6 ms·

Never talk to the police. Do not "just give a statement" to get them to let you go. Identify yourself when asked, ask for a lawyer, then shut up. If communica

Never talk to the police. Do not "just give a statement" to get them to let you go. Identify yourself when asked, ask for a lawyer, then shut up. If communicating something to the police might be helpful for you, do that through your lawyer. "You can beat the charges but you can't beat the ride"

nappsec 2y ago
Yup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
- isatty 2y ago
  Required watching imho, I watch this atleast once a year.
- nkrisc 2y ago
  Every person in the United States, whether a citizen or just visiting, would do well to watch this.
- linsomniac 2y ago
  An informative and entertaining watch. Never answer questions from the police. Also, if you are arrested, keep your mouth shut. Don't say anything about anything on the phone or while in custody, even to other inmates. When you call your lawyer or family, don't say anything more than "I've been arrested and need a laywer" don't say "I screwed up" or anything really. Tell all this to your kids and spouse.
echelon 2y ago
We just need brain scanning technology to extract and reconstruct memories directly. It's probably not far off. There's a whole host of new potential investigative technology that may be right around the corner: - memory extraction - DNA to photograph / phenotype - photograph to DNA - environmental DNA recovery from exhalation, etc.
- spoonfeeder006 2y ago
  Not far off?? Just imagine the insane amounts of training data needed to be accurate on that. Although brain scanning data to determine if a non-psychopath and non-narcissist is lying or telling the truth is probably not nearly as difficult
- bobthepanda 2y ago
  it's more likely that that kind of psuedotechnology would get promoted as a way to wash false or suspect testimony, like lie detectors were. it's not even clear why you would want to anyways. Human recall is notoriously terrible.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- Terr_ 2y ago
  BRB, getting hypnotized into "remembering" someone wealthy signed a contract giving me lots and lots of money.
  - 77pt77 2y ago
    Not like that!
- MrDrMcCoy 2y ago
  Memory extraction is likely impossible, as I expect that every brain encodes long-term memory slightly differently. There was a demonstration of partially decoding images from _surface memory_ that a subject was already thinking of, but that only works because they were reading off the visual cortex, which brains use to reconstruct scenes from long-term-memory and is better understood. [1] That said, directly reading memories is unlikely to be necessary. In Daniel Suarez's Daemon/Freedom™, he proposes using fMRI and increasingly narrow questions to extract truthful information. The blood flow in our brains changes when we lie, and is much easier and faster to detect. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20111216184729/http://newscenter.berkeley.edu/2011/09/22/brain-movies/ https://web.archive.org/web/20111216184729/http://newscenter...
FireBeyond 2y ago
> then shut up The Supreme Court, in its infinite wisdom, has ruled that you cannot exercise your right to remain silent by merely remaining silent, and that the Prosecution can say things like "you didn't have an answer when asked questions". To exercise your right to remain silent, the Court says, you must say "I am exercising my right to remain silent". And don't say "I want a lawyer, dawg", or else the police will say they were unable to find you a canine who had passed the bar, and thus your request for counsel was not a serious one and that they are free to continue your interrogation... and the Court (in this case, the Louisiana Supreme Court) will say that that was a perfectly reasonable interpretation of your request.
- Terr_ 2y ago
  Other readers, please note that none of the above is an exaggeration. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/suspect-asks-for-a-lawyer-dawg-judge-says-he-asked-for-a-lawyer-dog.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/suspect-asks-for...
  - decremental 2y ago
    [dead]
- gmiller123456 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - coldtea 2y ago
    In what universe is "Why don't you just get me a lawyer, dawg" ambiguous, except in the universe of backwater town prosecutors playing wordgames?
    - wisty 2y ago
      Thus is an example of a rhetorical question. You aren't asking for anything, you are making a statement. Another example is “If y’all, this is how I feel, if y’all think I did it, I know that I didn’t do it so why don’t you just give me a lawyer dog cause this is not what’s up.” which is a statement of innocence, not asking for anything.
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
“Never talk to the police” is impractical. Not everyone pulled over on a traffic stop has the time and money to be obstructive. (Or afford the ticket they might smile their way out of.) Better, maybe: never concede. And if it goes beyond the sundry, call counsel. (If you don’t have counsel, weigh being technically correct and massively inconvenienced against being pleasant but subordinate.) TL; DR If they’re asking about felonies, shut up. If they’re telling you off for a tail light, ehhh!
- chaps 2y ago
  This is terrible advice, friend.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > This is terrible advice, friend Why? I say this as someone with personal counsel on retainer, and who has been pulled over but not gotten a ticket in a decade. I’m legally conservative but also practical. Most people don’t have the time to be arraigned every time they might have gone five over. “Never talk to the police” means every random stop turns into interrogation. That simply isn’t the baseline risk for most of us.
    - chaps 2y ago
      And I'm saying that as an award winning investigative journalist who focuses on transparency and police misconduct. This is the first time in years where I only have one lawsuit against a police agency. I also have counsel on retainer :) I believe your advice is bad because it's being given to a wide audience that very likely doesn't know better.
  - gcau 2y ago
    It's not terrible advice, it's the same advice you will hear from many lawyers. If a cop pulls you over because you were blatantly speeding - saying nothing, or admitting to it and apologising, are both reasonable things to do. Never talking to police is a safer blanket decision, but you can have some grey area.
beepbooptheory 2y ago
My father was a lawyer and I grew up hearing this advice. But then we ended up living in Texas when I became a stoner teen. I can't quite explain what its like to be on the side of the interstate for literally hours undergoing constant questioning and various forms of psychological torture. Splitting everyone up, questioning everyone to try to find inconsistencies. Multiple times I remember telling a cop "no, you are not allowed to do this, am I being detained?" And they can just respond "yes I am, no you're not, can I look through your car now?" In central nowhere texas, the cops are elite at this. Just all of us pretty much sobbing on the side of the road from the stress, pleading and pleading with them... But I would live through that everyday of my life if I knew I would never have to get to the sometimes next chapter of this kind of thing: jail in a small Texas town. There I learned about both physical and psychological torture. But its too much to get into. And yes I tried to fight the most egregious event of torture, spent alot of time talking to lawyer, explaining what happened to me. My stop was unlawful even in that case. But I came in with a some fancy Austin lawyer to Brownwood, TX and they all but laughed us out of the courtroom. And even after all that, don't even get me started on how they extract your money and sanity for years and years if your lucky like me to get probation for an eighth oz of mushrooms. I was a special case because I ended up going to grad school and it was easy for me to work the weekends to make the money I needed to pay them that wasnt covered by my stipend. I am also so grateful I kept a spreadsheet of my payments to them, it truly truly saved me from more years and money. They are really good with all their paperwork, except for anything to do with paying them money. But very important to realize in all this: this is not at all exceptional, and I am a card-carrying privileged white man. This is just how it is.
- adriand 2y ago
  I'm sorry about what happened to you!
- mkatx 2y ago
  Can confirm, 100% Texas right there. It is still worse for non-white men though, but even that won't save you here.
- ranger_danger 2y ago
  [flagged]
qingcharles 2y ago
It's not always that simple. I promise you, if armed police are threatening to harm your family you will tell them anything they want and sign anything they want to get them to stop. In the USA you might be able to get the statements thrown out afterwards, but as long as the police didn't actually commit any violence then they are likely to get promoted. And you have to be pragmatic; you might be able to get the charges thrown out, but you could easily spend a decade or more in pretrial detention to do it.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > if armed police are threatening to harm your family you will tell them anything they want and sign anything they want to get them to stop Don’t do this. If the charges are serious, if the motivation is so serious they’ll use illegal violence, say nothing. Demand a lawyer. Where I disagree with this is in super minor cases. I took a left without indicating, once, and got pulled over by the town pub. I figured they were looking for drunks, so I co-operated; the worst I was admitting to was a traffic ticket.
  - qingcharles 2y ago
    The charges don't have to be serious for the police to use illegal violence. They do it regularly for minor cases. If they are threatening violence, you can be sure your demands for a lawyer are going to go unheard.
anal_reactor 2y ago
It's extremely sad that things work like that in a supposedly democratic country.
tzs 2y ago
Do you really mean never? I've run into a lot of people who have heard that advice and take it very literally, to the point that when I've asked them what they would do if an officer responding to an explosion and fire at their workplace asked the people who got out if they knew of anyone still in the building said that they would not answer without getting a lawyer first.
- basilgohar 2y ago
  It sounds absurd, but people have been arrested or even killed for less cooperation than this. Blame the system, not the people who are trying to avoid being destroyed by the system. Law enforcement has become more and more hostile towards citizens with time, not less. Wariness is the only way to navigate it, unfortunately.
- BobaFloutist 2y ago
  Tell the firefighters, what are the police going to do?
- henryfjordan 2y ago
  Emergency situations where you are trying to coordinate is maybe the only time I would talk to a cop, and if you can talk to a fire fighter or EMT instead I would do that. In the case of the fire I wouldn't say anything except "Little Timmy is still inside, on the second floor". Do not discuss how the fire started or anything like that.

nappsec 2y ago

Yup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE

isatty 2y ago
Required watching imho, I watch this atleast once a year.
nkrisc 2y ago
Every person in the United States, whether a citizen or just visiting, would do well to watch this.
linsomniac 2y ago
An informative and entertaining watch. Never answer questions from the police. Also, if you are arrested, keep your mouth shut. Don't say anything about anything on the phone or while in custody, even to other inmates. When you call your lawyer or family, don't say anything more than "I've been arrested and need a laywer" don't say "I screwed up" or anything really. Tell all this to your kids and spouse.

echelon 2y ago

We just need brain scanning technology to extract and reconstruct memories directly. It's probably not far off. There's a whole host of new potential investigative technology that may be right around the corner: - memory extraction - DNA to photograph / phenotype - photograph to DNA - environmental DNA recovery from exhalation, etc.

spoonfeeder006 2y ago
Not far off?? Just imagine the insane amounts of training data needed to be accurate on that. Although brain scanning data to determine if a non-psychopath and non-narcissist is lying or telling the truth is probably not nearly as difficult
bobthepanda 2y ago
it's more likely that that kind of psuedotechnology would get promoted as a way to wash false or suspect testimony, like lie detectors were. it's not even clear why you would want to anyways. Human recall is notoriously terrible.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
Terr_ 2y ago
BRB, getting hypnotized into "remembering" someone wealthy signed a contract giving me lots and lots of money.
- 77pt77 2y ago
  Not like that!
MrDrMcCoy 2y ago
Memory extraction is likely impossible, as I expect that every brain encodes long-term memory slightly differently. There was a demonstration of partially decoding images from _surface memory_ that a subject was already thinking of, but that only works because they were reading off the visual cortex, which brains use to reconstruct scenes from long-term-memory and is better understood. [1] That said, directly reading memories is unlikely to be necessary. In Daniel Suarez's Daemon/Freedom™, he proposes using fMRI and increasingly narrow questions to extract truthful information. The blood flow in our brains changes when we lie, and is much easier and faster to detect. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20111216184729/http://newscenter.berkeley.edu/2011/09/22/brain-movies/ https://web.archive.org/web/20111216184729/http://newscenter...

FireBeyond 2y ago

> then shut up The Supreme Court, in its infinite wisdom, has ruled that you cannot exercise your right to remain silent by merely remaining silent, and that the Prosecution can say things like "you didn't have an answer when asked questions". To exercise your right to remain silent, the Court says, you must say "I am exercising my right to remain silent". And don't say "I want a lawyer, dawg", or else the police will say they were unable to find you a canine who had passed the bar, and thus your request for counsel was not a serious one and that they are free to continue your interrogation... and the Court (in this case, the Louisiana Supreme Court) will say that that was a perfectly reasonable interpretation of your request.

Terr_ 2y ago
Other readers, please note that none of the above is an exaggeration. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/suspect-asks-for-a-lawyer-dawg-judge-says-he-asked-for-a-lawyer-dog.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/suspect-asks-for...
- decremental 2y ago
  [dead]
gmiller123456 2y ago
[flagged]
- coldtea 2y ago
  In what universe is "Why don't you just get me a lawyer, dawg" ambiguous, except in the universe of backwater town prosecutors playing wordgames?
  - wisty 2y ago
    Thus is an example of a rhetorical question. You aren't asking for anything, you are making a statement. Another example is “If y’all, this is how I feel, if y’all think I did it, I know that I didn’t do it so why don’t you just give me a lawyer dog cause this is not what’s up.” which is a statement of innocence, not asking for anything.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

“Never talk to the police” is impractical. Not everyone pulled over on a traffic stop has the time and money to be obstructive. (Or afford the ticket they might smile their way out of.) Better, maybe: never concede. And if it goes beyond the sundry, call counsel. (If you don’t have counsel, weigh being technically correct and massively inconvenienced against being pleasant but subordinate.) TL; DR If they’re asking about felonies, shut up. If they’re telling you off for a tail light, ehhh!

chaps 2y ago
This is terrible advice, friend.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > This is terrible advice, friend Why? I say this as someone with personal counsel on retainer, and who has been pulled over but not gotten a ticket in a decade. I’m legally conservative but also practical. Most people don’t have the time to be arraigned every time they might have gone five over. “Never talk to the police” means every random stop turns into interrogation. That simply isn’t the baseline risk for most of us.
  - chaps 2y ago
    And I'm saying that as an award winning investigative journalist who focuses on transparency and police misconduct. This is the first time in years where I only have one lawsuit against a police agency. I also have counsel on retainer :) I believe your advice is bad because it's being given to a wide audience that very likely doesn't know better.
- gcau 2y ago
  It's not terrible advice, it's the same advice you will hear from many lawyers. If a cop pulls you over because you were blatantly speeding - saying nothing, or admitting to it and apologising, are both reasonable things to do. Never talking to police is a safer blanket decision, but you can have some grey area.

beepbooptheory 2y ago

My father was a lawyer and I grew up hearing this advice. But then we ended up living in Texas when I became a stoner teen. I can't quite explain what its like to be on the side of the interstate for literally hours undergoing constant questioning and various forms of psychological torture. Splitting everyone up, questioning everyone to try to find inconsistencies. Multiple times I remember telling a cop "no, you are not allowed to do this, am I being detained?" And they can just respond "yes I am, no you're not, can I look through your car now?" In central nowhere texas, the cops are elite at this. Just all of us pretty much sobbing on the side of the road from the stress, pleading and pleading with them... But I would live through that everyday of my life if I knew I would never have to get to the sometimes next chapter of this kind of thing: jail in a small Texas town. There I learned about both physical and psychological torture. But its too much to get into. And yes I tried to fight the most egregious event of torture, spent alot of time talking to lawyer, explaining what happened to me. My stop was unlawful even in that case. But I came in with a some fancy Austin lawyer to Brownwood, TX and they all but laughed us out of the courtroom. And even after all that, don't even get me started on how they extract your money and sanity for years and years if your lucky like me to get probation for an eighth oz of mushrooms. I was a special case because I ended up going to grad school and it was easy for me to work the weekends to make the money I needed to pay them that wasnt covered by my stipend. I am also so grateful I kept a spreadsheet of my payments to them, it truly truly saved me from more years and money. They are really good with all their paperwork, except for anything to do with paying them money. But very important to realize in all this: this is not at all exceptional, and I am a card-carrying privileged white man. This is just how it is.

adriand 2y ago
I'm sorry about what happened to you!
mkatx 2y ago
Can confirm, 100% Texas right there. It is still worse for non-white men though, but even that won't save you here.
ranger_danger 2y ago
[flagged]

qingcharles 2y ago

It's not always that simple. I promise you, if armed police are threatening to harm your family you will tell them anything they want and sign anything they want to get them to stop. In the USA you might be able to get the statements thrown out afterwards, but as long as the police didn't actually commit any violence then they are likely to get promoted. And you have to be pragmatic; you might be able to get the charges thrown out, but you could easily spend a decade or more in pretrial detention to do it.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> if armed police are threatening to harm your family you will tell them anything they want and sign anything they want to get them to stop Don’t do this. If the charges are serious, if the motivation is so serious they’ll use illegal violence, say nothing. Demand a lawyer. Where I disagree with this is in super minor cases. I took a left without indicating, once, and got pulled over by the town pub. I figured they were looking for drunks, so I co-operated; the worst I was admitting to was a traffic ticket.
- qingcharles 2y ago
  The charges don't have to be serious for the police to use illegal violence. They do it regularly for minor cases. If they are threatening violence, you can be sure your demands for a lawyer are going to go unheard.

anal_reactor 2y ago

It's extremely sad that things work like that in a supposedly democratic country.

tzs 2y ago

Do you really mean never? I've run into a lot of people who have heard that advice and take it very literally, to the point that when I've asked them what they would do if an officer responding to an explosion and fire at their workplace asked the people who got out if they knew of anyone still in the building said that they would not answer without getting a lawyer first.

basilgohar 2y ago
It sounds absurd, but people have been arrested or even killed for less cooperation than this. Blame the system, not the people who are trying to avoid being destroyed by the system. Law enforcement has become more and more hostile towards citizens with time, not less. Wariness is the only way to navigate it, unfortunately.
BobaFloutist 2y ago
Tell the firefighters, what are the police going to do?
henryfjordan 2y ago
Emergency situations where you are trying to coordinate is maybe the only time I would talk to a cop, and if you can talk to a fire fighter or EMT instead I would do that. In the case of the fire I wouldn't say anything except "Little Timmy is still inside, on the second floor". Do not discuss how the fire started or anything like that.