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If that headline doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about Artemis… The sooner this program gets canned the better. Suppliers aren’t even pretending t

If that headline doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about Artemis… The sooner this program gets canned the better. Suppliers aren’t even pretending to give value for money anymore.

systemvoltage 2y ago
Great article by Bloomberg: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-10-17/michael-bloomberg-nasa-s-artemis-moon-mission-is-a-colossal-waste https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-10-17/michae...
philwelch 2y ago
Artemis probably is a boondoggle, but the headline isn’t necessarily an indication of that. The Apollo spacesuits were manufactured by Playtex, by the same seamstresses that made their bras at the time, supposedly because they were the most qualified to do the work. When it comes to manufacturing small quantities of high quality textiles (which is, in part, exactly what a spacesuit is), this is exactly the kind of business partnership that makes sense.
- ls612 2y ago
  Really most of Artemis is well run. They got Starship to provide their lander, they are aiming for Shakleton Crater where there is likely ice in the permanent shadows, they are just stuck with SLS for their human lifter because Congress said so. It will be comical seeing the little Orion spacecraft docking with the HLS, really a testament to how new space is leaving old space in the dustbin of history.
  - philwelch 2y ago
    I’m not really convinced with the Lunar Gateway either, but we’ll see.
dotnet00 2y ago
This is probably one of the better run parts of Artemis, considering that it's a fixed price milestone-based contract awarded after NASA realized they were getting nowhere on their own suit after spending 13 years working on them, with the OIG predicting each of those original suits would cost $500M with the way they were going. The least value for money parts are pretty much entirely SLS related, with most of them involving blank checks handed out to legacy contractors with no real consequences for poor performance.
ok_dad 2y ago
What? Prada is a cutting edge fabric technology and garment manufacturing company. They have been working on the edge of fashion, which is nothing to scoff at. If you judge the world by headlines, please consider how much you’ll miss out on. > "I'm very proud of the result we're showing today," said Lorenzo Bertelli, Prada Group chief marketing officer and head of corporate social responsibility. "We've shared our expertise on high-performance materials, features and sewing techniques, and we learned a lot."
- mmooss 2y ago
  What else has Prada done that is high-functional? For example, do they make garments for militaries? Deep sea diving? Work in dangerous/toxic environments?
  - ok_dad 2y ago
    Prada makes tons of luggage, which from what I’ve seen and heard hold up well. They are well known for their luggage. A lot of people look down on these types of fashion brands, as of the fashion industry isn’t a huge important part of humanity, allowing us to keep our bodies safe from the weather and conditions outdoors. Fashion is one of the most important and well researched industries, and the technology they innovate with is the whole reason we can even begin to think about sending humans to space. Do you think a bunch of nerds in NASA are able to understand the best stitching and materials to use, and how to best design joints to allow the great freedom of movement? No way, you need the experts, like Prada.
    - mmooss 2y ago
      Luggage doesn't seem to be a great qualification. I listed several fields which might have relevant experience: deep sea diving, work gear for toxic environments, military, etc. Luggage for my transatlantic flight doesn't seem like the same thing. > A lot of people look down on these types of fashion brands That strawperson has nothing to do with me or how well Prada can deliver. > Do you think a bunch of nerds in NASA are able to understand They do pretty well; I wouldn't dismiss them. They're leading technology organization in the history of humanity. And they have much more experience making space suits than Prada - or anyone else in the world. Also, your comment about NASA is not unlike the strawperson comments about Prada that you criticize.

If that headline doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about Artemis… The sooner this program gets canned the better. Suppliers aren’t even pretending to give value for money anymore.

systemvoltage 2y ago

Great article by Bloomberg: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-10-17/michael-bloomberg-nasa-s-artemis-moon-mission-is-a-colossal-waste https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-10-17/michae...

philwelch 2y ago

Artemis probably is a boondoggle, but the headline isn’t necessarily an indication of that. The Apollo spacesuits were manufactured by Playtex, by the same seamstresses that made their bras at the time, supposedly because they were the most qualified to do the work. When it comes to manufacturing small quantities of high quality textiles (which is, in part, exactly what a spacesuit is), this is exactly the kind of business partnership that makes sense.

ls612 2y ago
Really most of Artemis is well run. They got Starship to provide their lander, they are aiming for Shakleton Crater where there is likely ice in the permanent shadows, they are just stuck with SLS for their human lifter because Congress said so. It will be comical seeing the little Orion spacecraft docking with the HLS, really a testament to how new space is leaving old space in the dustbin of history.
- philwelch 2y ago
  I’m not really convinced with the Lunar Gateway either, but we’ll see.

dotnet00 2y ago

This is probably one of the better run parts of Artemis, considering that it's a fixed price milestone-based contract awarded after NASA realized they were getting nowhere on their own suit after spending 13 years working on them, with the OIG predicting each of those original suits would cost $500M with the way they were going. The least value for money parts are pretty much entirely SLS related, with most of them involving blank checks handed out to legacy contractors with no real consequences for poor performance.

ok_dad 2y ago

What? Prada is a cutting edge fabric technology and garment manufacturing company. They have been working on the edge of fashion, which is nothing to scoff at. If you judge the world by headlines, please consider how much you’ll miss out on. > "I'm very proud of the result we're showing today," said Lorenzo Bertelli, Prada Group chief marketing officer and head of corporate social responsibility. "We've shared our expertise on high-performance materials, features and sewing techniques, and we learned a lot."

mmooss 2y ago
What else has Prada done that is high-functional? For example, do they make garments for militaries? Deep sea diving? Work in dangerous/toxic environments?
- ok_dad 2y ago
  Prada makes tons of luggage, which from what I’ve seen and heard hold up well. They are well known for their luggage. A lot of people look down on these types of fashion brands, as of the fashion industry isn’t a huge important part of humanity, allowing us to keep our bodies safe from the weather and conditions outdoors. Fashion is one of the most important and well researched industries, and the technology they innovate with is the whole reason we can even begin to think about sending humans to space. Do you think a bunch of nerds in NASA are able to understand the best stitching and materials to use, and how to best design joints to allow the great freedom of movement? No way, you need the experts, like Prada.
  - mmooss 2y ago
    Luggage doesn't seem to be a great qualification. I listed several fields which might have relevant experience: deep sea diving, work gear for toxic environments, military, etc. Luggage for my transatlantic flight doesn't seem like the same thing. > A lot of people look down on these types of fashion brands That strawperson has nothing to do with me or how well Prada can deliver. > Do you think a bunch of nerds in NASA are able to understand They do pretty well; I wouldn't dismiss them. They're leading technology organization in the history of humanity. And they have much more experience making space suits than Prada - or anyone else in the world. Also, your comment about NASA is not unlike the strawperson comments about Prada that you criticize.