4 ms·

For those wondering where this new git-survey command is, it's actually not in git.git yet! The author is using microsoft's git fork, they've added this new co

by tux3 2y ago

For those wondering where this new git-survey command is, it's actually not in git.git yet! The author is using microsoft's git fork, they've added this new command just this summer: https://github.com/microsoft/git/pull/667 https://github.com/microsoft/git/pull/667

masklinn 2y ago
I assume full-name-hash and path-walk are also only in the fork as well (or in git HEAD)? Can't see them in the man pages, or in the 2.47 changelog.
- tux3 2y ago
  Yep. Path-walk is currently pending review here: https://lore.kernel.org/all/pull.1813.git.1728396723.gitgitgadget@gmail.com/T/ https://lore.kernel.org/all/pull.1813.git.1728396723.gitgitg... It more or less replaces the --full-name-hash option (again a very good cover letter that explains the differences and pros/cons of each very well!)
clktmr 2y ago
[flagged]
- throwuxiytayq 2y ago
  Can you elaborate how exactly git is at risk here? These posts never do.
  - coliveira 2y ago
    They will extend git so that it works extremely well with their proprietary products, and just average with other tools and operating systems. That's always the goal for MS.
    - wbl 2y ago
      You know who the maintainer of Git is right?
      - semiquaver 2y ago
        Junio Hamano. Or did you confuse git and GitHub?
- PoignardAzur 2y ago
  Oh for crying out loud. "EEE" isn't a magic incantation, it's the name of an actual policy with actual tangible steps that their executives were implementing back when the CEO thought open source was the greatest threat to their business model. Microsoft contributing to a project doesn't automatically make it EEE. For one thing, EEE was about adopting open standards in proprietary software. Microsoft during EEE didn't publish GPL code like this is.
  - haolez 2y ago
    Well, most of their extensions to VSCode are proprietary. When their dominance in software development becomes irreversible, it's obvious that they will close things down and create new sources of income. The incentives are clear.
    - madeofpalk 2y ago
      What has VS Code got to do with any of this?
    - mb7733 2y ago
      VSCode is _their_ product. It doesn't make sense to say that they are EEEing their own product. EEE is when you take some existing open standard, support it in proprietary a product, and then extend it in proprietary ways, thereby taking over the standard. It doesn't apply for a product that you originally created.
      - jasonm23 2y ago
        .... Fork not an original creation that's how effective eee is, you don't know (or likely care) where MS ripped all this code. This is not an accident. It's the point.
        mb7733 2y ago
        Are you saying that VSCode is a fork of a non-Microsoft product? Which one?
- atombender 2y ago
  Why? You do realize their fork is open source? The fix described in this post have been submitted as a patch to the official Git project. The fix is improving a legitimate inefficiency in Git, and does nothing towards "embracing", "extending", or "extinguishing" anything.
  - dijit 2y ago
    you are in the early extend phase. it will look good, until the extensions get more and more proprietary- but absurdly useful.
    - acdha 2y ago
      The extend phase starts when they make extensions which only work in their proprietary version. Putting extensive work into contributing them back is not the same.
      - dijit 2y ago
        Ok. There are a dozen examples of exactly this behaviour, and exactly this argumentation in response over the years. Right now the most important thing for them is for people to start thinking the microsoft fork is the superior one, even if things are “backported”.
        atombender 2y ago
        Which examples?
        dijit 2y ago
        VSCode is a prominent one that is in everyones mind, its starting its journey into extinguish. For more examples I would consult your local greybeard; since the pattern is broad enough that you can reasonably argue that “this time, its different” which is also what you hear every single time it happens.
- maccard 2y ago
  No, this is cathedral vs bazaar development
- szundi 2y ago
  This comment is downvoted, however you can be sure that managers in these corporations make these decisions deliberately - like half the time. I find these insightful reminders. Use the vanilla free versions if the difference is negligeble.

by tux3 2y ago

masklinn 2y ago

I assume full-name-hash and path-walk are also only in the fork as well (or in git HEAD)? Can't see them in the man pages, or in the 2.47 changelog.

tux3 2y ago
Yep. Path-walk is currently pending review here: https://lore.kernel.org/all/pull.1813.git.1728396723.gitgitgadget@gmail.com/T/ https://lore.kernel.org/all/pull.1813.git.1728396723.gitgitg... It more or less replaces the --full-name-hash option (again a very good cover letter that explains the differences and pros/cons of each very well!)

clktmr 2y ago

[flagged]

throwuxiytayq 2y ago
Can you elaborate how exactly git is at risk here? These posts never do.
- coliveira 2y ago
  They will extend git so that it works extremely well with their proprietary products, and just average with other tools and operating systems. That's always the goal for MS.
  - wbl 2y ago
    You know who the maintainer of Git is right?
    - semiquaver 2y ago
      Junio Hamano. Or did you confuse git and GitHub?
PoignardAzur 2y ago
Oh for crying out loud. "EEE" isn't a magic incantation, it's the name of an actual policy with actual tangible steps that their executives were implementing back when the CEO thought open source was the greatest threat to their business model. Microsoft contributing to a project doesn't automatically make it EEE. For one thing, EEE was about adopting open standards in proprietary software. Microsoft during EEE didn't publish GPL code like this is.
- haolez 2y ago
  Well, most of their extensions to VSCode are proprietary. When their dominance in software development becomes irreversible, it's obvious that they will close things down and create new sources of income. The incentives are clear.
  - madeofpalk 2y ago
    What has VS Code got to do with any of this?
  - mb7733 2y ago
    VSCode is _their_ product. It doesn't make sense to say that they are EEEing their own product. EEE is when you take some existing open standard, support it in proprietary a product, and then extend it in proprietary ways, thereby taking over the standard. It doesn't apply for a product that you originally created.
    - jasonm23 2y ago
      .... Fork not an original creation that's how effective eee is, you don't know (or likely care) where MS ripped all this code. This is not an accident. It's the point.
      - mb7733 2y ago
        Are you saying that VSCode is a fork of a non-Microsoft product? Which one?
atombender 2y ago
Why? You do realize their fork is open source? The fix described in this post have been submitted as a patch to the official Git project. The fix is improving a legitimate inefficiency in Git, and does nothing towards "embracing", "extending", or "extinguishing" anything.
- dijit 2y ago
  you are in the early extend phase. it will look good, until the extensions get more and more proprietary- but absurdly useful.
  - acdha 2y ago
    The extend phase starts when they make extensions which only work in their proprietary version. Putting extensive work into contributing them back is not the same.
    - dijit 2y ago
      Ok. There are a dozen examples of exactly this behaviour, and exactly this argumentation in response over the years. Right now the most important thing for them is for people to start thinking the microsoft fork is the superior one, even if things are “backported”.
      - atombender 2y ago
        Which examples?
        dijit 2y ago
        VSCode is a prominent one that is in everyones mind, its starting its journey into extinguish. For more examples I would consult your local greybeard; since the pattern is broad enough that you can reasonably argue that “this time, its different” which is also what you hear every single time it happens.
maccard 2y ago
No, this is cathedral vs bazaar development
szundi 2y ago
This comment is downvoted, however you can be sure that managers in these corporations make these decisions deliberately - like half the time. I find these insightful reminders. Use the vanilla free versions if the difference is negligeble.