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> In particular, doesn't that seem to imply that women in cars would need some sort of protector? No. You do realise women are human and can drive, right? And

by latexr 2y ago

> In particular, doesn't that seem to imply that women in cars would need some sort of protector? No. You do realise women are human and can drive, right? And that men can be harassed too? The argument was about numbers, you’re weirdly making it about gender. > The reason the waymo didn't drive forward Is irrelevant. This conversation started because you said it didn’t make a difference that it was a self-driving car. Because a human could’ve made better decisions while still being safe, it follows that it being a self-driving car makes a difference. I’m not arguing that Waymo is wrong to be cautious, I’m just saying it is patently obvious that having a (current tech) robot or a human at the wheel does make a difference, despite your insistence that it doesn’t.

dekhn 2y ago
Of course I'm aware women drive- I'm currently teaching my daughter to drive in the SF Bay Area, and my wife drives 5X the miles I do, and 10X the miles in SF city). I considered writing my text above to include men (I don't want it to be about gender- although, in my experience, harassment of women by men is far more common, and people care about it a lot more). I fully acknowledge that having a physical human driver at the wheel could lead to different outcomes. I do not agree those would necessarily be "better decisions". It looks like the things a human driver could do include: getting out and attacking the offenders (not something I expect my taxi driver to do), racing off (which comes with significant risk, of running people over, getting in an accident, violating regulations), yelling and/or gesticulating (unlikely to have much effect), and running over the offenders intentionally ("I was afraid for my life and moved forward slowly to give them time to move out of the way"). I think you're over-interpreting my statement and misunderstanding my intent. I hope to clarify: I don't think the safety of passengers from external adversaries is a legitimate reason to oppose self-driving cars, nor do I expect self-driving cars to handle external adversaries in the ways that a human driver might. I do expect over time that Waymo will reduce its safety buffers around people who are behaving aggressively. Hope that clears up my intent.

by latexr 2y ago

dekhn 2y ago

Of course I'm aware women drive- I'm currently teaching my daughter to drive in the SF Bay Area, and my wife drives 5X the miles I do, and 10X the miles in SF city). I considered writing my text above to include men (I don't want it to be about gender- although, in my experience, harassment of women by men is far more common, and people care about it a lot more). I fully acknowledge that having a physical human driver at the wheel could lead to different outcomes. I do not agree those would necessarily be "better decisions". It looks like the things a human driver could do include: getting out and attacking the offenders (not something I expect my taxi driver to do), racing off (which comes with significant risk, of running people over, getting in an accident, violating regulations), yelling and/or gesticulating (unlikely to have much effect), and running over the offenders intentionally ("I was afraid for my life and moved forward slowly to give them time to move out of the way"). I think you're over-interpreting my statement and misunderstanding my intent. I hope to clarify: I don't think the safety of passengers from external adversaries is a legitimate reason to oppose self-driving cars, nor do I expect self-driving cars to handle external adversaries in the ways that a human driver might. I do expect over time that Waymo will reduce its safety buffers around people who are behaving aggressively. Hope that clears up my intent.