4 ms·

Hahahhahahah no way. Salaries in Japan, Korea, Singapore are WAY better than China.

seanmcdirmid 2y ago
Not in tech. There is a weird de-emphasis of programmers in countries that aren’t the USA or mainland china. So a programmer from Japan with some experience/skills can move to Beijing (yes, there were many Japanese expat SWEs when I was there) for a better salary.
- foohoge 2y ago
  What? I'm Japanese but I've never heard a story about changing jobs to Chinese company. I heard a lot of stories about changing jobs to GAFAM. Could you tell me more about that?
  - seanmcdirmid 2y ago
    Microsoft paid more in Beijing than Tokyo while I was there, it turns out even experienced programmers in Tokyo don’t make $200k/year. Especially if you have a PhD or research in a hot field, you can get a pretty good job in richer Chinese cities. But an apartment is probably more expensive to rent in Beijing, and definitely in Shanghai, than it is in much of Tokyo, so there are trade offs.
    - foohoge 2y ago
      It's true that rents in Tokyo are expensive, but Kawasaki or Adachi, where the commute takes about 20 minutes, are cheap. I don't know about the salary, but I checked X or blog and it seems that some are work in the US headquarters, but none in Beijing. Anyway, when are you there? It looks you are talking in 2010.
  - numpad0 2y ago
    I don't think it's that much of an outrageous claim, plenty of our fellow countrymen works at local regional branches and English wings of China-owned companies these days. It doesn't take much stretch from there to imagine some of them moving to near their HQ. It's annoying that sometimes people thinks there has to be basic mutual intelligibility between Chinese and Japanese languages against the reality that there's none, but this is not about that at all. Chill.
    - foohoge 2y ago
      Is this response about a Chinese-owned company? They said about Microsoft in other responses and I don't receive like that. I'm not good at English, so I don't get the nuances that native speakers do.
baka367 2y ago
Better than avg(China) - sure. Better than tier1(China), where most of the research happens - the salaries in China are easily beating Japan and significant portion of the EU "centers" on top of having significantly lower cost of living on most of the relevant dimensions.
- foohoge 2y ago
  As I said in another thread, you can live cheaply in Japan if you're about 20 minutes by train from Tokyo. In that thread, someone said that rent is expensive in Beijing and Shanghai. It looks similar. Anyway, in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs. It sounds the cost of living in China is expensive.
  - tw1984 2y ago
    > in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs. When talking about paying such full medical costs, let me share some concrete numbers with you, all numbers are from tier 1 cities like Shanghai - Chest CT scan is 170-200 RMB, or 25-30 USD MRI scan is 260-460 RMB, or 35-65 USD Ultrasound is 20-170 RMB, or 3-25 USD PET CT is 6500 RMB, or 900 USD https://ybj.sh.gov.cn/cmsres/9b/9baabfec6f6c4e3fa03d6289f5e7781e/4370282a95455a99d4a3df42127e5ded.pdf https://ybj.sh.gov.cn/cmsres/9b/9baabfec6f6c4e3fa03d6289f5e7... Ambulance cost is shockingly low, 30 RMB per call plus 7 RMB per KM, that is 4 USD per call plus 1 USD per KM. https://wx.sh120.sh.cn/mobjsp/helpinfo/FeeScale.jsp?community=Sh120 https://wx.sh120.sh.cn/mobjsp/helpinfo/FeeScale.jsp?communit... when you can't afford those tests in the west or facing a stupidly long waiting period, don't be sad, just jump onto an airplane to get yourself checked & treated in Shanghai. You'd still save heap of money saved after such extra travel costs.
    - foohoge 2y ago
      Haha, it's more expensive than Japan. A frog in a well does not know the ocean.
leeorz 2y ago
If you consider the exchange rate, of course, salaries in China would be much lower. If considering purchasing power and cost of living, Chinese salaries would have a relatively high level of competitiveness.
- wordofx 2y ago
  There are sooo many programmers in China that they don’t value programming. You get paid peanuts because there’s so many people to do the job.

Not in tech. There is a weird de-emphasis of programmers in countries that aren’t the USA or mainland china. So a programmer from Japan with some experience/skills can move to Beijing (yes, there were many Japanese expat SWEs when I was there) for a better salary.

foohoge 2y ago
What? I'm Japanese but I've never heard a story about changing jobs to Chinese company. I heard a lot of stories about changing jobs to GAFAM. Could you tell me more about that?
- seanmcdirmid 2y ago
  Microsoft paid more in Beijing than Tokyo while I was there, it turns out even experienced programmers in Tokyo don’t make $200k/year. Especially if you have a PhD or research in a hot field, you can get a pretty good job in richer Chinese cities. But an apartment is probably more expensive to rent in Beijing, and definitely in Shanghai, than it is in much of Tokyo, so there are trade offs.
  - foohoge 2y ago
    It's true that rents in Tokyo are expensive, but Kawasaki or Adachi, where the commute takes about 20 minutes, are cheap. I don't know about the salary, but I checked X or blog and it seems that some are work in the US headquarters, but none in Beijing. Anyway, when are you there? It looks you are talking in 2010.
- numpad0 2y ago
  I don't think it's that much of an outrageous claim, plenty of our fellow countrymen works at local regional branches and English wings of China-owned companies these days. It doesn't take much stretch from there to imagine some of them moving to near their HQ. It's annoying that sometimes people thinks there has to be basic mutual intelligibility between Chinese and Japanese languages against the reality that there's none, but this is not about that at all. Chill.
  - foohoge 2y ago
    Is this response about a Chinese-owned company? They said about Microsoft in other responses and I don't receive like that. I'm not good at English, so I don't get the nuances that native speakers do.

baka367 2y ago

Better than avg(China) - sure. Better than tier1(China), where most of the research happens - the salaries in China are easily beating Japan and significant portion of the EU "centers" on top of having significantly lower cost of living on most of the relevant dimensions.

foohoge 2y ago
As I said in another thread, you can live cheaply in Japan if you're about 20 minutes by train from Tokyo. In that thread, someone said that rent is expensive in Beijing and Shanghai. It looks similar. Anyway, in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs. It sounds the cost of living in China is expensive.
- tw1984 2y ago
  > in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs. When talking about paying such full medical costs, let me share some concrete numbers with you, all numbers are from tier 1 cities like Shanghai - Chest CT scan is 170-200 RMB, or 25-30 USD MRI scan is 260-460 RMB, or 35-65 USD Ultrasound is 20-170 RMB, or 3-25 USD PET CT is 6500 RMB, or 900 USD https://ybj.sh.gov.cn/cmsres/9b/9baabfec6f6c4e3fa03d6289f5e7781e/4370282a95455a99d4a3df42127e5ded.pdf https://ybj.sh.gov.cn/cmsres/9b/9baabfec6f6c4e3fa03d6289f5e7... Ambulance cost is shockingly low, 30 RMB per call plus 7 RMB per KM, that is 4 USD per call plus 1 USD per KM. https://wx.sh120.sh.cn/mobjsp/helpinfo/FeeScale.jsp?community=Sh120 https://wx.sh120.sh.cn/mobjsp/helpinfo/FeeScale.jsp?communit... when you can't afford those tests in the west or facing a stupidly long waiting period, don't be sad, just jump onto an airplane to get yourself checked & treated in Shanghai. You'd still save heap of money saved after such extra travel costs.
  - foohoge 2y ago
    Haha, it's more expensive than Japan. A frog in a well does not know the ocean.

leeorz 2y ago

If you consider the exchange rate, of course, salaries in China would be much lower. If considering purchasing power and cost of living, Chinese salaries would have a relatively high level of competitiveness.

wordofx 2y ago
There are sooo many programmers in China that they don’t value programming. You get paid peanuts because there’s so many people to do the job.