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We Shall Fight in the Buttery – Oxford's War 1939–1945

55 points by andrewl 2y ago

Aromasin 2y ago
The Cowley Motor Company factory they mention is still operational and building the Mini to this day (although now owned by the German automaker BWM!)
petesergeant 2y ago
As both town and gown, it's always nice to read about Oxford history. The article doesn't touch on the huge contribution made by students "in the trenches" too so to speak; the UK upper-classes having an unusually strong military tradition. I was reflecting today about the exceptional poetry that came out of the UK during WWI, and I guess academic progress in the UK during WWII is perhaps that war's equivalent
- jlarcombe 2y ago
  Yes, the sight of 60 names on the WW1 memorial board in the JCR at Lincoln was always quite sobering, considering what the student population must have been in 1914. It's still a small college but that would have been an enormous proportion at the time.
pimlottc 2y ago
Can someone explain the title? I get that it's a reference to Churchill's famous "We shall fight on the beaches" speech [0], but why "buttery"? Does it have some particularly significance with regards to Oxford? 0: https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-finest-hour/we-shall-fight-on-the-beaches/ https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-fin...
- milanhbs 2y ago
  Historically a storeroom for provisions in monasteries, in Oxford colleges it is where students get their food. Edit: To clarify, it is pretty much the cafeteria kitchen.
  - nextos 2y ago
    Oxford colleges use quite a lot of antique jargon. Battel is also something related that took me a while to figure out. A battel is an account of items supplied by a buttery, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battel.
    - QuercusMax 2y ago
      And they pronounce 'Magdalen' as 'maudlin' because that's briefly how people pronounced it hundreds of years ago.
  - KineticLensman 2y ago
    > To clarify, it is pretty much the cafeteria kitchen Well, the college refectory - canteen
- sahmeepee 2y ago
  In some colleges it's the bar, e.g. https://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/discover/conferences/dining-at-st-edmund-hall https://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/discover/conferences/dining-at-st-e...
bloopernova 2y ago
Somewhat related, being a book on science and world war 2: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1127842.Most_Secret_War https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1127842.Most_Secret_War Dr R V Jones' Most Secret War is amazing, funny, easy to get into, and tells a great story too: "R.V. Jones's account of his part in British Scientific Intelligence between 1939 and 1949. It was his responsibility to anticipate German applications of science to warfare, so that their new weapons could be countered before they were used. Much of his work had to do with radio navigation, as in the Battle of the Beams, with radar, as in the Allied Bomber Offensive and in the preparations for D-Day and in the war at sea. He was also in charge of intelligence against the V-1 (flying bomb) and the V-2 (rocket) retaliations weapons and, although the Germans were some distance away from success, against their nuclear weapons."
LennyHenrysNuts 2y ago
I come from Coventry. More damage was done after the war by the city council than the Germans ever did. It is one of the few places that I think should have been permanently wiped off the map. It's been an absolute hole since the 1970s.

55 points by andrewl 2y ago

The Cowley Motor Company factory they mention is still operational and building the Mini to this day (although now owned by the German automaker BWM!)

petesergeant 2y ago

As both town and gown, it's always nice to read about Oxford history. The article doesn't touch on the huge contribution made by students "in the trenches" too so to speak; the UK upper-classes having an unusually strong military tradition. I was reflecting today about the exceptional poetry that came out of the UK during WWI, and I guess academic progress in the UK during WWII is perhaps that war's equivalent

jlarcombe 2y ago
Yes, the sight of 60 names on the WW1 memorial board in the JCR at Lincoln was always quite sobering, considering what the student population must have been in 1914. It's still a small college but that would have been an enormous proportion at the time.

pimlottc 2y ago

Can someone explain the title? I get that it's a reference to Churchill's famous "We shall fight on the beaches" speech [0], but why "buttery"? Does it have some particularly significance with regards to Oxford? 0: https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-finest-hour/we-shall-fight-on-the-beaches/ https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-fin...

milanhbs 2y ago
Historically a storeroom for provisions in monasteries, in Oxford colleges it is where students get their food. Edit: To clarify, it is pretty much the cafeteria kitchen.
- nextos 2y ago
  Oxford colleges use quite a lot of antique jargon. Battel is also something related that took me a while to figure out. A battel is an account of items supplied by a buttery, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battel.
  - QuercusMax 2y ago
    And they pronounce 'Magdalen' as 'maudlin' because that's briefly how people pronounced it hundreds of years ago.
- KineticLensman 2y ago
  > To clarify, it is pretty much the cafeteria kitchen Well, the college refectory - canteen
sahmeepee 2y ago
In some colleges it's the bar, e.g. https://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/discover/conferences/dining-at-st-edmund-hall https://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/discover/conferences/dining-at-st-e...

bloopernova 2y ago

Somewhat related, being a book on science and world war 2: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1127842.Most_Secret_War https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1127842.Most_Secret_War Dr R V Jones' Most Secret War is amazing, funny, easy to get into, and tells a great story too: "R.V. Jones's account of his part in British Scientific Intelligence between 1939 and 1949. It was his responsibility to anticipate German applications of science to warfare, so that their new weapons could be countered before they were used. Much of his work had to do with radio navigation, as in the Battle of the Beams, with radar, as in the Allied Bomber Offensive and in the preparations for D-Day and in the war at sea. He was also in charge of intelligence against the V-1 (flying bomb) and the V-2 (rocket) retaliations weapons and, although the Germans were some distance away from success, against their nuclear weapons."

LennyHenrysNuts 2y ago

I come from Coventry. More damage was done after the war by the city council than the Germans ever did. It is one of the few places that I think should have been permanently wiped off the map. It's been an absolute hole since the 1970s.