8 ms·

Since this thread seems to be about niche asks for pro users, despite the product being targeted towards casual users who want an easy out of the box experience

by jjcm 2y ago

Since this thread seems to be about niche asks for pro users, despite the product being targeted towards casual users who want an easy out of the box experience, I'll add my own to the mix. I'd love a bigger/better screen on these, specifically an ultrawide variety. An iMac Pro with an 8k ultrawide would be a near-instant purchase for me. I find the ultrawide form factor so good for productivity. I love the apple "it just works" approach to their hardware, so if something was fully integrated I'd jump on it immediately. Today I use a 49" CRG9, but the input and connection setup is somewhat finicky. Not a huge blocker, but it would be lovely to be able to simplify.

giobox 2y ago
I also use and love the exact same 49" CRG9, but if you do the 2x retina math, to deliver the pixel pitch Apple customers expect on desktop in the 32:9 display form, that would realistically have to be a 10240x2880 display at a minimum of 60fps. Not sure if there are bandwidth considerations over displayport or similar as this is essentially two 5k Studio Displays (5120x2880) side by side at that point. I love my CRG9 with MacOS, but there's no escaping the text rendering is significantly poorer than on Apple's own 2x retina stuff.
- blairbeckwith 2y ago
  TB4 should be able to handle that resolution – I am running 2x Studio Displays + gigabit ethernet + countless USD devices in to one TB4 port on my MacBook via a TB4 dock.
  - peterldowns 2y ago
    Which dock are you using? Looking to get one + a large display, and share both between my windows desktop and mac laptop.
    - blairbeckwith 2y ago
      I am using the CalDigit TS4+. Expensive, but flawless.
      - peterldowns 2y ago
        Thank you!
phillco 2y ago
Incidentally, it was observed that the new iMac can support an external 8K 120Hz display: https://x.com/vadimyuryev/status/1850929080281321899 https://x.com/vadimyuryev/status/1850929080281321899
- throwaway48476 2y ago
  Not sure how that's possible. With 80gbit you can only do 8K 90hz. 120hz would need the 120gbit of the 3 lane alt mode of thunderbolt 5.
  - whatever1 2y ago
    Maybe some sort of compression?
    - throwaway48476 2y ago
      That level of compression would kill latency and cause artifacts.
      - wtallis 2y ago
        Either Display Stream Compression or 4:2:2 chroma subsampling will easily make 8k120 fit into 80Gb/s with minimal added latency and artifacts that are barely visible to the trained eye.
        throwaway48476 2y ago
        Must be subsampling because DSC gets you to 70hz at 8K.
        whatever1 2y ago
        They fixed the spec sheet. Now they report 8k60hz.
OnlyMortal 2y ago
People also don’t get the idea of an appliance.
dllu 2y ago
Using a large 8K display for productivity is underrated. I wrote a blog post about my experience: https://daniel.lawrence.lu/blog/y2023m12d15/ https://daniel.lawrence.lu/blog/y2023m12d15/
- throwaway48476 2y ago
  Why not the 55" 8K? Also the checkerboard is because you're not using variable refresh rate. You need to turn on game mode for the TV and VRR in OS display setting.
  - dllu 2y ago
    I can't find any. The newer QN800D or whatever aren't available in 55". And they don't make the QN700B anymore. EDIT: Also wow I've been using this QN800A for like 3 years with the checkerboard problem without realizing that enabling variable refresh rate solves the problem. Thanks for the pro tip!!!
    - throwaway48476 2y ago
      I have the QN700B. It seems almost small to me at this point. Can you get VRR to work on linux?
      - dllu 2y ago
        Yes, "G Sync on unverified devices" seems to work on nvidia-settings on Linux.
- vehemenz 2y ago
  You've convinced me, but it really shows the limitations for 16:9 when these are our options. Two largish 28" 4:3 monitors would be a nice middle ground.
  - jjcm 2y ago
    Consider the samsung 57" ultrawide. ‎7680x2160 resolution. Lots of usable space, but a better form factor for productivity than a TV. https://www.amazon.com/SAMSUNG-DisplayPort-Mini-LED-DisplayHDR-LS57CG952NNXZA/dp/B0CDQM55C9 https://www.amazon.com/SAMSUNG-DisplayPort-Mini-LED-DisplayH...
zitterbewegung 2y ago
Unfortunately the iMac Pro was a stopgap measure similar to the 16 inch iMac that had the escape key. Even the last MacBook Air with Intel is really a testbed for the design of the first M1 MacBook Air (the mainboard is the only thing that changed). Apple has taken the steps to make the Mac Studio and other display devices made by them but, curved displays don't seem to be a strategy that Apple would take because right now they might move to tandem OLED on all devices which means even considering something curved isn't on the drawing board.
ffsm8 2y ago
[flagged]
- cafed00d 2y ago
  > Or please tell me how to use the magic mouse while it's charging? Am I just holding it wrong? is that really a deal-breaking decision to buy an iMac? Yeah, sure, I agree it's super silly design that they put the port under the mouse; but c'mon, does it really matter? As far as I can tell, I have never had to explain to my 61 year old Indian mother how to use a Mac as much as I have had to debug every little thing on Windows PCs. Macs & Apple products _truly_ do "just work"
  - ffsm8 2y ago
    Can you read? I guess not, because I literally even wrote that it's a great OS? It just doesn't just work and has issues. That doesn't mean that windows or Linux dont have issues. They do, they all have their warts and that's fine. But that makes the slogan "it just works" idiotic. It has the by far best vertical integration with the least issues switching devices, sure. That still doesn't make "it just works" a reality, because that's an unachievable pipedream!
  - nidnogg 2y ago
    How can you say "does it really" matter to something as stupid as the chargig port under the mouse? It's in-your-face, outrageously bad design and very much in line with "not just works". It's one thing to pay a comparative fortune for a mouse that's got mostly looks going for it; it's another to have to uproot your work/free time because your mouse ran out of batteries and you didn't routinely charge it like a phone overnight. Yes, of course it matters. It matters because it's dumb and we pay the dumbness price. People paying for it regardless is the reason it continues the way it is.
- sureIy 2y ago
  Can you stop? It takes 5 minutes to charge. It tells you hours in advance. Take a break and charge it. If you want a cabled mouse, just get a $5 cabled mouse.
wodenokoto 2y ago
iMac Pro with HDMI in would be a purchase for me. The screen will outlive the computer hardware, yet an imac is cheaper than a studio display.
- magarnicle 2y ago
  How much of an advantage is this over a mini or studio with an external display?
  - wnissen 2y ago
    There's no advantage whatsoever unless you like the look of a display with a huge "chin" and hate cables with a firey passion. Using list prices, the iMac costs $300 less than a studio display with the same screen. You get a whole computer for negative money. Shows you how much money Apple makes on storage and RAM upgrades! But of course it won't remain useful for as long. I know people who are still using the Cinema Displays from over 10 years ago.
    - wtallis 2y ago
      > Using list prices, the iMac costs $300 less than a studio display with the same screen. I think the old 27" iMac may have used the same screen as the current Studio Display, but the current iMac has a smaller and lower-resolution display.
      - wnissen 2y ago
        Oh, you are right, apologies. You can get a pretty nice 27" 4K IPS monitor for less than $250, but not from Apple. Would probably depend on whether your eyes are good enough to tell the difference between 163 ppi and Apple's practically proprietary 218.
bbkane 2y ago
I tried an ultrawide, but had trouble with window management - I need to make 4+ apps visible at the same time and found that a lot easier with 2 displays and the Rectangles app
- mulletbum 2y ago
  Use Magnet with Left and Right snapping. It works perfectly fine on an ultrawide.
r00fus 2y ago
I have the same monitor and honestly BetterDisplay.app has made the CRG9 a lot better - it fakes HiDPI so you have much larger readable text (my eyes ain't what they used to be). Before that app, I was leaning into my monitor, now I sit back and enjoy.
gilgoomesh 2y ago
I'd love a Mac-targeted ultra-wide at any size. Unfortunately, there aren't any ultra-wide panels with 200dpi resolutions (Apple's version of retina for desktop). Most top out around 140dpi and therefore need to be run at scaled resolutions (i.e. blurry) for macOS.
- hollerith 2y ago
  Need to be run at a scaled resolution or have everything be bigger. I'd choose the latter.
- adastra22 2y ago
  I decided to fix this by having my eyes go bad as I age. Icons taking up larger screen real estate isn't a big deal anyway when the monitor is so big--your eyes aren't as close to the edges, where those icons often live.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

by jjcm 2y ago

giobox 2y ago

I also use and love the exact same 49" CRG9, but if you do the 2x retina math, to deliver the pixel pitch Apple customers expect on desktop in the 32:9 display form, that would realistically have to be a 10240x2880 display at a minimum of 60fps. Not sure if there are bandwidth considerations over displayport or similar as this is essentially two 5k Studio Displays (5120x2880) side by side at that point. I love my CRG9 with MacOS, but there's no escaping the text rendering is significantly poorer than on Apple's own 2x retina stuff.

blairbeckwith 2y ago
TB4 should be able to handle that resolution – I am running 2x Studio Displays + gigabit ethernet + countless USD devices in to one TB4 port on my MacBook via a TB4 dock.
- peterldowns 2y ago
  Which dock are you using? Looking to get one + a large display, and share both between my windows desktop and mac laptop.
  - blairbeckwith 2y ago
    I am using the CalDigit TS4+. Expensive, but flawless.
    - peterldowns 2y ago
      Thank you!

phillco 2y ago

Incidentally, it was observed that the new iMac can support an external 8K 120Hz display: https://x.com/vadimyuryev/status/1850929080281321899 https://x.com/vadimyuryev/status/1850929080281321899

throwaway48476 2y ago
Not sure how that's possible. With 80gbit you can only do 8K 90hz. 120hz would need the 120gbit of the 3 lane alt mode of thunderbolt 5.
- whatever1 2y ago
  Maybe some sort of compression?
  - throwaway48476 2y ago
    That level of compression would kill latency and cause artifacts.
    - wtallis 2y ago
      Either Display Stream Compression or 4:2:2 chroma subsampling will easily make 8k120 fit into 80Gb/s with minimal added latency and artifacts that are barely visible to the trained eye.
      - throwaway48476 2y ago
        Must be subsampling because DSC gets you to 70hz at 8K.
        whatever1 2y ago
        They fixed the spec sheet. Now they report 8k60hz.

OnlyMortal 2y ago

People also don’t get the idea of an appliance.

dllu 2y ago

Using a large 8K display for productivity is underrated. I wrote a blog post about my experience: https://daniel.lawrence.lu/blog/y2023m12d15/ https://daniel.lawrence.lu/blog/y2023m12d15/

throwaway48476 2y ago
Why not the 55" 8K? Also the checkerboard is because you're not using variable refresh rate. You need to turn on game mode for the TV and VRR in OS display setting.
- dllu 2y ago
  I can't find any. The newer QN800D or whatever aren't available in 55". And they don't make the QN700B anymore. EDIT: Also wow I've been using this QN800A for like 3 years with the checkerboard problem without realizing that enabling variable refresh rate solves the problem. Thanks for the pro tip!!!
  - throwaway48476 2y ago
    I have the QN700B. It seems almost small to me at this point. Can you get VRR to work on linux?
    - dllu 2y ago
      Yes, "G Sync on unverified devices" seems to work on nvidia-settings on Linux.
vehemenz 2y ago
You've convinced me, but it really shows the limitations for 16:9 when these are our options. Two largish 28" 4:3 monitors would be a nice middle ground.
- jjcm 2y ago
  Consider the samsung 57" ultrawide. ‎7680x2160 resolution. Lots of usable space, but a better form factor for productivity than a TV. https://www.amazon.com/SAMSUNG-DisplayPort-Mini-LED-DisplayHDR-LS57CG952NNXZA/dp/B0CDQM55C9 https://www.amazon.com/SAMSUNG-DisplayPort-Mini-LED-DisplayH...

zitterbewegung 2y ago

Unfortunately the iMac Pro was a stopgap measure similar to the 16 inch iMac that had the escape key. Even the last MacBook Air with Intel is really a testbed for the design of the first M1 MacBook Air (the mainboard is the only thing that changed). Apple has taken the steps to make the Mac Studio and other display devices made by them but, curved displays don't seem to be a strategy that Apple would take because right now they might move to tandem OLED on all devices which means even considering something curved isn't on the drawing board.

ffsm8 2y ago

[flagged]

cafed00d 2y ago
> Or please tell me how to use the magic mouse while it's charging? Am I just holding it wrong? is that really a deal-breaking decision to buy an iMac? Yeah, sure, I agree it's super silly design that they put the port under the mouse; but c'mon, does it really matter? As far as I can tell, I have never had to explain to my 61 year old Indian mother how to use a Mac as much as I have had to debug every little thing on Windows PCs. Macs & Apple products _truly_ do "just work"
- ffsm8 2y ago
  Can you read? I guess not, because I literally even wrote that it's a great OS? It just doesn't just work and has issues. That doesn't mean that windows or Linux dont have issues. They do, they all have their warts and that's fine. But that makes the slogan "it just works" idiotic. It has the by far best vertical integration with the least issues switching devices, sure. That still doesn't make "it just works" a reality, because that's an unachievable pipedream!
- nidnogg 2y ago
  How can you say "does it really" matter to something as stupid as the chargig port under the mouse? It's in-your-face, outrageously bad design and very much in line with "not just works". It's one thing to pay a comparative fortune for a mouse that's got mostly looks going for it; it's another to have to uproot your work/free time because your mouse ran out of batteries and you didn't routinely charge it like a phone overnight. Yes, of course it matters. It matters because it's dumb and we pay the dumbness price. People paying for it regardless is the reason it continues the way it is.
sureIy 2y ago
Can you stop? It takes 5 minutes to charge. It tells you hours in advance. Take a break and charge it. If you want a cabled mouse, just get a $5 cabled mouse.

wodenokoto 2y ago

iMac Pro with HDMI in would be a purchase for me. The screen will outlive the computer hardware, yet an imac is cheaper than a studio display.

magarnicle 2y ago
How much of an advantage is this over a mini or studio with an external display?
- wnissen 2y ago
  There's no advantage whatsoever unless you like the look of a display with a huge "chin" and hate cables with a firey passion. Using list prices, the iMac costs $300 less than a studio display with the same screen. You get a whole computer for negative money. Shows you how much money Apple makes on storage and RAM upgrades! But of course it won't remain useful for as long. I know people who are still using the Cinema Displays from over 10 years ago.
  - wtallis 2y ago
    > Using list prices, the iMac costs $300 less than a studio display with the same screen. I think the old 27" iMac may have used the same screen as the current Studio Display, but the current iMac has a smaller and lower-resolution display.
    - wnissen 2y ago
      Oh, you are right, apologies. You can get a pretty nice 27" 4K IPS monitor for less than $250, but not from Apple. Would probably depend on whether your eyes are good enough to tell the difference between 163 ppi and Apple's practically proprietary 218.

bbkane 2y ago

I tried an ultrawide, but had trouble with window management - I need to make 4+ apps visible at the same time and found that a lot easier with 2 displays and the Rectangles app

mulletbum 2y ago
Use Magnet with Left and Right snapping. It works perfectly fine on an ultrawide.

r00fus 2y ago

I have the same monitor and honestly BetterDisplay.app has made the CRG9 a lot better - it fakes HiDPI so you have much larger readable text (my eyes ain't what they used to be). Before that app, I was leaning into my monitor, now I sit back and enjoy.

gilgoomesh 2y ago

I'd love a Mac-targeted ultra-wide at any size. Unfortunately, there aren't any ultra-wide panels with 200dpi resolutions (Apple's version of retina for desktop). Most top out around 140dpi and therefore need to be run at scaled resolutions (i.e. blurry) for macOS.

hollerith 2y ago
Need to be run at a scaled resolution or have everything be bigger. I'd choose the latter.
adastra22 2y ago
I decided to fix this by having my eyes go bad as I age. Icons taking up larger screen real estate isn't a big deal anyway when the monitor is so big--your eyes aren't as close to the edges, where those icons often live.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]