7 ms·

UK workers must keep all customer tips under new law

23 points by mmarian 2y ago

junaru 2y ago
Tips should not exist.
- nelsonic 2y ago
  @junaru have you worked in the service industry? Are you suggesting that people who work in areas where tips are common should just be paid more by their employers? 100% Agree that people should just be paid more. But it's not that simple ... Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars. And the people who suffer from inflation are the minimum wage earners who spend proportionally more of their disposable income on essentials like groceries. I worked as a waiter/bartender for 3 years in college and the wages were terrible! But I always made an effort and customers gave me tips. Saved those tips to buy my first iMac which I used to learn higher-paying skills. Having been a service industry worker and now in a different income bracket I always tip for good service. Without tips many people in the service sector could not get by.
  - hypeatei 2y ago
    How is it going to have an inflationary effect when workers are already making that money? I don't really see how increasing menu prices or adding an automatic 12%-15% on the bill to avoid playing games afterwards with the receipt is a bad thing.
    - nelsonic 2y ago
      If costs rise, prices have to rise to maintain margins. Textbook definition of Inflation. If there's 15-20% (discretionary) added to the bill, it's not perceived as the price but rather as a "thank you" for taking care of us during our experience. Again, I don't like this system; and would welcome a viable alternative!
  - redserk 2y ago
    How are tips immune from the inflationary effect you’re describing? If a government mandates a higher wage or if 90% of a society voluntarily contributes tips, the effect is the same. At the end of the day, the customer is likely paying an increased amount for a service being rendered. Except a mandatory wage increase may have the business reduce their margins while a tip puts the pressure directly on patrons. I did tipped service work. It’s time to discourage general adoption.
  - vr46 2y ago
    Does it really make sense that 20% of the entire turnover of business shouldn't go through the business? Is good service only available to those who tip? Why are there so many hidden costs in American pricing? Why can't everything be upfront and honest and transparent? Whose responsibility is the welfare of the staff? Why do only waitstaff get the tips when the less-visible staff also contribute to good service?
  - A_D_E_P_T 2y ago
    > Without tips many people in the service sector could not get by. I don't think that's necessarily true. In Japan tipping is a faux pas, and in fact restaurants will often return or refuse to accept them, yet the service sector is massive and the quality of service tends to be extraordinary. Much of Europe is similar, especially in eastern and southern parts. In China tipping is just not done... How is it that they all get by, but the US service sector can't?
    - nelsonic 2y ago
      Indeed, people working in services in Japan people are paid significantly better than in the US/UK so tips aren't required. Also the culture is totally different and I prefer it that way too. But using Japan as an example for this is like a red herring. The US/UK is not Japan. Just lookup "Cheating culture in Japan": https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/5cnmy8/cheating_culture_in_japan/?rdt=64452 https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/5cnmy8/cheating_cult... would that work in US/UK? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (hint: no!)
      - A_D_E_P_T 2y ago
        > people working in services in Japan people are paid significantly better than in the US/UK lol, no. They're paid less, on average. https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/waiter-waitress/japan https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/waiter-waitress/japan https://www.talent.com/salary?job=waiter https://www.talent.com/salary?job=waiter At worst, it's comparable. You could make a complicated argument that costs of living in Japan are lower so on pseudo-PPP terms they're paid better, but this is by no means clear. > Japan as an example for this is like a red herring. The US/UK is not Japan. Just lookup "Cheating culture in Japan" The red herring is raising totally unrelated behavior from a Reddit post. In truth, most of Asia's tipping culture is much like Japan's. China's 1.4B denizens don't tip. I'm in Croatia and nobody tips here, either. It's only expected of tourists.
        nelsonic 2y ago
        And the OP is related to the UK where tipping is normal and often expected.
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  - tetromino_ 2y ago
    > Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars. And the people who suffer from inflation are the minimum wage earners who spend proportionally more of their disposable income on essentials like groceries. I don't understand why you are conflating inflation of sit-down restaurant and bar prices (which doesn't affect poor people) and inflation of grocery prices (which does). You don't tip at checkout at a grocery store or a liquor store.
  - iicc 2y ago
    >Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars That implies consumers spend differently if they know the actual cost ahead of time, otherwise service inclusive pricing would make no difference. ie the whole industry is exploiting anchoring effects. Removing anchoring effects would make restaurant businesses less profitable, and consequently the properties that host them less valuable, so lower rents. There are clear incentives for pushing an inflation narrative.
- trashtester 2y ago
  Banning tips in the hospitality sector would be a bit like banning stock options or similar equity incentives in the tech sector (and startups in particular). Having to replace such performance/luck based incentives with fixed salaries would make a lot of business unviable, and restrict growth and innovation. Furthermore, the current workforce in places where such compensation is common will often have self selected for the kind of people who prefer this model (due to the potential upside, excitement, feeling of purpose, etc) over the safety of a fixed salary. So banning tipping in such markets tend to have a similar reaction as would forcing such incentive models on markets where people are used to a fixed salary.
  - djtango 2y ago
    And yet when I went to Germany, China and Japan service staff did their jobs with a sense of pride and didn't chase for tips. In many places in Asia I've had tips outright refused. And yet the tiny check in lady in Tokyo airport came from behind her desk to lift my suitcase onto the scales.
    - trashtester 2y ago
      Different places have different cultures. I see no problem with that.
  - arghwhat 2y ago
    Stock options is also a very American tech thing, and mainly provided by US tech companies in the EU. Peformance bonuses paid by the employer when you reach targets set by them is somewhat common and could be used in hospitality too. However, the majority of jobs do not have such performance incentives other than keeping your job if you keep up your end of the bargain, and possibly getting promoted to a higher role if you show certain skills. The hospitality sector does not have to differ.
    - ml_basics 2y ago
      And American tech companies have been substantially more successful that European tech companies so maybe it does actually make sense to have stock options as part of compensation rather than employer bonuses?
meindnoch 2y ago
Tipping in the UK? Since when? I mean, I know they're keen on imitating the US eversince they lost their empire...
- orf 2y ago
  Gratuity charges are what they mean. Parties over a certain size have them added, or it’s sometimes offered on the payment terminals. Always a fixed percentage of the bill.
- phobotics 2y ago
  Tipping in the UK at restaurants has been a thing for a long time. However it’s normally included in the bill as service charge so you just pay the bill and don’t have to decide how much to leave yourself. In London it’s usually 12.5%. You are allowed to ask them to remove service charge from the bill but it’s an uncommon thing to ask.
  - graemep 2y ago
    I just treat the service charge as part of the price (when deciding where to eat or what to order) and would only not pay if it was really awful (not happened yet) but I will tip a bit extra if service is really good.
- beardyw 2y ago
  "The practice of tipping began in Tudor England. In medieval times, tipping was a master-serf custom wherein a servant would receive extra money for having performed superbly well. By the 17th century, it was expected that overnight guests to private homes would provide sums of money, known as vails, to the host's servants. Soon afterwards, customers began tipping in London coffeehouses and other commercial establishments". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratuity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratuity
- mutatio 2y ago
  Since the Tudors, before the US as we know it.
- 2y ago
deafpolygon 2y ago
Tips should be abolished.
- tene80i 2y ago
  You want to make it illegal to give people money for good service? Or do you mean it shouldn’t be allowed to ask for it?
  - Already__Taken 2y ago
    it's kinda like a private tax or lottery if you squint so yeh I could see outlawing it yeh. you don't tip firemen or policemen. well if you do the latter it's got a different name. and unless you tip up-front it's not for good service.
  - Ekaros 2y ago
    Yes, it is bribery. Treat it as such, jail both the giver and receiver.
Havoc 2y ago
Seems sensible. Just really hope the US tip for everything insanity doesn’t arrive on these shores.
beardyw 2y ago
Companies are already finding work arounds including distributing tips to everyone in the organisation, but not equally. So you may end up just putting money in the bosses pocket like before.
gerjomarty 2y ago
Here's the government's press release: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/millions-to-take-home-more-cash-as-tipping-laws-come-into-force https://www.gov.uk/government/news/millions-to-take-home-mor... Seeing a comment on there from the CEO of TiPJAR, which is a private company that provides a "tronc" service to allow allocation of tips at arms-length from the employer, services which are specifically called out in the statutory guidance, left a slightly bitter taste.
vouaobrasil 2y ago
I hate tipping culture. When I lived in places without such a culture, it was a much more pleasant experience. I hate the cognitive load of looking at a menu price and then seeing a new price when tipping. And I hate the fact that tipping has become mostly decoupled from customer experience -- after all, there's not really much a waiter or taxi driver can do to make the eating/driving experience better. I just want the food or the ride in silence.
- donohoe 2y ago
  While I agree with the general point, there is often quite a lot waiter or taxi driver can do to make the eating/driving experience better.
  - highwaylights 2y ago
    Honestly, I’d rather be left alone unless I try to get your attention. If anything, tipping culture seems to have made it so that uber drivers feel compelled to make small talk or a waiter feels compelled to keep interrupting us to make it clear they’re being attentive, which is making the experience worse not better (IMHO).
- hypeatei 2y ago
  Same, the cognitive load and worries about making an error is just not worth it. Why we decided this is a good model is beyond me.
- bradburywine 2y ago
  I don't mind tipping as a way of saying "Thank you!" for great service. What burns me is when I go to order food delivery from an app, and it's asking me to "pre-tip" for service I haven't even received yet. I've seen several Instagrams and TikToks where drivers leave customers' food get cold at a restaurant because they didn't like the tip they got through the app.
  - vouaobrasil 2y ago
    Yeah that is another thing. I do agree with the "thank you" part though, but in North America, there are indeed a few times where the tip was "strongly encouraged" even before the service! And TBH, of the hundreds of times I've eaten ANYWHERE in North America, the service has been exactly the same: "here is your food. [later]. Are you enjoying your food. [later]. Did you like the food? Okay, where's the 15% tip?"
portaouflop 2y ago
I lived off tips for years and those who say they should just be abolished don’t know anything about working in gastro/service - please check who takes care of your food and tip them or they will be replaced by a worse version soon.
- graemep 2y ago
  Care to explain further? You are just saying the rest of us do not know, but not explaining what we do not know.
  - portaouflop 2y ago
    Im not here to educate you - just having strong opinions about a topic you know little about is maybe not warranted. It’s just like I would say „just write good software why do you keep producing bugs lmao“ - sure that would be nice but reality gets in the way.
- donohoe 2y ago
  I also lived off tips for many years and would rather see the system abolished - and have been paid a livable wage instead.
  - graemep 2y ago
    People in minimum wage jobs (and it is now £11.44/hour for those over 21) that do hot have tips do live off the same wage without the tips.
  - portaouflop 2y ago
    If that was an option sure - but the trend is more going towards no tips and fuck all to the worker - but hey HN seems to have it pretty good, so keep the downvotes coming
- VBprogrammer 2y ago
  I've never worked in food service. I did however do plenty of minimum wage retail type jobs and only occasionally got a tip, often for lifting something heavy for an older customer. Why is food service any different?
Already__Taken 2y ago
If you actually want to tip for a better job well done some kind of service escrow would make way more sense.
em500 2y ago
The problem with laws like these is similar as increasing taxes on corporations, or mandating higher wages by fiat. The implicit assumption is that money is moved from the (presumably rich) owners to workers, but economically it's determined by relative price elasticities: if customers' or workers' elasticities are low, the increased costs to the owner can be largely passed through in the form of higher prices and/or lower base wages.
- trashtester 2y ago
  When people tip, they intend that the money received is kept by those they give it to, or at most, shared with the part of the staff actually providing the experience (such as the chef of a restaurant). If a customer provides tip with the intention that it sould go the the waiter or at least the on-duty local staff, but the tip is taken by upper management or the corporation, I see that as deceitful communication, bordering on fraud. I would support a law where the default is that tips are kept by the person receiving the payment and that any tip sharing model in any business is voluntary for ANY employee, and where ANY employee should be free at any time to withdraw from such tip sharing. Basically, this would be a return to the cash based model, where tips were handed over physically to the waiter as a personal transaction between the customer and that individual. If this means more tips for waiters and less for chefs, then either compensate through base pay or provide a way for the customers to explicitly ask that the tip should be shared with the kitchen staff.
alecco 2y ago
Instead of tipping perhaps there should be a feedback mechanism.
aEJ04Izw5HYm 2y ago
Tipping is an awful trap. Passing on the responsibility of fair wages should be outlawed. Passing on some inferred responsibility as a burden onto the customer is a loss for all parties. Normalising the behaviour only allows employers to perpetuate this myth that customer service workers are somehow entrapraneurial in they can make more based on their effort. How about just paying people fairly and not paying for poor performance? How does it make any sense to pass this responsibility on to the customer? All customer touch points should be handled by the limited entity.

23 points by mmarian 2y ago

junaru 2y ago

Tips should not exist.

nelsonic 2y ago
@junaru have you worked in the service industry? Are you suggesting that people who work in areas where tips are common should just be paid more by their employers? 100% Agree that people should just be paid more. But it's not that simple ... Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars. And the people who suffer from inflation are the minimum wage earners who spend proportionally more of their disposable income on essentials like groceries. I worked as a waiter/bartender for 3 years in college and the wages were terrible! But I always made an effort and customers gave me tips. Saved those tips to buy my first iMac which I used to learn higher-paying skills. Having been a service industry worker and now in a different income bracket I always tip for good service. Without tips many people in the service sector could not get by.
- hypeatei 2y ago
  How is it going to have an inflationary effect when workers are already making that money? I don't really see how increasing menu prices or adding an automatic 12%-15% on the bill to avoid playing games afterwards with the receipt is a bad thing.
  - nelsonic 2y ago
    If costs rise, prices have to rise to maintain margins. Textbook definition of Inflation. If there's 15-20% (discretionary) added to the bill, it's not perceived as the price but rather as a "thank you" for taking care of us during our experience. Again, I don't like this system; and would welcome a viable alternative!
- redserk 2y ago
  How are tips immune from the inflationary effect you’re describing? If a government mandates a higher wage or if 90% of a society voluntarily contributes tips, the effect is the same. At the end of the day, the customer is likely paying an increased amount for a service being rendered. Except a mandatory wage increase may have the business reduce their margins while a tip puts the pressure directly on patrons. I did tipped service work. It’s time to discourage general adoption.
- vr46 2y ago
  Does it really make sense that 20% of the entire turnover of business shouldn't go through the business? Is good service only available to those who tip? Why are there so many hidden costs in American pricing? Why can't everything be upfront and honest and transparent? Whose responsibility is the welfare of the staff? Why do only waitstaff get the tips when the less-visible staff also contribute to good service?
- A_D_E_P_T 2y ago
  > Without tips many people in the service sector could not get by. I don't think that's necessarily true. In Japan tipping is a faux pas, and in fact restaurants will often return or refuse to accept them, yet the service sector is massive and the quality of service tends to be extraordinary. Much of Europe is similar, especially in eastern and southern parts. In China tipping is just not done... How is it that they all get by, but the US service sector can't?
  - nelsonic 2y ago
    Indeed, people working in services in Japan people are paid significantly better than in the US/UK so tips aren't required. Also the culture is totally different and I prefer it that way too. But using Japan as an example for this is like a red herring. The US/UK is not Japan. Just lookup "Cheating culture in Japan": https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/5cnmy8/cheating_culture_in_japan/?rdt=64452 https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/5cnmy8/cheating_cult... would that work in US/UK? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (hint: no!)
    - A_D_E_P_T 2y ago
      > people working in services in Japan people are paid significantly better than in the US/UK lol, no. They're paid less, on average. https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/waiter-waitress/japan https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/waiter-waitress/japan https://www.talent.com/salary?job=waiter https://www.talent.com/salary?job=waiter At worst, it's comparable. You could make a complicated argument that costs of living in Japan are lower so on pseudo-PPP terms they're paid better, but this is by no means clear. > Japan as an example for this is like a red herring. The US/UK is not Japan. Just lookup "Cheating culture in Japan" The red herring is raising totally unrelated behavior from a Reddit post. In truth, most of Asia's tipping culture is much like Japan's. China's 1.4B denizens don't tip. I'm in Croatia and nobody tips here, either. It's only expected of tourists.
      - nelsonic 2y ago
        And the OP is related to the UK where tipping is normal and often expected.
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- tetromino_ 2y ago
  > Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars. And the people who suffer from inflation are the minimum wage earners who spend proportionally more of their disposable income on essentials like groceries. I don't understand why you are conflating inflation of sit-down restaurant and bar prices (which doesn't affect poor people) and inflation of grocery prices (which does). You don't tip at checkout at a grocery store or a liquor store.
- iicc 2y ago
  >Raising wages has an inflationary effect on the prices in the restaurants/bars That implies consumers spend differently if they know the actual cost ahead of time, otherwise service inclusive pricing would make no difference. ie the whole industry is exploiting anchoring effects. Removing anchoring effects would make restaurant businesses less profitable, and consequently the properties that host them less valuable, so lower rents. There are clear incentives for pushing an inflation narrative.
trashtester 2y ago
Banning tips in the hospitality sector would be a bit like banning stock options or similar equity incentives in the tech sector (and startups in particular). Having to replace such performance/luck based incentives with fixed salaries would make a lot of business unviable, and restrict growth and innovation. Furthermore, the current workforce in places where such compensation is common will often have self selected for the kind of people who prefer this model (due to the potential upside, excitement, feeling of purpose, etc) over the safety of a fixed salary. So banning tipping in such markets tend to have a similar reaction as would forcing such incentive models on markets where people are used to a fixed salary.
- djtango 2y ago
  And yet when I went to Germany, China and Japan service staff did their jobs with a sense of pride and didn't chase for tips. In many places in Asia I've had tips outright refused. And yet the tiny check in lady in Tokyo airport came from behind her desk to lift my suitcase onto the scales.
  - trashtester 2y ago
    Different places have different cultures. I see no problem with that.
- arghwhat 2y ago
  Stock options is also a very American tech thing, and mainly provided by US tech companies in the EU. Peformance bonuses paid by the employer when you reach targets set by them is somewhat common and could be used in hospitality too. However, the majority of jobs do not have such performance incentives other than keeping your job if you keep up your end of the bargain, and possibly getting promoted to a higher role if you show certain skills. The hospitality sector does not have to differ.
  - ml_basics 2y ago
    And American tech companies have been substantially more successful that European tech companies so maybe it does actually make sense to have stock options as part of compensation rather than employer bonuses?

meindnoch 2y ago

Tipping in the UK? Since when? I mean, I know they're keen on imitating the US eversince they lost their empire...

orf 2y ago
Gratuity charges are what they mean. Parties over a certain size have them added, or it’s sometimes offered on the payment terminals. Always a fixed percentage of the bill.
phobotics 2y ago
Tipping in the UK at restaurants has been a thing for a long time. However it’s normally included in the bill as service charge so you just pay the bill and don’t have to decide how much to leave yourself. In London it’s usually 12.5%. You are allowed to ask them to remove service charge from the bill but it’s an uncommon thing to ask.
- graemep 2y ago
  I just treat the service charge as part of the price (when deciding where to eat or what to order) and would only not pay if it was really awful (not happened yet) but I will tip a bit extra if service is really good.
beardyw 2y ago
"The practice of tipping began in Tudor England. In medieval times, tipping was a master-serf custom wherein a servant would receive extra money for having performed superbly well. By the 17th century, it was expected that overnight guests to private homes would provide sums of money, known as vails, to the host's servants. Soon afterwards, customers began tipping in London coffeehouses and other commercial establishments". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratuity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratuity
mutatio 2y ago
Since the Tudors, before the US as we know it.
2y ago

deafpolygon 2y ago

Tips should be abolished.

tene80i 2y ago
You want to make it illegal to give people money for good service? Or do you mean it shouldn’t be allowed to ask for it?
- Already__Taken 2y ago
  it's kinda like a private tax or lottery if you squint so yeh I could see outlawing it yeh. you don't tip firemen or policemen. well if you do the latter it's got a different name. and unless you tip up-front it's not for good service.
- Ekaros 2y ago
  Yes, it is bribery. Treat it as such, jail both the giver and receiver.

Havoc 2y ago

Seems sensible. Just really hope the US tip for everything insanity doesn’t arrive on these shores.

beardyw 2y ago

Companies are already finding work arounds including distributing tips to everyone in the organisation, but not equally. So you may end up just putting money in the bosses pocket like before.

gerjomarty 2y ago

Here's the government's press release: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/millions-to-take-home-more-cash-as-tipping-laws-come-into-force https://www.gov.uk/government/news/millions-to-take-home-mor... Seeing a comment on there from the CEO of TiPJAR, which is a private company that provides a "tronc" service to allow allocation of tips at arms-length from the employer, services which are specifically called out in the statutory guidance, left a slightly bitter taste.

vouaobrasil 2y ago

I hate tipping culture. When I lived in places without such a culture, it was a much more pleasant experience. I hate the cognitive load of looking at a menu price and then seeing a new price when tipping. And I hate the fact that tipping has become mostly decoupled from customer experience -- after all, there's not really much a waiter or taxi driver can do to make the eating/driving experience better. I just want the food or the ride in silence.

donohoe 2y ago
While I agree with the general point, there is often quite a lot waiter or taxi driver can do to make the eating/driving experience better.
- highwaylights 2y ago
  Honestly, I’d rather be left alone unless I try to get your attention. If anything, tipping culture seems to have made it so that uber drivers feel compelled to make small talk or a waiter feels compelled to keep interrupting us to make it clear they’re being attentive, which is making the experience worse not better (IMHO).
hypeatei 2y ago
Same, the cognitive load and worries about making an error is just not worth it. Why we decided this is a good model is beyond me.
bradburywine 2y ago
I don't mind tipping as a way of saying "Thank you!" for great service. What burns me is when I go to order food delivery from an app, and it's asking me to "pre-tip" for service I haven't even received yet. I've seen several Instagrams and TikToks where drivers leave customers' food get cold at a restaurant because they didn't like the tip they got through the app.
- vouaobrasil 2y ago
  Yeah that is another thing. I do agree with the "thank you" part though, but in North America, there are indeed a few times where the tip was "strongly encouraged" even before the service! And TBH, of the hundreds of times I've eaten ANYWHERE in North America, the service has been exactly the same: "here is your food. [later]. Are you enjoying your food. [later]. Did you like the food? Okay, where's the 15% tip?"

portaouflop 2y ago

I lived off tips for years and those who say they should just be abolished don’t know anything about working in gastro/service - please check who takes care of your food and tip them or they will be replaced by a worse version soon.

graemep 2y ago
Care to explain further? You are just saying the rest of us do not know, but not explaining what we do not know.
- portaouflop 2y ago
  Im not here to educate you - just having strong opinions about a topic you know little about is maybe not warranted. It’s just like I would say „just write good software why do you keep producing bugs lmao“ - sure that would be nice but reality gets in the way.
donohoe 2y ago
I also lived off tips for many years and would rather see the system abolished - and have been paid a livable wage instead.
- graemep 2y ago
  People in minimum wage jobs (and it is now £11.44/hour for those over 21) that do hot have tips do live off the same wage without the tips.
- portaouflop 2y ago
  If that was an option sure - but the trend is more going towards no tips and fuck all to the worker - but hey HN seems to have it pretty good, so keep the downvotes coming
VBprogrammer 2y ago
I've never worked in food service. I did however do plenty of minimum wage retail type jobs and only occasionally got a tip, often for lifting something heavy for an older customer. Why is food service any different?

Already__Taken 2y ago

If you actually want to tip for a better job well done some kind of service escrow would make way more sense.

em500 2y ago

The problem with laws like these is similar as increasing taxes on corporations, or mandating higher wages by fiat. The implicit assumption is that money is moved from the (presumably rich) owners to workers, but economically it's determined by relative price elasticities: if customers' or workers' elasticities are low, the increased costs to the owner can be largely passed through in the form of higher prices and/or lower base wages.

trashtester 2y ago
When people tip, they intend that the money received is kept by those they give it to, or at most, shared with the part of the staff actually providing the experience (such as the chef of a restaurant). If a customer provides tip with the intention that it sould go the the waiter or at least the on-duty local staff, but the tip is taken by upper management or the corporation, I see that as deceitful communication, bordering on fraud. I would support a law where the default is that tips are kept by the person receiving the payment and that any tip sharing model in any business is voluntary for ANY employee, and where ANY employee should be free at any time to withdraw from such tip sharing. Basically, this would be a return to the cash based model, where tips were handed over physically to the waiter as a personal transaction between the customer and that individual. If this means more tips for waiters and less for chefs, then either compensate through base pay or provide a way for the customers to explicitly ask that the tip should be shared with the kitchen staff.

alecco 2y ago

Instead of tipping perhaps there should be a feedback mechanism.

aEJ04Izw5HYm 2y ago

Tipping is an awful trap. Passing on the responsibility of fair wages should be outlawed. Passing on some inferred responsibility as a burden onto the customer is a loss for all parties. Normalising the behaviour only allows employers to perpetuate this myth that customer service workers are somehow entrapraneurial in they can make more based on their effort. How about just paying people fairly and not paying for poor performance? How does it make any sense to pass this responsibility on to the customer? All customer touch points should be handled by the limited entity.