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> ask informed consent I think it's a bit cliché; where do you draw the line? Should free software also display a copy of their license at first start and ask

> ask informed consent I think it's a bit cliché; where do you draw the line? Should free software also display a copy of their license at first start and ask their users to click "I agree"? When you start using a piece of software (free or not), there is a set of terms and conditions that you agree to (explicitly as is often the case with proprietary software or implicitly as with free software), which may include opt-out telemetry. As long as this is communicated, I don't see any problem with it. To give credit where its due, I agree that Manjaro users may have never accepted opt-out telemetry when they first started using the OS and now this is being rolled out after the fact. Still, for a general-purpose OS that makes no privacy claims (e.g. Tails), I don't see how collecting their screen resolution etc makes a big difference. An average webpage today collects more than that in a single page view.

TeMPOraL 2y ago
> When you start using a piece of software (free or not), there is a set of terms and conditions that you agree to (explicitly as is often the case with proprietary software or implicitly as with free software), which may include opt-out telemetry. ToC may include anything whatsoever, it doesn't mean it's binding (in B2C setting). Opt-out telemetry, in particular, is against reasonable expectations, and in much of the world isn't even legal in the first place.
alwayslikethis 2y ago
One of the best things about using free software is you don't get any nags, terms and conditions you need to click through.
JohnFen 2y ago
> An average webpage today collects more than that in a single page view. Correct, which is why I have severely curtailed my use of the web. The situation is horrible.
account42 2y ago
> When you start using a piece of software (free or not), there is a set of terms and conditions that you agree to (explicitly as is often the case with proprietary software or implicitly as with free software), which may include opt-out telemetry. As long as this is communicated, I don't see any problem with it. Writing "our software is allowed to do whatever we want" somewhere deep in your terms of service doesn't actually give you the right to distribute malware. > Still, for a general-purpose OS that makes no privacy claims (e.g. Tails) Operating systems did not have to make privacy claims because this was assumed implicitly. It is a relatively recent fad to make everything online connected. > I don't see how collecting their screen resolution etc makes a big difference. An average webpage today collects more than that in a single page view. The specific data collected is irrelevant. I don't want my computer making any unneccessary connections to third parties.
marcosdumay 2y ago
> Should free software also display a copy of their license at first start and ask their users to click "I agree"? No, because people don't have to agree with free licenses for using free software. (And yes, free software installers that make the user agree with them are bad.)

TeMPOraL 2y ago

> When you start using a piece of software (free or not), there is a set of terms and conditions that you agree to (explicitly as is often the case with proprietary software or implicitly as with free software), which may include opt-out telemetry. ToC may include anything whatsoever, it doesn't mean it's binding (in B2C setting). Opt-out telemetry, in particular, is against reasonable expectations, and in much of the world isn't even legal in the first place.

alwayslikethis 2y ago

One of the best things about using free software is you don't get any nags, terms and conditions you need to click through.

JohnFen 2y ago

> An average webpage today collects more than that in a single page view. Correct, which is why I have severely curtailed my use of the web. The situation is horrible.

account42 2y ago

> When you start using a piece of software (free or not), there is a set of terms and conditions that you agree to (explicitly as is often the case with proprietary software or implicitly as with free software), which may include opt-out telemetry. As long as this is communicated, I don't see any problem with it. Writing "our software is allowed to do whatever we want" somewhere deep in your terms of service doesn't actually give you the right to distribute malware. > Still, for a general-purpose OS that makes no privacy claims (e.g. Tails) Operating systems did not have to make privacy claims because this was assumed implicitly. It is a relatively recent fad to make everything online connected. > I don't see how collecting their screen resolution etc makes a big difference. An average webpage today collects more than that in a single page view. The specific data collected is irrelevant. I don't want my computer making any unneccessary connections to third parties.

marcosdumay 2y ago

> Should free software also display a copy of their license at first start and ask their users to click "I agree"? No, because people don't have to agree with free licenses for using free software. (And yes, free software installers that make the user agree with them are bad.)