4 ms·

I don't mind tipping as a way of saying "Thank you!" for great service. What burns me is when I go to order food delivery from an app, and it's asking me to "pr

I don't mind tipping as a way of saying "Thank you!" for great service. What burns me is when I go to order food delivery from an app, and it's asking me to "pre-tip" for service I haven't even received yet. I've seen several Instagrams and TikToks where drivers leave customers' food get cold at a restaurant because they didn't like the tip they got through the app.

vouaobrasil 2y ago
Yeah that is another thing. I do agree with the "thank you" part though, but in North America, there are indeed a few times where the tip was "strongly encouraged" even before the service! And TBH, of the hundreds of times I've eaten ANYWHERE in North America, the service has been exactly the same: "here is your food. [later]. Are you enjoying your food. [later]. Did you like the food? Okay, where's the 15% tip?"
- benterix 2y ago
  Yeah, I mean most of the time I don't really need any other service. What are these guys supposed to do - dance on the table? I just want to have the food and don't need anything else. I don't get the tipping culture, it's inconsistent (why only certain professions get tips?).
- trashtester 2y ago
  "When in Rome, do as the Romans do." This holds everywhere. (Well, with the exception of some places where locals have gotten used to tourists behaving differently.) To travel some place and then complain about the local customs there is just a rude if a someone goes from France to the US as if someone goes from the US to France. If you don't like the local culture in some spot, just stop going there. In many jobs in the US, the tips ARE the salary, and the customer is the employer just as much as the owner of the place is. And if you (as a customer) don't pay for the work in such a setting. Now if the locals don't like this arrangement, they should work to change it. But when we are visiting, we should try to adapt.
  - lores 2y ago
    All 50 states have a law to the effect that minimum wage is minimum wage, and if tips + tipped wage dies not reach it,b the restaurant must make up the difference. With that in mind, why are service staff singled out to receive tips? Why not warehouse workers or street sweepers? Their job is less pleasant. Include everything in the price like in most of Europe, and have the staff know in advance what they'll be paid, it makes the experience a lot less stressful for everyone.
    - trashtester 2y ago
      > With that in mind, why are service staff singled out to receive tips? Partly for historical reasons. But also because it is one of the types of jobs where this actually works. (Because customers can experience the result of the work directly and because the quality of the work is quite variable.) Other professions have other ways to provide incentive based salary. Lawyers, MD's, consultants, musicians or tech workers all have ways to (at least in some positions) profit from their own work directly. Construction workers may have team based rewards based on meeting deadlines, etc. Then there are a few professions where such rewards don't make sense, including those you bring up. These are generally jobs where the quality of the work is either not very variable, is hard to measure or does not connect to any revenue streams. For such jobs, fixed salaries are required. Typically, though, for most professions, fixed salary models tend to provide lower AVERAGE salary payments for those who opt for fixed salary. The risk involved in variable pay tends to lead to a risk premium benefitting the worker. And it may ALSO benfefit the employers, which in turn over time will result in an increased demand for workers. Europe has a model with less incentive based compensation. Europe also has (on average) about 2x the US unemployment rate and about 50% of the salaries in many growth sectors for those who DO have a job. In return, Europe DOES manage to have a lower salary gap between the warehouse worker and the software developer, but not necessarily a higher salary (even by PPP) than the US for the warehouse worker.
      - kergonath 2y ago
        > Partly for historical reasons. But also because it is one of the types of jobs where this actually works. (Because customers can experience the result of the work directly and because the quality of the work is quite variable.) No, it does not work. Good service is not babysitting customers so that they are sure every minute that you’re there to justify your tips. Decent service is the baseline expectation when you go to a restaurant. I don’t tip my phone’s maker when it turns on, it’s stupid. The social aspects completely decouple the tip and the quality of service.
xnx 2y ago
> "pre-tip" for service I haven't even received yet "pre-tip" is particularly insane because it comes across as "don't spit on my food" extortion.

vouaobrasil 2y ago

Yeah that is another thing. I do agree with the "thank you" part though, but in North America, there are indeed a few times where the tip was "strongly encouraged" even before the service! And TBH, of the hundreds of times I've eaten ANYWHERE in North America, the service has been exactly the same: "here is your food. [later]. Are you enjoying your food. [later]. Did you like the food? Okay, where's the 15% tip?"

benterix 2y ago
Yeah, I mean most of the time I don't really need any other service. What are these guys supposed to do - dance on the table? I just want to have the food and don't need anything else. I don't get the tipping culture, it's inconsistent (why only certain professions get tips?).
trashtester 2y ago
"When in Rome, do as the Romans do." This holds everywhere. (Well, with the exception of some places where locals have gotten used to tourists behaving differently.) To travel some place and then complain about the local customs there is just a rude if a someone goes from France to the US as if someone goes from the US to France. If you don't like the local culture in some spot, just stop going there. In many jobs in the US, the tips ARE the salary, and the customer is the employer just as much as the owner of the place is. And if you (as a customer) don't pay for the work in such a setting. Now if the locals don't like this arrangement, they should work to change it. But when we are visiting, we should try to adapt.
- lores 2y ago
  All 50 states have a law to the effect that minimum wage is minimum wage, and if tips + tipped wage dies not reach it,b the restaurant must make up the difference. With that in mind, why are service staff singled out to receive tips? Why not warehouse workers or street sweepers? Their job is less pleasant. Include everything in the price like in most of Europe, and have the staff know in advance what they'll be paid, it makes the experience a lot less stressful for everyone.
  - trashtester 2y ago
    > With that in mind, why are service staff singled out to receive tips? Partly for historical reasons. But also because it is one of the types of jobs where this actually works. (Because customers can experience the result of the work directly and because the quality of the work is quite variable.) Other professions have other ways to provide incentive based salary. Lawyers, MD's, consultants, musicians or tech workers all have ways to (at least in some positions) profit from their own work directly. Construction workers may have team based rewards based on meeting deadlines, etc. Then there are a few professions where such rewards don't make sense, including those you bring up. These are generally jobs where the quality of the work is either not very variable, is hard to measure or does not connect to any revenue streams. For such jobs, fixed salaries are required. Typically, though, for most professions, fixed salary models tend to provide lower AVERAGE salary payments for those who opt for fixed salary. The risk involved in variable pay tends to lead to a risk premium benefitting the worker. And it may ALSO benfefit the employers, which in turn over time will result in an increased demand for workers. Europe has a model with less incentive based compensation. Europe also has (on average) about 2x the US unemployment rate and about 50% of the salaries in many growth sectors for those who DO have a job. In return, Europe DOES manage to have a lower salary gap between the warehouse worker and the software developer, but not necessarily a higher salary (even by PPP) than the US for the warehouse worker.
    - kergonath 2y ago
      > Partly for historical reasons. But also because it is one of the types of jobs where this actually works. (Because customers can experience the result of the work directly and because the quality of the work is quite variable.) No, it does not work. Good service is not babysitting customers so that they are sure every minute that you’re there to justify your tips. Decent service is the baseline expectation when you go to a restaurant. I don’t tip my phone’s maker when it turns on, it’s stupid. The social aspects completely decouple the tip and the quality of service.

xnx 2y ago

> "pre-tip" for service I haven't even received yet "pre-tip" is particularly insane because it comes across as "don't spit on my food" extortion.