3 ms·

I read about this hypothesis many years ago. I never quite understood why it would not be the case that the book of Mark might be the original source, with Q b

I read about this hypothesis many years ago. I never quite understood why it would not be the case that the book of Mark might be the original source, with Q being a Mark derivative, and Matthew and Luke being a Q derivative

AdmiralAsshat 2y ago
So looking at this chart for the moment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_Gospels#/media/File:Relationship_between_synoptic_gospels-en.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_Gospels#/media/File:R... From my understanding (I did have a BA in this at one time but it's been over 10 years, so, memory's a bit rusty), the "triple tradition" part is the section where scholars believe Matthew and Luke used Mark as a source. The "Double tradition" is the part where Matthew and Luke agree but deviate from Mark, and hence are the imagined "Q" source material. Then there are the sources/traditions known only to Luke or Matthew. You will notice, however, the orange and red lines indicating instances where Mark and Luke or Mark and Matthew attest, but not with all three. I think those could potentially make your theory unlikely. Because if Q were derivative of Mark, then in theory there shouldn't be anything in Q that wasn't already in Mark. But for there to be some lines that are in Matthew/Mark or Luke/Mark but not in the double tradition would suggest that they had a Q-annotated version of a passage, but opted to drop it in favor of the Mark version. Why would they do that?
- LarsDu88 2y ago
  I suppose there could have been something like Q derives from Mark but overwrites or omits some details, then Matthew and Luke are written by authors with access to both Mark and Q but are unsure which source has precedence. This rooted hypothesis would still have Mark be the source of all gospels.
kyle_grove 2y ago
As I understand it, the Q-hypothesis is often situated within the hypothesis of Marcan priority (Mark was the source for Luke and Matthew), and Q is a way of explaining agreements within Luke and Matthew that are not also found in Mark. The hypothesis would be that Luke and Matthew each combined text from Mark with Q.

AdmiralAsshat 2y ago

So looking at this chart for the moment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_Gospels#/media/File:Relationship_between_synoptic_gospels-en.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_Gospels#/media/File:R... From my understanding (I did have a BA in this at one time but it's been over 10 years, so, memory's a bit rusty), the "triple tradition" part is the section where scholars believe Matthew and Luke used Mark as a source. The "Double tradition" is the part where Matthew and Luke agree but deviate from Mark, and hence are the imagined "Q" source material. Then there are the sources/traditions known only to Luke or Matthew. You will notice, however, the orange and red lines indicating instances where Mark and Luke or Mark and Matthew attest, but not with all three. I think those could potentially make your theory unlikely. Because if Q were derivative of Mark, then in theory there shouldn't be anything in Q that wasn't already in Mark. But for there to be some lines that are in Matthew/Mark or Luke/Mark but not in the double tradition would suggest that they had a Q-annotated version of a passage, but opted to drop it in favor of the Mark version. Why would they do that?

LarsDu88 2y ago
I suppose there could have been something like Q derives from Mark but overwrites or omits some details, then Matthew and Luke are written by authors with access to both Mark and Q but are unsure which source has precedence. This rooted hypothesis would still have Mark be the source of all gospels.

kyle_grove 2y ago

As I understand it, the Q-hypothesis is often situated within the hypothesis of Marcan priority (Mark was the source for Luke and Matthew), and Q is a way of explaining agreements within Luke and Matthew that are not also found in Mark. The hypothesis would be that Luke and Matthew each combined text from Mark with Q.