direction, which is that the EU economy is slowing down because the availability of fossil fuel has gone down (the peak for oil was around 2007). Not saying that they have been making 100% the right choices, of course. Just that it is wise to consider that the economy relies heavily on the availability of fossil fuels.
      - voidr 2y ago
        It would be amazing if we could transition from fossil fuels to clean energy overnight because it sucks that we don't have our own source of oil, however at the moment it's as realistic as the Hyperloop. We can inch towards clean energy, but destroying our industries does not help with that. It's very difficult to make wind farms if you don't have natural gas to heat up the iron. Even if we would get a magical device that would generate infinite clean energy for free we would have a huge problem on our hands with the fact that everyone has gas boilers in colder countries and it's not certain if the current electrical grid could even sustain the load generated by all the new electrical heaters. It looks to me that Europe(including UK) is having the most out of touch leaders it has ever had.
mdrzn 2y ago
Definitely clickbait title.

9 points by peweet 2y ago

Mario Draghi proposed a new Marshall plan in investmemnts from national governments. Mario Draghi wrote a report on European productivity and on why there is such a glaring disparity in productivity with the US. Mario Draghi is an Italian economist and statesman, who was credited with saving the Euro back in 2012. He made a famous speech saying the European Central Bank would "do whatever it takes to save the Euro", which is credited which restoring faith in the European financial institutions underwriting the Eurozone. Until 2009-11 EU productivty and GDP was broadly comparable with the US. In the 1990s/2000s Europe had a chance to compete with the US in IT but in todays world that has largely ended. The chance of creating an European hyperscaler for cloud computing as an example looks to be extremely remote. Draghi mentions that the educational institutions are not competitive enough and that captial markets need to be integrated. Also that Europe needs to give up trying to create a new Apple or Google and just focus on using the innovations generated by the IT revolution such as LLM's to just leapfrog into future industries and Green technologies. To retain key competencies in cloud computing but not allocating billions in the hope of creating a trillion dollar enterprise. What would any posters here propose? Please refrain from doomerism or that it is hopeless.

rgbswan 2y ago
Well, Draghi et al are not the only reason(s) why Europe refused IT independence. It's simply how the Germans and German immigrants raised their children in the past 20+ years, so it's all a lot of talk for TV and the radio and to elevate the US even more so that talent moves to work for and/or in the US. German leaders deliberately slowed innovation to make more money in the short-term ( oh wow, whaaaat? ) and capitalise on the data-hungry US economy whose people and last remaining noble characters have much less respect for privacy and security than their European counterparts. All that is a great opportunity for journalists and buffs to investigate these European leaders cooperative networks, which are all tied tight in the US. There is no room for Doomerism or hopeless talks. The path is clear and almost entirely disconnected from anything Europeans "have not" done or "have done" to end up in their position, which is also totally fine because there is no European or even German thinking or economic identity, not in the cities, not in villages [ exceptions exist of course ] and that's all because even educated voters have not realised who blinded them and how [ von der Leyen is just one boring example ] ... 30 years of making lots of money and despite great opportunity, this entire area hasn't changed one bit and the cognitive decline or rather lack of 'evolution' is brutal, which can be said about many places, of course, but it's almost shocking that it happened to the Germans. So all in all, foreign money, lower supply chain quality, an even lower product quality, less privacy and security, lower educational levels in all generations and a cultural demise accelerated by The Rights deliberately misdirected focus ( kindly supported by the liberals and conservatives ) will open the continent up for all the ways that made America what it is now. We are already seeing an increase in heavy drug use, more and more teens end up in psychiatric institutions and are fed meds that slow down their brains and organs. Hospitals are closing because no German with money cares about anything "German" or their "Heimat". Meanwhile the US Military is increasing presence and infrastructure and we are all quite happy that they do. Something happened to the German population ( including immigrants ) and there's no reason to believe that the German or European rich will ever want to compete with the US anywhere. They compare themselves only to the bottom, only to whats below or behind them, it's funny. They are perfectly fine winning against those with less opportunity/resources, even if that puts them far behind their actual competitors in terms of competence, business sense, strategy, and grandeur and beauty of their orbit/ sphere of control ( German: "Machtbereich" ). So just spare peoples minds with nonsensical talk about > European hyperscaler for cloud computing or > Europe needs to give up trying to create a new Apple or Google and just focus on using the innovations generated by the IT revolution such as LLM's to just leapfrog into future industries and Green technologies.

CraigRo 2y ago

Very rigid labor markets combined with high marginal tax rates and generous subsidies for the young. If you are ambitious, you channel your energies into non commerical things, emigrate, or quickly realize that making 2x what your friends make doesn't actually improve your quality of life

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
gatinsama 2y ago
I would close the comments section after this. Perfect summary.
RGamma 2y ago
What very generous subsidies are you talking about? Cheaper tuition?
foldr 2y ago
The US having significantly higher productivity than Europe as a whole is a relatively recent phenomenon (since around 2005), and there are a number of individual European countries (e.g. France and Germany) that have similar productivity to the US. So I don't think it can be that simple. If having governments that are left of center (by US standards) killed productivity, then we'd see a different historical and present day picture.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

walthamstow 2y ago

Clickbait title. That phrase never appears in the web page or report linked Please rename to "The future of European competitiveness: A competitiveness strategy for Europe" which is the name of the report. @dang

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
peweet 2y ago
Unfortuantely I am unable to alter the title.

palata 2y ago

The European economy has been slowing down since the peak of conventional oil production, around 2007. The US are producing a lot of oil. I think it's not completely weird to think that it is related.

voidr 2y ago

As a European I have an idea: fire the people in charge and try a different approach because clearly what they have been doing so far is not working, unfortunately they are likely going to just do more of the same things that made the EU fail before it had a chance to become superpower that can afford these inefficiencies.

karmakurtisaani 2y ago
That's a completely ridiculous suggestion, I hope you're aware of that.
- voidr 2y ago
  Because it will never happen due to entrenchment of the establishment or because you believe that the EU leadership were doing the right thing and the EU is going into decline despite them making 100% the right choices the whole time?
  - palata 2y ago
    > the EU is going into decline despite them making 100% the right choices the whole time? There is a valid point to be made in that direction, which is that the EU economy is slowing down because the availability of fossil fuel has gone down (the peak for oil was around 2007). Not saying that they have been making 100% the right choices, of course. Just that it is wise to consider that the economy relies heavily on the availability of fossil fuels.
    - voidr 2y ago
      It would be amazing if we could transition from fossil fuels to clean energy overnight because it sucks that we don't have our own source of oil, however at the moment it's as realistic as the Hyperloop. We can inch towards clean energy, but destroying our industries does not help with that. It's very difficult to make wind farms if you don't have natural gas to heat up the iron. Even if we would get a magical device that would generate infinite clean energy for free we would have a huge problem on our hands with the fact that everyone has gas boilers in colder countries and it's not certain if the current electrical grid could even sustain the load generated by all the new electrical heaters. It looks to me that Europe(including UK) is having the most out of touch leaders it has ever had.

mdrzn 2y ago

Definitely clickbait title.