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Are you not allowed to disclose salary first? Sorry to be blunt, but if you are allowed, then this sounds incredibly stupid.

dijit 2y ago
I can disclose, but when I have people start trying to negotiate as if it's a starting position, they get really happy with the number and then irreconcilably annoyed when they realise the number doesn't change. Hindsight and looking externally on the situation would have you think that you'd react differently, but it's a 5/5 repro rate. If I think the money is enough then I'm quite happy, but if they expect more then I have to emphasise other parts of the job (remote first structure for example, and flexible working hours) - I wouldn't need to do that if their request was lower than what I offer.
- Thorrez 2y ago
  Why not disclose it and also say "it's not up for any negotiation".
  - dijit 2y ago
    that is exactly how it's presented, I give my methodology and how I arrived at the number (market rate in munich + 20%) and then give the number with exactly this caveat.
  - pm90 2y ago
    Remember that people go by what others do. There is 0 penalty for lying about the fact that the number is not negotiable and so recruiters will do that often. So job applicants are conditioned to try to negotiate even if told quite clearly that its the “final number”.
    - Thorrez 2y ago
      I'm not surprised that people still try to negotiate. I am surprised that they're irreconcilably annoyed when negotiating fails.
- em-bee 2y ago
  you could post it as a range. from something lower up to what you actually intend to offer. or even below that. if your goal is to avoid needless negotiations, then after you tell them your range, they tell theirs and then you tell them the actual offer.
deleted 2y ago
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em-bee 2y ago
someone else replied and then deleted their comment, but i think they made an interesting point that i don't agree with. they said that someone desperate to get a job will accept a low offer and keep looking for something better. and by asking them for their expectation this could be prevented. if i am desperate for a job then i am going to give you a lower expected number in the hopes that i'll get the job and then keep looking anyways. so no, i don't think asking a desperate candidate will help you avoid that problem.

dijit 2y ago

I can disclose, but when I have people start trying to negotiate as if it's a starting position, they get really happy with the number and then irreconcilably annoyed when they realise the number doesn't change. Hindsight and looking externally on the situation would have you think that you'd react differently, but it's a 5/5 repro rate. If I think the money is enough then I'm quite happy, but if they expect more then I have to emphasise other parts of the job (remote first structure for example, and flexible working hours) - I wouldn't need to do that if their request was lower than what I offer.

Thorrez 2y ago
Why not disclose it and also say "it's not up for any negotiation".
- dijit 2y ago
  that is exactly how it's presented, I give my methodology and how I arrived at the number (market rate in munich + 20%) and then give the number with exactly this caveat.
- pm90 2y ago
  Remember that people go by what others do. There is 0 penalty for lying about the fact that the number is not negotiable and so recruiters will do that often. So job applicants are conditioned to try to negotiate even if told quite clearly that its the “final number”.
  - Thorrez 2y ago
    I'm not surprised that people still try to negotiate. I am surprised that they're irreconcilably annoyed when negotiating fails.
em-bee 2y ago
you could post it as a range. from something lower up to what you actually intend to offer. or even below that. if your goal is to avoid needless negotiations, then after you tell them your range, they tell theirs and then you tell them the actual offer.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

em-bee 2y ago

someone else replied and then deleted their comment, but i think they made an interesting point that i don't agree with. they said that someone desperate to get a job will accept a low offer and keep looking for something better. and by asking them for their expectation this could be prevented. if i am desperate for a job then i am going to give you a lower expected number in the hopes that i'll get the job and then keep looking anyways. so no, i don't think asking a desperate candidate will help you avoid that problem.