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Is this really an AWS issue? Sounds like you were just burning CPU cycles, which is not AWS related. WebSockets makes it sound like it was a data transfer or A

Is this really an AWS issue? Sounds like you were just burning CPU cycles, which is not AWS related. WebSockets makes it sound like it was a data transfer or API gateway cost.

VWWHFSfQ 2y ago
> Is this really an AWS issue? I doubt they would have even noticed this outrageous cost if they were running on bare-metal Xeons or Ryzen colo'd servers. You can rent real 44-core Xeon servers for like, $250/month. So yes, it's an AWS issue.
- JackSlateur 2y ago
  You can rent real 44-core Xeon servers for like, $250/month. Where, for instance ?
  - Faaak 2y ago
    Hetzner for example. An EPYC 48c (96t) goes for 230 euros
    - dilyevsky 2y ago
      Hetzner network is complete dog. They also sell you machines that are long should be EOL’ed. No serious business should be using them
      - dijit 2y ago
        What cpu do you think your workload is using on AWS? GCP exposes their cpu models, and they have some Haswell and Broadwell lithographies in service. Thats a 10+ year old part, for those paying attention.
        dilyevsky 2y ago
        Most of GCP and some AWS instances will migrate to another node when it’s faulty. Also disk is virtual. None of this applies to baremetal hetzner
        dijit 2y ago
        Why is that relevant to what I said?
        dilyevsky 2y ago
        Only relevant if you care about reliability
        dijit 2y ago
        AWS was working “fine” for about 10 years without live migration, and I’ve had several individual machines running without a reboot or outage for quite literally half a decade. Enough to hit bugs like this: https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=a00092491en_us&docLocale=en_US https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=a00092... Anyway, depending on individual nodes to always be up for reliability is incredibly foolhardy. Things can happen, cloud isn't magic, I’ve had instances become unrecoverable. Though it is rare. So, I still don’t understand the point, that was not exactly relevant to what I said.
        tsimionescu 2y ago
        I think they meant that Hetzner is offering specific machines they know to be faulty and should have EOLd to customers, not that they use deprecated CPUs.
        dijit 2y ago
        Thats scary if true, any sources? My google-fu is failing me. :/
        2y ago
      - speedgoose 2y ago
        I know serious businesses using Hetzner for their critical workloads. I wouldn’t unless money is tight, but it is possible. I use them for my non critical stuff, it costs so much less.
      - blibble 2y ago
        I just cat'ed /proc/cpuinfo on my Hetzner and AWS machines AWS: E5-2680 v4 (2016) Hetzner: Ryzen 5 (2019)
        dilyevsky 2y ago
        Now do hard drives
        blibble 2y ago
        the hetzner one is a dedicated pcie 4.0 nvme device and wrote at 2.3GB/s (O_DIRECT) the AWS one is some emulated block device, no idea what it is, other than it's 20x slower
        luuurker 2y ago
        You keep moving the goal posts with these replies. Hetzner isn't the best provider in the world, but it's also not as bad as you say they are. They're not just renting old servers.
    - throwaway2037 2y ago
      I checked here: https://www.hetzner.com/managed-server/ https://www.hetzner.com/managed-server/ I see "AMD EPYC 7502P 32-Core" for 236 EUR per month. Can you tell me where you see 48c/96t? EDIT I found it! Unbelievable that it is so cheap. https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_from=32%2B64&cpu_type=AMD&price_from=550 https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_...
  - GauntletWizard 2y ago
    Hetzner: https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_from=32%2B64 https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_...
  - VWWHFSfQ 2y ago
    There are many colos that offer dedicated server rental/hosting. You can just google for colos in the region you're looking for. I found this one https://www.colocrossing.com/server/dedicated-servers/ https://www.colocrossing.com/server/dedicated-servers/
    - petcat 2y ago
      I don't know anything about Colo Crossing (are they a reseller?) but I would bet their $60 per month 4-core Intel Xeons would outperform a $1,000 per month "compute optimized" EC2 server.
      - fragmede 2y ago
        What benchmark would you like to use?
        petcat 2y ago
        This blog is about doing video processing on the CPU, so something akin to that.
      - phonon 2y ago
        For $1000 per month you can get a c8g.12xlarge (assuming you use some kind of savings plan).[0] That's 48 cores, 96 GB of RAM and 22.5+ Gbps networking. Of course you still need to pay for storage, egress etc., but you seem to be exaggerating a bit....they do offer a 44 core Broadwell/128 GB RAM option for $229 per month, so AWS is more like a 4x markup[1]....the C8g would likely be much faster at single threaded tasks though[2][3] [0]https://instances.vantage.sh/aws/ec2/c8g.12xlarge?region=us-east-1&os=linux&cost_duration=monthly&reserved_term=Standard.noUpfront https://instances.vantage.sh/aws/ec2/c8g.12xlarge?region=us-... [1]https://portal.colocrossing.com/register/order/service/480 https://portal.colocrossing.com/register/order/service/480 [2]https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8305329 https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8305329 [3]https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/intel-xeon-e5-2699-v4 https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/intel-xeon-e5-2699-...
brazzy 2y ago
Neither the title nor the article are painting it as an AWS issue, but as a websocket issue, because the protocol implicitly requires all transferred data to be copied multiple times.
- turtlebits 2y ago
  If you call out your vendor, the issue usually lies with some specific issue with them or their service. The title obviously states AWS. If I said that "childbirth cost us 5000 on our <hospital name> bill", you assume the issue is with the hospital.
  - Capricorn2481 2y ago
    Only for people that just read headlines and make technical decisions based on them. Are we catering to them now? The title is factual and straightforward.
    - Nevermark 2y ago
      And also highlights a meaningful irrelevance. The idea that clearer titles are just babying some class of people is perverse. Titles are the foremost means of deciding what to read, for anyone of any sophistication. Clearer titles benefit everyone. The subject matter is meaningful to more than AWS users, but non-AWS users are going to be less likely to read it based on the title.
- bigiain 2y ago
  I disagree. Like @turtlebits, I was waiting for the part of the story where websocket connections between their AWS resources somehow got billed at Amazon's internet data egress rates.
- anitil 2y ago
  I didn't know this - why is this the case?

Is this really an AWS issue? Sounds like you were just burning CPU cycles, which is not AWS related. WebSockets makes it sound like it was a data transfer or API gateway cost.

VWWHFSfQ 2y ago

> Is this really an AWS issue? I doubt they would have even noticed this outrageous cost if they were running on bare-metal Xeons or Ryzen colo'd servers. You can rent real 44-core Xeon servers for like, $250/month. So yes, it's an AWS issue.

JackSlateur 2y ago
You can rent real 44-core Xeon servers for like, $250/month. Where, for instance ?
- Faaak 2y ago
  Hetzner for example. An EPYC 48c (96t) goes for 230 euros
  - dilyevsky 2y ago
    Hetzner network is complete dog. They also sell you machines that are long should be EOL’ed. No serious business should be using them
    - dijit 2y ago
      What cpu do you think your workload is using on AWS? GCP exposes their cpu models, and they have some Haswell and Broadwell lithographies in service. Thats a 10+ year old part, for those paying attention.
      - dilyevsky 2y ago
        Most of GCP and some AWS instances will migrate to another node when it’s faulty. Also disk is virtual. None of this applies to baremetal hetzner
        dijit 2y ago
        Why is that relevant to what I said?
        dilyevsky 2y ago
        Only relevant if you care about reliability
        dijit 2y ago
        AWS was working “fine” for about 10 years without live migration, and I’ve had several individual machines running without a reboot or outage for quite literally half a decade. Enough to hit bugs like this: https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=a00092491en_us&docLocale=en_US https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=a00092... Anyway, depending on individual nodes to always be up for reliability is incredibly foolhardy. Things can happen, cloud isn't magic, I’ve had instances become unrecoverable. Though it is rare. So, I still don’t understand the point, that was not exactly relevant to what I said.
      - tsimionescu 2y ago
        I think they meant that Hetzner is offering specific machines they know to be faulty and should have EOLd to customers, not that they use deprecated CPUs.
        dijit 2y ago
        Thats scary if true, any sources? My google-fu is failing me. :/
        2y ago
    - speedgoose 2y ago
      I know serious businesses using Hetzner for their critical workloads. I wouldn’t unless money is tight, but it is possible. I use them for my non critical stuff, it costs so much less.
    - blibble 2y ago
      I just cat'ed /proc/cpuinfo on my Hetzner and AWS machines AWS: E5-2680 v4 (2016) Hetzner: Ryzen 5 (2019)
      - dilyevsky 2y ago
        Now do hard drives
        blibble 2y ago
        the hetzner one is a dedicated pcie 4.0 nvme device and wrote at 2.3GB/s (O_DIRECT) the AWS one is some emulated block device, no idea what it is, other than it's 20x slower
        luuurker 2y ago
        You keep moving the goal posts with these replies. Hetzner isn't the best provider in the world, but it's also not as bad as you say they are. They're not just renting old servers.
  - throwaway2037 2y ago
    I checked here: https://www.hetzner.com/managed-server/ https://www.hetzner.com/managed-server/ I see "AMD EPYC 7502P 32-Core" for 236 EUR per month. Can you tell me where you see 48c/96t? EDIT I found it! Unbelievable that it is so cheap. https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_from=32%2B64&cpu_type=AMD&price_from=550 https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_...
- GauntletWizard 2y ago
  Hetzner: https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_from=32%2B64 https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/#cores_threads_...
- VWWHFSfQ 2y ago
  There are many colos that offer dedicated server rental/hosting. You can just google for colos in the region you're looking for. I found this one https://www.colocrossing.com/server/dedicated-servers/ https://www.colocrossing.com/server/dedicated-servers/
  - petcat 2y ago
    I don't know anything about Colo Crossing (are they a reseller?) but I would bet their $60 per month 4-core Intel Xeons would outperform a $1,000 per month "compute optimized" EC2 server.
    - fragmede 2y ago
      What benchmark would you like to use?
      - petcat 2y ago
        This blog is about doing video processing on the CPU, so something akin to that.
    - phonon 2y ago
      For $1000 per month you can get a c8g.12xlarge (assuming you use some kind of savings plan).[0] That's 48 cores, 96 GB of RAM and 22.5+ Gbps networking. Of course you still need to pay for storage, egress etc., but you seem to be exaggerating a bit....they do offer a 44 core Broadwell/128 GB RAM option for $229 per month, so AWS is more like a 4x markup[1]....the C8g would likely be much faster at single threaded tasks though[2][3] [0]https://instances.vantage.sh/aws/ec2/c8g.12xlarge?region=us-east-1&os=linux&cost_duration=monthly&reserved_term=Standard.noUpfront https://instances.vantage.sh/aws/ec2/c8g.12xlarge?region=us-... [1]https://portal.colocrossing.com/register/order/service/480 https://portal.colocrossing.com/register/order/service/480 [2]https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8305329 https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8305329 [3]https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/intel-xeon-e5-2699-v4 https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/intel-xeon-e5-2699-...

brazzy 2y ago

Neither the title nor the article are painting it as an AWS issue, but as a websocket issue, because the protocol implicitly requires all transferred data to be copied multiple times.

turtlebits 2y ago
If you call out your vendor, the issue usually lies with some specific issue with them or their service. The title obviously states AWS. If I said that "childbirth cost us 5000 on our <hospital name> bill", you assume the issue is with the hospital.
- Capricorn2481 2y ago
  Only for people that just read headlines and make technical decisions based on them. Are we catering to them now? The title is factual and straightforward.
  - Nevermark 2y ago
    And also highlights a meaningful irrelevance. The idea that clearer titles are just babying some class of people is perverse. Titles are the foremost means of deciding what to read, for anyone of any sophistication. Clearer titles benefit everyone. The subject matter is meaningful to more than AWS users, but non-AWS users are going to be less likely to read it based on the title.
bigiain 2y ago
I disagree. Like @turtlebits, I was waiting for the part of the story where websocket connections between their AWS resources somehow got billed at Amazon's internet data egress rates.
anitil 2y ago
I didn't know this - why is this the case?