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How long until it can quickly without you noticing add a daemon running on your system. This is the equivalent of how we used to worry about Soviet spies gettin

How long until it can quickly without you noticing add a daemon running on your system. This is the equivalent of how we used to worry about Soviet spies getting access to US secrets, and now we just post them online for everyone to see. There's no antivirus or firewall today that can protect your files from the ability this could have to wreck havoc on your network, let alone your computer. This scene comes to mind: https://makeagif.com/i/BA7Yt3 https://makeagif.com/i/BA7Yt3

tomjen3 2y ago
Easy! We treat it as what it is - another user. Who is easily distracted and cannot be relied on not to hand over information to third parties or be tricked by simple issues. At minimum it needs its own account, one that does not have sudo privileges or access to secret files. At best it needs its own VM. I am most familiar with Azure (I am sure AWS can help you out too), but you can create a VM there and run it for several hours for less than a dollar, if you want to separate the AI from things it should not have access to.
- Groxx 2y ago
  "not hand over information to third parties" is the hard part though, as that often looks no different from "get useful data from third parties". Particularly when it can be smuggled into GET params, a la `www.usefulfeature.com/?q=weather_today_injected_phone_8675309`. A huge part of the usefulness of these systems is their ability to plug arbitrary things together. Which also means arbitrary holes. Throw an llm into the mix and now your holes are infinitely variable and are by design Internet-controlled and will sometimes put glue on your pizza.
- Rygian 2y ago
  You don't only need a VM. You also need network isolation from the rest of your network (unless you already expose your whole network as routable on the Internet).
kcorbitt 2y ago
On the one hand very true, but on the other hand if you're a dev any python or nodejs package you install and run could do the same thing and the world mostly continues working.
- Rygian 2y ago
  That reasoning can be restated as "it's already really bad, so why not make it a bit worse".
  - IshKebab 2y ago
    Or "it's not a significant risk in practice".
- MetaWhirledPeas 2y ago
  Those packages presumably have eyeballs on the source, deterministic output, and versions to control updates. That's pretty good compared to an automaton with slightly unknowable behavior patterns that is subject to unpredictable outside influences.
klabb3 2y ago
> How long until it can quickly without you noticing add a daemon running on your system. A (production) system like this is already such a daemon. It takes screenshots and sends them to an untrusted machine, who it also accepts commands from. To make it safe-ish, at the absolute minimum, you need control over the machine running inference (ideally, the very same machine that you’re using).
heroprotagonist 2y ago
You just have to wait for Windows to update, it'll come built-in. No need to download some functional and possibly privacy-protecting thing from the internet.

tomjen3 2y ago

Easy! We treat it as what it is - another user. Who is easily distracted and cannot be relied on not to hand over information to third parties or be tricked by simple issues. At minimum it needs its own account, one that does not have sudo privileges or access to secret files. At best it needs its own VM. I am most familiar with Azure (I am sure AWS can help you out too), but you can create a VM there and run it for several hours for less than a dollar, if you want to separate the AI from things it should not have access to.

Groxx 2y ago
"not hand over information to third parties" is the hard part though, as that often looks no different from "get useful data from third parties". Particularly when it can be smuggled into GET params, a la `www.usefulfeature.com/?q=weather_today_injected_phone_8675309`. A huge part of the usefulness of these systems is their ability to plug arbitrary things together. Which also means arbitrary holes. Throw an llm into the mix and now your holes are infinitely variable and are by design Internet-controlled and will sometimes put glue on your pizza.
Rygian 2y ago
You don't only need a VM. You also need network isolation from the rest of your network (unless you already expose your whole network as routable on the Internet).

kcorbitt 2y ago

On the one hand very true, but on the other hand if you're a dev any python or nodejs package you install and run could do the same thing and the world mostly continues working.

Rygian 2y ago
That reasoning can be restated as "it's already really bad, so why not make it a bit worse".
- IshKebab 2y ago
  Or "it's not a significant risk in practice".
MetaWhirledPeas 2y ago
Those packages presumably have eyeballs on the source, deterministic output, and versions to control updates. That's pretty good compared to an automaton with slightly unknowable behavior patterns that is subject to unpredictable outside influences.

klabb3 2y ago

> How long until it can quickly without you noticing add a daemon running on your system. A (production) system like this is already such a daemon. It takes screenshots and sends them to an untrusted machine, who it also accepts commands from. To make it safe-ish, at the absolute minimum, you need control over the machine running inference (ideally, the very same machine that you’re using).

heroprotagonist 2y ago

You just have to wait for Windows to update, it'll come built-in. No need to download some functional and possibly privacy-protecting thing from the internet.