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Do you have data to prove that? If not, then leaders have every right to go with their gut instincts. Give me an example of a company that is immensely success

Do you have data to prove that? If not, then leaders have every right to go with their gut instincts. Give me an example of a company that is immensely successful (massive growth) like say OpenAI that are fully remote

ElevenLathe 2y ago
You're arguing on capital's terms. The company isn't owed massive growth. They are allowed to have it if labor is willing to work under the conditions they provide and if the state continues to allow their incorporation and its related benefits (and they get lucky, presumably).
- meta_x_ai 2y ago
  That's perfectly fine. Considering OpenAI, Google, Amazon despite their strong RTO policies are attracting the top talent, they don't have worry about pleasing midwits not applying to their companies. Self-attrition by entitled, highly paid mid-performers are the greatest gift to corporations in this economy, where there is fresh batch of engineers wanting to take their place
  - no_wizard 2y ago
    >despite their strong RTO policies are attracting the top talent I suspect its not that simple[0] Never mind the fact, that the sheer size of these organizations means they are full of average tech talent. Go lang was created in part to specifically address the fact that the engineers Google hires in droves needed a simplified language to work productively in a relatively quick manner, consistently. [0]: https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinecruzvergara/2023/03/02/companies-outside-of-big-tech-are-winning-top-talent-this-year-heres-how-theyll-do-it/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinecruzvergara/2023/03/02...
  - ElevenLathe 2y ago
    So are you a corporate exec? Or just choosing to identify with management for reasons of...psychology? politics?
gagik_co 2y ago
Massive growth is your arbitrarily chosen definition of success. Companies that have grown massively required a less competitive environment and the time to do so (with many being founded before fully remote was as common) and/or took a ton of funding (with oldschool investors who obviously see in-office expansion as the needed/natural sign of growth). There are plenty of profitable and growing companies that are fully remote, whether that’s “successful” is just how you want to see it.
no_wizard 2y ago
Firstly, do you have any data that proves that it isn't true? You haven't made any data driven assertion here either. Secondly, what is 'massive'? Like, adoption curve growth for many remote first companies is huge, like Zapier, but I digress, that is a very subjective thing. Gitlab has been day one remote. Zapier Deel Posthog Others have transitioned to be fully remote, like GitHub[0] and GitHub has had a second wave of massive growth around the same time and its continued to this day. [0]: https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/09/github-lays-off-10-and-goes-fully-remote/ https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/09/github-lays-off-10-and-goe...
spjt 2y ago
Not really a "company" but any number of OSS projects. Linux etc.

ElevenLathe 2y ago

You're arguing on capital's terms. The company isn't owed massive growth. They are allowed to have it if labor is willing to work under the conditions they provide and if the state continues to allow their incorporation and its related benefits (and they get lucky, presumably).

meta_x_ai 2y ago
That's perfectly fine. Considering OpenAI, Google, Amazon despite their strong RTO policies are attracting the top talent, they don't have worry about pleasing midwits not applying to their companies. Self-attrition by entitled, highly paid mid-performers are the greatest gift to corporations in this economy, where there is fresh batch of engineers wanting to take their place
- no_wizard 2y ago
  >despite their strong RTO policies are attracting the top talent I suspect its not that simple[0] Never mind the fact, that the sheer size of these organizations means they are full of average tech talent. Go lang was created in part to specifically address the fact that the engineers Google hires in droves needed a simplified language to work productively in a relatively quick manner, consistently. [0]: https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinecruzvergara/2023/03/02/companies-outside-of-big-tech-are-winning-top-talent-this-year-heres-how-theyll-do-it/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinecruzvergara/2023/03/02...
- ElevenLathe 2y ago
  So are you a corporate exec? Or just choosing to identify with management for reasons of...psychology? politics?

gagik_co 2y ago

Massive growth is your arbitrarily chosen definition of success. Companies that have grown massively required a less competitive environment and the time to do so (with many being founded before fully remote was as common) and/or took a ton of funding (with oldschool investors who obviously see in-office expansion as the needed/natural sign of growth). There are plenty of profitable and growing companies that are fully remote, whether that’s “successful” is just how you want to see it.

no_wizard 2y ago

Firstly, do you have any data that proves that it isn't true? You haven't made any data driven assertion here either. Secondly, what is 'massive'? Like, adoption curve growth for many remote first companies is huge, like Zapier, but I digress, that is a very subjective thing. Gitlab has been day one remote. Zapier Deel Posthog Others have transitioned to be fully remote, like GitHub[0] and GitHub has had a second wave of massive growth around the same time and its continued to this day. [0]: https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/09/github-lays-off-10-and-goes-fully-remote/ https://techcrunch.com/2023/02/09/github-lays-off-10-and-goe...

spjt 2y ago

Not really a "company" but any number of OSS projects. Linux etc.