3 ms·

I am surprised that they didn't delay this given the timing right before the election. Doesn't this seem like it could affect the outcome, if it actually hurts

I am surprised that they didn't delay this given the timing right before the election. Doesn't this seem like it could affect the outcome, if it actually hurts the economy and results in shortages?

ruined 2y ago
the union will use the election to demand intervention, the company will use the election to demand suppression.
jnsaff2 2y ago
Thats a feature not a bug in the plan. The union is effecting maximum leverage here.
- modeless 2y ago
  Really? Seems to me that economic disruption under Biden would hurt Harris. Obviously the union wants Harris over Trump. They could very well tip the election against themselves. The only leverage the election gives them is against Biden, but they're not negotiating with Biden.
  - thephyber 2y ago
    Plot twist: Biden/Harris are no longer favorites of the union workers like Democrats were decades ago. Trump doesn’t seem to support unions (except that astroturfed “union” rally in Sept 2023), but union workers seem like they are equally likely to support Trump for his other policies.
  - jnsaff2 2y ago
    There is a very interesting podcast episode[0] (no transcript unfortunately) about this where they discuss this strike and find that this is a no win situation for Biden/democrats. They also talk about the automation demands .. which in this strike context involves stuff like automatically scanning container tags .. stuff which people are rather bad and error prone at. [0] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-09-27/will-there-be-a-strike-at-east-coast-ports-what-longshoremen-are-looking-for https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-09-27/will-there-b...
thephyber 2y ago
It will likely have some marginal effect. 2 things to think about: 1 - Union workers care about their job and their employment contract which lasts a few years, not which party wins the next presidency. People look out for themselves before they look out for a vague organization like a political party. 2 - Democrats have lost lots of Union votes in the past few decades. In 1992, Clinton polled +30 among that demographic, but in 2024, Kamala is polling only +9 (source: CNN’s Harry Enton reported a few days ago). Union voters are not likely to be all that concerned about who wins.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  They're in for a rude awakening to how important the presidential election is when their actions get Trump elected and he just fires them all like Reagan did, or calls in the national guard.
blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
The timing is on purpose. Biden has the legal authority to block strikes by dock workers since it is a critical infrastructure. He has said he won’t use that power in this instance, and my guess is that’s because he wants to ensure the votes of union workers by letting the longshoremen hold the country hostage to the tune of billions a day.
- seanmcdirmid 2y ago
  There have been a few dock strikes since his term started, and I don’t think he has ever used this power.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
EasyMark 2y ago
I suspect that it was intentional. They have a pro-union president in who wants his party to win, so they took the gamble that he will apply pressure to the companies that are fighting the demands of the union. What could backfire though is the dems lose and they get a president who wants to eliminate all unions and move as much profit to the 0.1% as possible, a sort of pumped, trickle-up, economic plan.
- modeless 2y ago
  The president isn't the boss of the ports. What "pressure" can he apply?
  - EasyMark 2y ago
    The president can use Taft Hartley if he likes.

I am surprised that they didn't delay this given the timing right before the election. Doesn't this seem like it could affect the outcome, if it actually hurts the economy and results in shortages?

ruined 2y ago

the union will use the election to demand intervention, the company will use the election to demand suppression.

jnsaff2 2y ago

Thats a feature not a bug in the plan. The union is effecting maximum leverage here.

modeless 2y ago
Really? Seems to me that economic disruption under Biden would hurt Harris. Obviously the union wants Harris over Trump. They could very well tip the election against themselves. The only leverage the election gives them is against Biden, but they're not negotiating with Biden.
- thephyber 2y ago
  Plot twist: Biden/Harris are no longer favorites of the union workers like Democrats were decades ago. Trump doesn’t seem to support unions (except that astroturfed “union” rally in Sept 2023), but union workers seem like they are equally likely to support Trump for his other policies.
- jnsaff2 2y ago
  There is a very interesting podcast episode[0] (no transcript unfortunately) about this where they discuss this strike and find that this is a no win situation for Biden/democrats. They also talk about the automation demands .. which in this strike context involves stuff like automatically scanning container tags .. stuff which people are rather bad and error prone at. [0] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-09-27/will-there-be-a-strike-at-east-coast-ports-what-longshoremen-are-looking-for https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-09-27/will-there-b...

thephyber 2y ago

It will likely have some marginal effect. 2 things to think about: 1 - Union workers care about their job and their employment contract which lasts a few years, not which party wins the next presidency. People look out for themselves before they look out for a vague organization like a political party. 2 - Democrats have lost lots of Union votes in the past few decades. In 1992, Clinton polled +30 among that demographic, but in 2024, Kamala is polling only +9 (source: CNN’s Harry Enton reported a few days ago). Union voters are not likely to be all that concerned about who wins.

shiroiushi 2y ago
They're in for a rude awakening to how important the presidential election is when their actions get Trump elected and he just fires them all like Reagan did, or calls in the national guard.

blackeyeblitzar 2y ago

The timing is on purpose. Biden has the legal authority to block strikes by dock workers since it is a critical infrastructure. He has said he won’t use that power in this instance, and my guess is that’s because he wants to ensure the votes of union workers by letting the longshoremen hold the country hostage to the tune of billions a day.

seanmcdirmid 2y ago
There have been a few dock strikes since his term started, and I don’t think he has ever used this power.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

EasyMark 2y ago

I suspect that it was intentional. They have a pro-union president in who wants his party to win, so they took the gamble that he will apply pressure to the companies that are fighting the demands of the union. What could backfire though is the dems lose and they get a president who wants to eliminate all unions and move as much profit to the 0.1% as possible, a sort of pumped, trickle-up, economic plan.

modeless 2y ago
The president isn't the boss of the ports. What "pressure" can he apply?
- EasyMark 2y ago
  The president can use Taft Hartley if he likes.