6 ms·

Note that Palantir's moral stature isn't as grey or debatable as made in the article, it is basically clearly complicit in the genocide in Gaza. In other words

by ak_111 2y ago

Note that Palantir's moral stature isn't as grey or debatable as made in the article, it is basically clearly complicit in the genocide in Gaza. In other words, if you read the article I would add one more bucket to the three categories the author provided to classify palantir's work - genocide assistance. from https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/us-jd-vance-peter-thiel-founded-company-helps-israel-kill-lists-palestinians-gaza https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/us-jd-vance-peter-thiel-f... """ Not only did it provide information to the US military during the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan, but over the past 10 months in particular, Palantir has provided AI-powered military and surveillance technology support to the Israelis in its war on Gaza. It has, in the words of Palantir's co-founder Alex Karp, been involved in "crucial operations in Israel". Palantir says it offers defence technologies that are “mission-tested capabilities, forged in the field” to deliver “a tactical edge - by land, air, sea and space”. These capabilities include supplying Israel’s military and intelligence agencies with the data to fire missiles at specific targets in Gaza - be it inside homes or in moving vehicles. """

mulcahey 2y ago
The war in Gaza is a moral gray area
- pphysch 2y ago
  To what extent is repeated mass-murder of civilians, total destruction of healthcare and education systems, etc. part of the "moral gray area"? That's just not a serious argument. You can be pro-Israel without pretending to hold humanist values and so on.
  - dralley 2y ago
    If you have a military enemy that blatantly hides itself within civilian areas and builds its underground infrastructure underneath civilian infrastructure, and that military enemy kills 1200 of your citizens in an attack, that creates a fair bit of moral ambiguity.
    - ks2048 2y ago
      Imagine the reaction to Palestinians blowing up a residential Israeli apartment building with hundreds of civilians inside and justifying it by saying they wanted to kill an IDF member inside.
      - shiroiushi 2y ago
        If the IDF member is shooting at them from the apartment building, then it becomes a valid military target. This is very clearly spelled out in the Geneva conventions.
        ndheebebe 2y ago
        This is a tenuous hypothetical.
    - pazimzadeh 2y ago
      You would start by not sending them money. Unless of course you needed a justification for your political/expansionist goals. https://archive.ph/2023.10.14-033824/https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-09/ty-article/.premium/another-concept-implodes-israel-cant-be-managed-by-a-criminal-defendant/0000018b-1382-d2fc-a59f-d39b5dbf0000 https://archive.ph/2023.10.14-033824/https://www.haaretz.com... https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/hamas-israels-own-creation/ https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/hamas-israels-own-creation/ Anyway, the idea of embedding military targets within civilian populations is also not exclusive to one side: https://www.haaretz.com/2012-06-09/ty-article/.premium/does-the-presence-of-the-idfs-hq-in-tel-aviv-endanger-its-population/0000017f-f419-d887-a7ff-fcfd3a480000 https://www.haaretz.com/2012-06-09/ty-article/.premium/does-... Neither is the use of terror: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing https://web.archive.org/web/20121226235336/http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/137825/daniel-byman-and-natan-sachs/the-rise-of-settler-terrorism https://web.archive.org/web/20121226235336/http://www.foreig... https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2019/02/no-justification-israel-shoot-protesters-live-ammunition https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2019/02/no-justifica... https://www.thetorah.com/article/israels-incomplete-conquest-of-canaan https://www.thetorah.com/article/israels-incomplete-conquest...
samatman 2y ago
[flagged]
- bdjsiqoocwk 2y ago
  > Defeating Hamas is a moral imperative. In that case what do you call the Netanyahu governament strategy of propping up Hamas? https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up...
  - slibhb 2y ago
    A mistake? The Israelis didn't understand the extent to which Hamas views itself as engaged in a holy war. They (and many others, including me) thought that Hamas would prioritize building Gaza and providing services to its people over murder/kidnapping raids.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - bdjsiqoocwk 2y ago
      That's one theory. Another one is read the article. The reason it matters is that under the second one Israel has no moral legitimacy, so saying things like moral imperative show how fucked up your morals are.
    - yoz 2y ago
      You're underestimating how valuable Hamas has been to the Israeli right. Smotrich called them an asset in 2015 for a reason, and Netanyahu said similar in 2012. With Hamas in charge, Israel could avoid making new peace agreements or concessions by saying that there was "no partner for peace". The more violent Hamas got, the more cover Israel had for expanding settlements. And now Likud is already talking about what they'll do with all the Gaza land they're taking.
- monkaiju 2y ago
  If you think the goal of defeating Hamas justifies this amount of civilian killing yiu have no moral basis to argue with.
kevinventullo 2y ago
Them and every American taxpayer
- monkaiju 2y ago
  Pretty obvious difference between choosing to work towards the goals of a genocide and being threatened to pay taxes or have your property and wages seized...
slibhb 2y ago
> Note that Palantir's moral stature isn't as grey or debatable as made in the article, it is basically clearly complicit in the genocide in Gaza. That there's a genocide in Gaza is objectively debatable. In the sense that people debate it.
aaron695 2y ago
[dead]
pimpampum 2y ago
This, but the author betrays itself once it says he's fine with the clear pro-western stance. As a politically informed person coming from the global south, I cannot but denounce western colonialism that lives on up to today.
nova22033 2y ago
Not only did it provide information to the US military Palantir can not provide information. They can give you insights into your data. They're like splunk..and equally expensive.

by ak_111 2y ago

mulcahey 2y ago

The war in Gaza is a moral gray area

pphysch 2y ago
To what extent is repeated mass-murder of civilians, total destruction of healthcare and education systems, etc. part of the "moral gray area"? That's just not a serious argument. You can be pro-Israel without pretending to hold humanist values and so on.
- dralley 2y ago
  If you have a military enemy that blatantly hides itself within civilian areas and builds its underground infrastructure underneath civilian infrastructure, and that military enemy kills 1200 of your citizens in an attack, that creates a fair bit of moral ambiguity.
  - ks2048 2y ago
    Imagine the reaction to Palestinians blowing up a residential Israeli apartment building with hundreds of civilians inside and justifying it by saying they wanted to kill an IDF member inside.
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      If the IDF member is shooting at them from the apartment building, then it becomes a valid military target. This is very clearly spelled out in the Geneva conventions.
      - ndheebebe 2y ago
        This is a tenuous hypothetical.
  - pazimzadeh 2y ago
    You would start by not sending them money. Unless of course you needed a justification for your political/expansionist goals. https://archive.ph/2023.10.14-033824/https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-09/ty-article/.premium/another-concept-implodes-israel-cant-be-managed-by-a-criminal-defendant/0000018b-1382-d2fc-a59f-d39b5dbf0000 https://archive.ph/2023.10.14-033824/https://www.haaretz.com... https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/hamas-israels-own-creation/ https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/hamas-israels-own-creation/ Anyway, the idea of embedding military targets within civilian populations is also not exclusive to one side: https://www.haaretz.com/2012-06-09/ty-article/.premium/does-the-presence-of-the-idfs-hq-in-tel-aviv-endanger-its-population/0000017f-f419-d887-a7ff-fcfd3a480000 https://www.haaretz.com/2012-06-09/ty-article/.premium/does-... Neither is the use of terror: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing https://web.archive.org/web/20121226235336/http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/137825/daniel-byman-and-natan-sachs/the-rise-of-settler-terrorism https://web.archive.org/web/20121226235336/http://www.foreig... https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2019/02/no-justification-israel-shoot-protesters-live-ammunition https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2019/02/no-justifica... https://www.thetorah.com/article/israels-incomplete-conquest-of-canaan https://www.thetorah.com/article/israels-incomplete-conquest...

samatman 2y ago

[flagged]

bdjsiqoocwk 2y ago
> Defeating Hamas is a moral imperative. In that case what do you call the Netanyahu governament strategy of propping up Hamas? https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up...
- slibhb 2y ago
  A mistake? The Israelis didn't understand the extent to which Hamas views itself as engaged in a holy war. They (and many others, including me) thought that Hamas would prioritize building Gaza and providing services to its people over murder/kidnapping raids.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - bdjsiqoocwk 2y ago
    That's one theory. Another one is read the article. The reason it matters is that under the second one Israel has no moral legitimacy, so saying things like moral imperative show how fucked up your morals are.
  - yoz 2y ago
    You're underestimating how valuable Hamas has been to the Israeli right. Smotrich called them an asset in 2015 for a reason, and Netanyahu said similar in 2012. With Hamas in charge, Israel could avoid making new peace agreements or concessions by saying that there was "no partner for peace". The more violent Hamas got, the more cover Israel had for expanding settlements. And now Likud is already talking about what they'll do with all the Gaza land they're taking.
monkaiju 2y ago
If you think the goal of defeating Hamas justifies this amount of civilian killing yiu have no moral basis to argue with.

kevinventullo 2y ago

Them and every American taxpayer

monkaiju 2y ago
Pretty obvious difference between choosing to work towards the goals of a genocide and being threatened to pay taxes or have your property and wages seized...

slibhb 2y ago

> Note that Palantir's moral stature isn't as grey or debatable as made in the article, it is basically clearly complicit in the genocide in Gaza. That there's a genocide in Gaza is objectively debatable. In the sense that people debate it.

aaron695 2y ago

[dead]

pimpampum 2y ago

This, but the author betrays itself once it says he's fine with the clear pro-western stance. As a politically informed person coming from the global south, I cannot but denounce western colonialism that lives on up to today.

nova22033 2y ago

Not only did it provide information to the US military Palantir can not provide information. They can give you insights into your data. They're like splunk..and equally expensive.