10 ms·

You're not the CEO - You're the Fucking Janitor

371 points by zbruhnke 14y ago

cs702 14y ago
This article reminds me a bit of 'the parable of the silver bowls:' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjzqO6UOPFQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjzqO6UOPFQ -- regardless of the size of the organization, its leaders are the ones who must deal with the stuff no one else can or wants to tackle.
colindoc84 14y ago
Starting off with a strawman is a good way to write a bad blog post.
michael_nielsen 14y ago
Seems appropriate to quote an old HN comment (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3905794 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3905794): "After the first night of the 2008 SciFoo conference at Google, @gnat Torkington's twitter stream contained a gem: 'At SciFoo opening session. 300 people standing around networking. Meanwhile, Larry Page is quietly unpacking chairs at the back of the room.' (from memory, not exact)" The CEO (or any leader)'s job is to make sure that whatever needs to be done, gets done. Sometimes, that means unpacking the chairs.
- koide 14y ago
  I get very upset when junior employees try to keep me from doing the 'dirty work' I'm preparing to do or already doing. I'm not sure where this whole nonsense of "people who lead can't get dirty or do menial work" comes from. If I had something more important to do for sure I would have delegated, but seeing that I didn't, ask why is this particular thing important or, at most, offer help. Don't tell me I shouldn't be doing this! Context: I lead a team of 4. And by 'dirty work' I mean plugging up servers, doing maintenance on them, physical networking stuff, cleaning up debris after an installation, etc.
  - alttab 14y ago
    Is it possible that your team wants to demonstrate some level of ownership? Maybe prove to you that they have what it takes? I don't do things because my boss is a vp and is above the work. I do things because I fully own my job and gobble up as much responsibility as I can get.
  - deleted 14y ago
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  - mbreese 14y ago
    Are you any good at it? Maybe they don't want you to do it for a reason :)
    - ivix 14y ago
      Yes, don't forget that they may be afraid of telling you you're not helping.
      - koide 14y ago
        That's not the case, I'm sure.
- blhack 14y ago
  I'll share a story an interaction with a company that I worked heavily with while we were launching (this is a startup in a fairly niche, non-technical space. A smallish company with around 200 employees): The "CEO": This guy had a large stake in the company. It was his baby, and while the "CEO" title (which I think gets way over applied) fits him, his official title is "managing partner". While we were in the process of build->launch, he was heavily involved in literally every single department. Not in a micro-managing way, in an "this needs to be done and here, I am going to help" way. It would absolutely not have seemed strange to me, or anybody else, to see him out on a scissor lift with a hammer drill and some cables mounting something to the wall, if that's what was needed. When we did launch, some things went...wrong. The night before we opened, he, as well as some of his friends, not even people employed by us, spent until almost-down doing "grunt" work. Dirty, tedious work moving huge heavy things around, and walking all over the place to get them. That night he slept here (so did I) The months leading up until that launch, and the months following it, he was here until well after dark because a lot of the people who had been hired were "green", and had no idea how to do their job yet. We were all figuring it out as we went. The culture here at that time was addictive (and I wish we could get that feeling back of "making it up as we go". We've got everything pretty well dialed now). People throw the cliche of "we were a family" around pretty liberally, and I'm going to throw it around too. We were a family. We ate together, we drank together, and the "core" group always left together, meaning that nobody left until everybody's work was done. (including the managing partner, who absolutely didn't need to be, and was the one setting the example). This has been an absolutely amazing company to work for. The culture here was, or is amazing. The sad bit is that a lot of the culture that I fell in love with has faded. Yes, we're growing (rapidly! Awesome!), but we've more-or-less all hit our grooves. I know what I'm doing, the "CEO" does to, and there aren't really any scissors lifts or hammer drills left. --- I guess I'll end the story with a question: how do I/we get back to that?
  - Mz 14y ago
    how do I/we get back to that? If I am reading this correctly, you currently have around 200 employees and presumably started with less than that. If that is correct, break it up into two separate groups smaller than 150. Any time any part of the company grows beyond about 150 people, repeat. (Read "The tipping point" for longish explanation why. Short version: The typical human brain is designed for a "tribe" size of about 150.)
- systems 14y ago
  larry is a billionaire, his sense of things is different than ours, money is not an issue anymore for him, or at least not the same type of issue it really piss me off, when we ask an employee who is being paid peanuts to show the same dedication to his work place as the ceo or the owner, and claim this is the ethical thing to do
  - ramblerman 14y ago
    Right but the post is about ceo's and their behavior. You're veering into a completely different tangent. Not saying what your saying isn't true, but you might have misunderstood the message, nobody mentioned employees or how they should behave.
  - kika 14y ago
    Now imagine that Larry pays this employee a billion to unpack chairs or wash dishes. Would employee take? Definitely. Would he be doing this all the time from now on? I don't know.
- thebigshane 14y ago
  Another similar story that went around HN a year ago: http://thesash.me/wash-the-dishes-when-nobody-else-will http://thesash.me/wash-the-dishes-when-nobody-else-will and http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2193330 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2193330 The meat of the post (very similar to this article actually): One day, I walked by the kitchen and saw Cary washing the dishes. “Huh” I thought, “The CEO is pitching in. Cool.” I figured it must have been his turn or something, and sort of forgot about it. A week or so passed, and then it happened again. The kitchen became a ginormous mess, and then one day, there’s Cary, washing dishes. Then it happened again, and again. Each time, he’d look up, and nod, then go back to scrubbing dishes. One day, I walked by the kitchen and noticed it was a huge mess. So I washed the dishes. Being the CEO of the company isn’t about power, authority, or glamour, it’s about washing the dishes when nobody else will. Be the CEO of the company. Take responsibility for things that other people ignore. That’s the definition of leadership, and if you make a habit of it, pretty soon you'll be inspiring the people around you to do the same.
- faucet 14y ago
  No need to network. All those network nodes were already added to the Google's index by Larry's assistant-crawlers.
- 16s 14y ago
  That's a really cool story. He saw something needed to be done, so he did it. That's the kind of person I want to work with.
tomasien 14y ago
Not a fan of the title.The post doesn't even go on to argue that "you're" not the CEO, just that "you're" ALSO the janitor. So "You're the CEO - but You're Also the Fucking Janitor" would be more accurate.
- mcantor 14y ago
  Nitpicking. The loss of punch with the more accurate title would not be worth the hat-tip to pedantry.
- zbruhnke 14y ago
  OP here: Sorry about that, really what the post was meant to say is that if you think of yourself as the CEO there is already a problem, but if you think of yourself as the Janitor you're probably in the right mindset for success. Did not really expect the post to trend up HN so fast, but thanks for reading and for the feedback!
DanielRibeiro 14y ago
This is also a famous quote from Steve Jobs[1]: Steve Jobs: (what the CEO does) I don't know. Head janitor? [1] http://hot-facts.blogspot.com/2011/10/facts-about-steve-jobs-apple-co-founder.html http://hot-facts.blogspot.com/2011/10/facts-about-steve-jobs...
- objclxt 14y ago
  Actually, Steve Jobs' most famous janitor analogy takes it in completely the opposite direction - CEOs aren't like janitors, he says, because janitors are allowed to have excuses when things fail, and CEOs aren't. http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-05-07/tech/30043798_1_janitor-steve-jobs-excuse http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-05-07/tech/30043798...
deleted 14y ago
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tezza 14y ago
My Wife owns a cafe underneath some flats. Occassionally the flat sewerage backs up and effluent pours into the cafe basement. My Wife as the owner is the one there ungumming the pipes until a plumber can be hailed.
coderdude 14y ago
It's important to remember that the CEO/founder role is where the buck stops. You're ultimately responsible for every mistake and fixing it. He's right that it's not glamorous. I think that if you're a sole founder you figure this out pretty quickly though. And as a rule of thumb: Always ignore Silicon Valley hype. By the way: writing words in ALL CAPS, italicizing lots of things, and saying 'fucking' a lot made it painful to read that blog entry.
- zbruhnke 14y ago
  Thanks for the feedback. I typically italicize and bold things in an effort to break up the black/white monotony of my site but I'll keep the advice in mind and maybe go back and make some edits. As for the 'fucking' I agree, it was actually pretty hard to write too. I grew up in a middle class family in the South most of whom would be appalled by the way this post was written(the language) but I thought it put some fire to the post, and the title as well.
  - Zimahl 14y ago
    I wasn't sure why the 'F' was capitalized, that choice made both occurrences very odd with or without the bold/italic artistic license. I would assume someone with the title of 'Fucking Janitor' would be in a very different line of work than what tends to be talked about on HN.
    - kbronson 14y ago
      I also though the Fucking Janitor was some kind of special job, like a personal coach, a do-not-fuck-in-the-peeroom guard or shit. You know, because of the cap letter. But it's just another case of cussing, how disappointing.
  - orthecreedence 14y ago
    Don't change it. People on here have weak stomachs. I like a bit of strong writing once in a while, especially after having to sift through all the "I'm a CEO too lol" garbage that makes it to the front page. It's not out of place here. I completely share your view on this one. I'm not a CEO (CTO, heh) but leaders do what it takes. While ego can have its place in business, being the CEO of a shitty little startup is nothing to brag about. Once you're making millions a year in profit, then I think you're allowed to let it get to your head (although the best ones don't). I think the best leaders in the world recognize that being a leader is just another job. It doesn't make you better than anybody else, and it's not an excuse to look down on people, whether they're willing to learn from you or not.
rickdale 14y ago
I work with a small pharmacy that only has 5-6 employees. Every time I go there to meet with the owner hes on his hands and knees vacuuming or cleaning something. The last time I saw him there he was calking a chair back together. His exact words were, "Back to basics."
pbiggar 14y ago
I heard an anecdote a while back. One day, the employees of a small company arrive at work to discover that someone has taken a shit on the floor. Who's going to clean it? The owner of course. He didn't hire anyone whose job is to clean shit up, he can't reasonably expect any of them to do it, so he has to do it.
- ams6110 14y ago
  At the last small company I worked for, I came in one morning to find the CFO plunging the toilet and mopping the floor where it had overflowed. I laughed and made some comment about dedication to the company, he laughed and said well we don't have a cleaning staff so someone's gotta do it.
  - sharkweek 14y ago
    My dad owns a janitorial company of about 15 employees who service one local area of commercial offices. The janitorial service of the warehouse is paid separately to the employee who handles it. I always thought this was funny, but I appreciate the fairness.
- jkahn 14y ago
  Great comment. Funny and true. A CEO's job is also to clean up the metaphorical shit that gets dumped: I had one of those days today. Someone's got to do it.
smiler 14y ago
Seriously, does anyone take anyone seriously who calls themselves CEO, CTO or CFO of a 5 man company? How about owner or founder. Maybe it's a cultural thing but here in the UK we'd definitely laugh at someone calling themselves that unless it was a company of a considerable size.
- rachelbythebay 14y ago
  There was a similar phenomenon some years back when Linux (and other systems which could run on ordinary computers) started getting big. People thought running their own machine and/or having root was a big deal. They had to be reminded that "you aren't really a sysadmin until you have some users". It seems the same would apply here.
  - Evbn 14y ago
    They have at least one user, and they are learning how the system works more than on a win98 system. Did your first machine have multiple users?
- caseyohara 14y ago
  I don't understand this phenomenon either. The 5-man company of all C-level executives. Or the software shop with only "Senior" developers. I suspect it might be peacocking in an attempt to make the company appear bigger than it really is, or to have structure in place when the company grows (see: premature optimization). In the case of the "senior developers", I imagine it might be to instill a kind of trust with the company's clients that their business is being handled by 'senior' employees. Either way, I think it's silly.
- gedrap 14y ago
  I think it's more about the way you say/use it rather than the name you use. All those sayings would be equally (more or less) stupid/annoying if you replace C by (co-)founder. > I want you to think about this, how many interns get to go sit down and talk to the FOUNDER of a company about its inter-workings every day? it just does not make sense”
- 14y ago
jayzee 14y ago
What's wrong with being a janitor?
- zbruhnke 14y ago
  Nothing at all. That's something I think I did not portray clearly enough in this post. There is nothing wrong with being a janitor. Someone has to do it, the point was really to display that you have to do anything and everything necessary to make your company successful. Titles are bullshit and egos should be checked at the door.
  - jayzee 14y ago
    In that case it would be nice if people would stop bashing janitors.
    - mattdeboard 14y ago
      Who is bashing janitors?
- mattdeboard 14y ago
  Nothing, that's the point. Did you read the article?
  - jayzee 14y ago
    I did. The comparison seems to imply that being a CEO is not all that it's made out to be. It's like being the fucking janitor. Which is why I ask what is wrong with being a janitor.
    - pbiggar 14y ago
      That's not what I got from the article. I think it says that titles are bullshit, and that you do what has to be done to make a company succeed.
- vacri 14y ago
MaxGabriel 14y ago
If you can make a definite judgement of someone based on their job title alone ('Intern'), you're already lost.
- zbruhnke 14y ago
  Could not agree more Max
swlkr 14y ago
Working in a cubicle isn't glamorous either. At my last job I took out the trash when it needed to be taken out and I was a software engineer, that's just common courtesy. Being a CEO would be an upgrade for me in every way no matter how many articles swear that it's the worst thing in the world.
molossus 14y ago
With all due respect, when you submit your own blog post to HN, you could at least have the courtesy to take 5 minutes to proofread it. And when you don't, it comes across as unprofessional and undermines any ethos you may have had, and I am very unlikely to read past the second paragraph.
xarien 14y ago
I completely agree which is why I always refer to myself as the monkey and not the CEO.
iuguy 14y ago
In the UK we tend not to use CEO, we tend to use the term director or managing director. In my day job I'm the technical director at Mandalorian. It's a cool job, but I'm generally pretty overloaded and usually underpaid. I don't do it for the cash or free time, that's for sure, but I do love making a difference for our customers. In a strange way I took this approach to 44Con. Everything I do at 44Con is about making sure the delegates have a good time and learn something. If we need to put leaflets on seats, I'm out there. If a delegate has a problem, I want to know so I can fix it. A large part of startup success seems to be sales, but we shouldn't undersell the delivery and relationship aspects. If your customer is struggling to deal with you, then you're doing it wrong. If your customer has problems that you just can't fix, you're doing it wrong. I'll be the first to admit I've failed on both parts on occasion, sometimes simultaneously, but it's our ability to learn from these things that sets the smaller guys apart from the bigger. I'm the equivalent of a CEO at Mandalorian, but I'll proudly clean toilets if it makes for a better experience.
tdorrance 14y ago
Good post Zach. In fact, even though the CEO is company leader and the vision, if you got a startup of five I'd say everybody's the janitor! Titles mean very little in the early days when you're trying to launch a product. Everybody needs to be marketing, sales, product development, finance and legal - and of course the janitor crew. btw, good content outweighs format any day...
iuguy 14y ago
In the UK we tend not to use CEO, we tend to use the term director or managing director. In my day job I'm the technical director at Mandalorian. It's a cool job, but I'm generally pretty overloaded and usually underpaid. I don't do it for the cash or free time that's for sure, but I do love making a difference for our customers. In a strange way I took this approach to my other thing, 44Con. Everything I do at 44Con is about making sure the delegates have a good time and learn something. If we need to put leaflets on seats, I'm out there. If a delegate has a problem, I want to know so I can fix it. A large part of startup success seems to be sales, but we shouldn't undersell the delivery and relationship aspects. If your customer is struggling to deal with you, then you're doing it wrong. If your customer has problems that you just can't fix, you're doing it wrong. If you're sat in an ivory tower and refuse to get out and fix it when these things happen then you're doing it wrong. I'll be the first to admit I've failed on all parts on occasion, sometimes simultaneously, but it's our ability to learn from these things that sets the smaller guys apart from the bigger ones. Startups can make small mistakes, the established companies make far bigger ones without noticing. I'm the equivalent of a CEO at Mandalorian, but I'll proudly clean toilets if it makes for a better experience for our customers. Hoops? I live to jump through them, and I expect that from everyone I work with.
guynamedloren 14y ago
I almost completely agree with this post. However, if you spend a huge chunk of your time as a CEO (or founder/owner/whatever) performing a single task (or multiple rudimentary tasks) that could be performed better and more efficiently by a hired employee instead of using your experience to grow and propel the company, then you're doing something wrong.
peapicker 14y ago
Enough with the articles with curse words in the title. Grow up, little boys.
- vacri 14y ago
  I find it ironic that you have a problem with curse words as they represent immaturity, but you're fine with throwing demeaning insults at people.
  - peapicker 14y ago
    No irony in called a spade a spade. In my opinion, it the sign of a weak mind to need to use profanity to express strong emotion, of trying to 'write with fire' but failing utterly. A great writer never will need to resort to that so frequently, and then, when used super rarely, it is powerful. Used a lot, just meh -- and weak. Like an unrefined learner, a boy.
    - Retric 14y ago
      Only a child responds strongly to the world fuck. Most teenagers go through a phase of using it every third word. But, most adults I know only revert to peppering there language with it when they feel a type of mild annoyance. Normal speech and strong emotions evoke their own unique responses, but dealing with self absorbed idiots for to long and you think they might have Tourette syndrome while they unwind.
- tomjen3 14y ago
  Not all of us are prudish Americans. Fuck is a useful word.
- jff 14y ago
  I've made a policy of routinely downvoting anyone who complains about those naughty naughty swears, and I hope others will too. Enjoy!
mthreat 14y ago
At my previous company (where I stayed for 7 years), I remember seeing our CTO doing the dishes in the kitchen/break room once. This wasn't just in the first year, but about 5 years in. It didn't surprise me, it was more of a confirmation of what I already knew about him. The company is pretty successful today.
isalmon 14y ago
In my opinion CEO title should almost never be applied in a startup environment. It just shows how small you really are when you talk to people. I remember was working for one startup where we had CEO, CTO and me. How ridiculous it was before I came when the company consisted of exactly 2 people - CEO and CTO?
kevinalexbrown 14y ago
"In reality, there is, perhaps, no one of our natural passions so hard to subdue as pride. Disguise it, struggle with it, beat it down, stifle it, mortify it as much as one pleases, it is still alive, and will every now and then peep out and show itself; you will see it, perhaps, often in this history; for, even if I could conceive that I had completely overcome it, I should probably be proud of my humility." Benjamin Franklin (emphasis mine, and added only semi-seriously: how do I discuss the humility I take pride in?).
- chernevik 14y ago
  [From a senior devil, instructing a junior in the temptation of a human:] "Your patient has become humble; have you drawn his attention to the fact? All virtues are less formidable to us once the man is aware that he has them, but this is specially true of humility. Catch him at the moment when he is really poor in spirit and smuggle into his mind the gratifying reflection, 'By jove! I'm being humble', and almost immediately pride--pride at his own humility--will appear. If he awakes to the danger and tries to smother this new form of pride, make him proud of his attempt-- and so on, through as many stages as you please. But don't try this too long, for fear you awake his sense of humour and proportion in which case he will merely laugh at you and go to bed." "Screwtape Letters", C.S. Lewis
  - SkyMarshal 14y ago
    Reminds me of the end of The Devil's Advocate, conveniently available on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGXvj2BjZLA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGXvj2BjZLA
- sp332 14y ago
  Humility isn't thinking poorly of yourself, humility is not thinking of yourself at all.
  - chernevik 14y ago
    Yes. More from Mr. Lewis: ". . . . a man is not usually called upon to have an opinion of his own talents at all, since he can very well go on improving them to the best of his ability without deciding his own precise niche in the temple of Fame."
nothacker 14y ago
Really great post. The only thing I was expecting that wasn't there was something about having to be the janitor when it came to cleaning up other messes, like having to let people go, and then having to keep yourself from getting jaded and not taking firing someone seriously enough later.
cramborghini 14y ago
This really struck a chord with me. My Job title on my public facebook page has been CEO/Janitor for about a year now. It started off as a joke, but eventually I came to realize the truth behind it.
g-garron 14y ago
when I started my company (telecom supplier). I was the CEO (company of 5 at that time). I was also the sales guy, and very often the technician who was installing what was sold. If you really want to succeed you really need to do anything, once your company grows, you will have other people doing those tasks for you. Not because it is not good for you to do them, simply because you will have no time anymore. As an engineer, I still miss installing what we sell now a days.
g-garron 14y ago
:( another Wordpress site not ready for prime time. :(
deleted 14y ago
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davemel37 14y ago
I'll be impressed when the partner of a VC firm is caught sweeping the floors at a portfolio company :) I also believe that while humility is a great barometer for, "good guys," undervaluing your time as CEO and sweeping the floors is probably not the most productive or responsible thing to do as someone with fiduciary responsibilities to your investors, yourself, your employees and the overall success of the company.
andrewfelix 14y ago
"You're not the CEO - You're the Janitor" Would have been a perfectly fitting title. The use of the metaphor 'Janitor' was enough. Honestly does the profanity really add to the impact of the message?
- faucet 14y ago
  It's more fun if you are entitled to fuck.(excuse my profanity, but it's true!)
dpe82 14y ago
My company went through TechStars this Spring and on Friday closed a respectable seed round. On Sunday I was scrubbing the floor in our office. Being a startup CEO is glamorous only in the movies or in overly hyped bits and pieces. It doesn't completely suck, it's awesome at times and on average is more interesting than anything else I've done. But worthy of sharing intimate details as if I'm some amazingly interesting creature to be worshiped and followed? Please. Customers make a successful company, not CEOs.
miyudreams 14y ago
Great post, fun read. It's great to have a team where everyone contributes even if it includes cleaning up the office space and throwing out the trash.
flocial 14y ago
I love this post. We romanticize startups too much and I've seen too many people drunk on cheap venture capital and a C-level title on their business card. Some of it is inevitable because if we saw what being a CEO really is then less people would try it. Being a CEO is always hands on. You can't just manage from behind with a small team. Dave McClure recently said something like, "if you're the CEO and can't code, market, sell, or design then fire yourself now or we will."
munin 14y ago
all this talk about pride is hilarious. if you're the CEO of a startup or small company, you're not working for a paycheck - you're working for a payout of millions of dollars. I'll do the dishes if it leads indirectly to a $1.2bn exit. I'd do them twice.
steve8918 14y ago
A friend of mine is a multi-millionaire from running her own chain of nail salons. She is always going from store to store, checking on each store and if the store is busy, she'll be the first one taking the used foot water used for pedicures, sweeping, etc, doing whatever it takes to make sure the nail salonists can do their job, and also so that the customer is happy. She deserves every penny of her wealth.
teksquisite 14y ago
That was a great read and thank you! BTW - I recently made some new biz cards and switched "owner" to "CEO" (because I had my QR code printed on them :) and I still clean toilets and whack weeds... I think it is all in the mindset. I've met CEO's that think they can walk on water "Oh, Calgon - take it away..." And I've met CEO's who actually still do the grunt work. I prefer the latter because you should never forget where you began...
capex 14y ago
Empathy points for the average janitor: zero.
adrianhoward 14y ago
There was a startup I did some work for a few years back. The CEO attempted to remove himself from the washing up rota in the kitchen when a new employee came on board. At this point I knew the company was doomed :-)
brandoncapecci 14y ago
Anybody else think this guy seriously needs to pipe down? He sounds like 37signals minus the success. Every pleb thinks they can do a better job than the king. Nero thought that too...
- zbruhnke 14y ago
  Did not realize we were comparing successes. But just for your information I am 25. I had a seven figure exit before I could legally buy beer. I am a ycombinator alumni and I am building another startup right now that I hope will have it's own unique impact. So maybe I'm not DHH but I am certainly not just some guy with a big mouth and no track record
  - brandoncapecci 14y ago
    We weren't. I also didn't think we were parading our medals though clearly I was wrong in that regard. Is it janitors I'm thinking of that arrogantly brag about successes? After all, you seem to be the expert on them ;) I have no desire to take shots at you, so please don't make it so goddamn easy. 37Signals is just a metaphor for any established company. Since you clearly know of them, you also know they take a lot of shit for claims they make. The only reason I would so much as give them a second thought is because of their track record, which, as you noted, isn't yours. In retrospect DHH is far from the idealistic person to ask this which by pure luck, supports my argument even better. Don't take it personally as some sort of attack: I'm just making the observation that there are people who fly around in jets and you are not one of them. Quite simply, this means your really not in the position to make assertations about them. You're giving marriage advice without ever being married. Any ideal is meaningless until it is thoroughly tested. Your post seems as childish as when people claim: "I will never steal". I call bullshit. Morality is nice and all but until you hold it up when you're fucking starving and have reason to steal, everything you said before is just words on a page.
gamzer 14y ago
When you finished being the janitor, you could be the web developer for a moment and fix the navigation which floats above the text of the article on my Android phone when zoomed in via double tap.
- jefe78 14y ago
  Second that. Was pretty annoying during my commute.
lcusack 14y ago
I was impressed a while ago when a CEO actually named himself the "janitor" Check out: http://www.thenoteboard.net/faq.html http://www.thenoteboard.net/faq.html Scroll to the bottom
anacrolix 14y ago
Is this language really necessary? Do entrepreneurial pundits find it necessary to reaffirm their values?
sl4yerr 14y ago
Your point would be more clear if the article wasn't troubled with spelling and grammatical errors. Just like a programming language, English has a syntactical and grammatical form for a reason: it makes it less likely to be interpreted incorrectly.
rcvassallo 14y ago
I just saw this at my job last week - literally. Walked into the bathroom and the CEO was in action with a mop in his hand. He looked up and said "Oh hey I'll be out of the way in a few seconds, sometimes the toilet in here leaks."
ryanisinallofus 14y ago
Is it possible to brag about humility?
ZoFreX 14y ago
Ichiro Lambe of Dejobaan Games actually goes by the title "CEO & Janitor", which I've always liked a lot.
meiji 14y ago
The problem doesn't just exist with small companies and startups. I've worked with C-level people from established companies who are no more self-aware; they feel the job title makes them important rather than responsible. They feel the job title means they work less rather than work more. In both cases the latter is true. I'd take someone seriously as a CEO if they behaved like one and that includes involving your colleagues in what you do, be they the board of a fortune 500 company or a few interns for a bootstrapping startup. The arrogance that you are the only person who has good ideas is what kills companies and that goes double for startups of any ilk.

371 points by zbruhnke 14y ago

cs702 14y ago

This article reminds me a bit of 'the parable of the silver bowls:' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjzqO6UOPFQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjzqO6UOPFQ -- regardless of the size of the organization, its leaders are the ones who must deal with the stuff no one else can or wants to tackle.

colindoc84 14y ago

Starting off with a strawman is a good way to write a bad blog post.

michael_nielsen 14y ago

Seems appropriate to quote an old HN comment (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3905794 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3905794): "After the first night of the 2008 SciFoo conference at Google, @gnat Torkington's twitter stream contained a gem: 'At SciFoo opening session. 300 people standing around networking. Meanwhile, Larry Page is quietly unpacking chairs at the back of the room.' (from memory, not exact)" The CEO (or any leader)'s job is to make sure that whatever needs to be done, gets done. Sometimes, that means unpacking the chairs.

koide 14y ago
I get very upset when junior employees try to keep me from doing the 'dirty work' I'm preparing to do or already doing. I'm not sure where this whole nonsense of "people who lead can't get dirty or do menial work" comes from. If I had something more important to do for sure I would have delegated, but seeing that I didn't, ask why is this particular thing important or, at most, offer help. Don't tell me I shouldn't be doing this! Context: I lead a team of 4. And by 'dirty work' I mean plugging up servers, doing maintenance on them, physical networking stuff, cleaning up debris after an installation, etc.
- alttab 14y ago
  Is it possible that your team wants to demonstrate some level of ownership? Maybe prove to you that they have what it takes? I don't do things because my boss is a vp and is above the work. I do things because I fully own my job and gobble up as much responsibility as I can get.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- mbreese 14y ago
  Are you any good at it? Maybe they don't want you to do it for a reason :)
  - ivix 14y ago
    Yes, don't forget that they may be afraid of telling you you're not helping.
    - koide 14y ago
      That's not the case, I'm sure.
blhack 14y ago
I'll share a story an interaction with a company that I worked heavily with while we were launching (this is a startup in a fairly niche, non-technical space. A smallish company with around 200 employees): The "CEO": This guy had a large stake in the company. It was his baby, and while the "CEO" title (which I think gets way over applied) fits him, his official title is "managing partner". While we were in the process of build->launch, he was heavily involved in literally every single department. Not in a micro-managing way, in an "this needs to be done and here, I am going to help" way. It would absolutely not have seemed strange to me, or anybody else, to see him out on a scissor lift with a hammer drill and some cables mounting something to the wall, if that's what was needed. When we did launch, some things went...wrong. The night before we opened, he, as well as some of his friends, not even people employed by us, spent until almost-down doing "grunt" work. Dirty, tedious work moving huge heavy things around, and walking all over the place to get them. That night he slept here (so did I) The months leading up until that launch, and the months following it, he was here until well after dark because a lot of the people who had been hired were "green", and had no idea how to do their job yet. We were all figuring it out as we went. The culture here at that time was addictive (and I wish we could get that feeling back of "making it up as we go". We've got everything pretty well dialed now). People throw the cliche of "we were a family" around pretty liberally, and I'm going to throw it around too. We were a family. We ate together, we drank together, and the "core" group always left together, meaning that nobody left until everybody's work was done. (including the managing partner, who absolutely didn't need to be, and was the one setting the example). This has been an absolutely amazing company to work for. The culture here was, or is amazing. The sad bit is that a lot of the culture that I fell in love with has faded. Yes, we're growing (rapidly! Awesome!), but we've more-or-less all hit our grooves. I know what I'm doing, the "CEO" does to, and there aren't really any scissors lifts or hammer drills left. --- I guess I'll end the story with a question: how do I/we get back to that?
- Mz 14y ago
  how do I/we get back to that? If I am reading this correctly, you currently have around 200 employees and presumably started with less than that. If that is correct, break it up into two separate groups smaller than 150. Any time any part of the company grows beyond about 150 people, repeat. (Read "The tipping point" for longish explanation why. Short version: The typical human brain is designed for a "tribe" size of about 150.)
systems 14y ago
larry is a billionaire, his sense of things is different than ours, money is not an issue anymore for him, or at least not the same type of issue it really piss me off, when we ask an employee who is being paid peanuts to show the same dedication to his work place as the ceo or the owner, and claim this is the ethical thing to do
- ramblerman 14y ago
  Right but the post is about ceo's and their behavior. You're veering into a completely different tangent. Not saying what your saying isn't true, but you might have misunderstood the message, nobody mentioned employees or how they should behave.
- kika 14y ago
  Now imagine that Larry pays this employee a billion to unpack chairs or wash dishes. Would employee take? Definitely. Would he be doing this all the time from now on? I don't know.
thebigshane 14y ago
Another similar story that went around HN a year ago: http://thesash.me/wash-the-dishes-when-nobody-else-will http://thesash.me/wash-the-dishes-when-nobody-else-will and http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2193330 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2193330 The meat of the post (very similar to this article actually): One day, I walked by the kitchen and saw Cary washing the dishes. “Huh” I thought, “The CEO is pitching in. Cool.” I figured it must have been his turn or something, and sort of forgot about it. A week or so passed, and then it happened again. The kitchen became a ginormous mess, and then one day, there’s Cary, washing dishes. Then it happened again, and again. Each time, he’d look up, and nod, then go back to scrubbing dishes. One day, I walked by the kitchen and noticed it was a huge mess. So I washed the dishes. Being the CEO of the company isn’t about power, authority, or glamour, it’s about washing the dishes when nobody else will. Be the CEO of the company. Take responsibility for things that other people ignore. That’s the definition of leadership, and if you make a habit of it, pretty soon you'll be inspiring the people around you to do the same.
faucet 14y ago
No need to network. All those network nodes were already added to the Google's index by Larry's assistant-crawlers.
16s 14y ago
That's a really cool story. He saw something needed to be done, so he did it. That's the kind of person I want to work with.

tomasien 14y ago

Not a fan of the title.The post doesn't even go on to argue that "you're" not the CEO, just that "you're" ALSO the janitor. So "You're the CEO - but You're Also the Fucking Janitor" would be more accurate.

mcantor 14y ago
Nitpicking. The loss of punch with the more accurate title would not be worth the hat-tip to pedantry.
zbruhnke 14y ago
OP here: Sorry about that, really what the post was meant to say is that if you think of yourself as the CEO there is already a problem, but if you think of yourself as the Janitor you're probably in the right mindset for success. Did not really expect the post to trend up HN so fast, but thanks for reading and for the feedback!

DanielRibeiro 14y ago

This is also a famous quote from Steve Jobs[1]: Steve Jobs: (what the CEO does) I don't know. Head janitor? [1] http://hot-facts.blogspot.com/2011/10/facts-about-steve-jobs-apple-co-founder.html http://hot-facts.blogspot.com/2011/10/facts-about-steve-jobs...

objclxt 14y ago
Actually, Steve Jobs' most famous janitor analogy takes it in completely the opposite direction - CEOs aren't like janitors, he says, because janitors are allowed to have excuses when things fail, and CEOs aren't. http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-05-07/tech/30043798_1_janitor-steve-jobs-excuse http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-05-07/tech/30043798...

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

tezza 14y ago

My Wife owns a cafe underneath some flats. Occassionally the flat sewerage backs up and effluent pours into the cafe basement. My Wife as the owner is the one there ungumming the pipes until a plumber can be hailed.

coderdude 14y ago

It's important to remember that the CEO/founder role is where the buck stops. You're ultimately responsible for every mistake and fixing it. He's right that it's not glamorous. I think that if you're a sole founder you figure this out pretty quickly though. And as a rule of thumb: Always ignore Silicon Valley hype. By the way: writing words in ALL CAPS, italicizing lots of things, and saying 'fucking' a lot made it painful to read that blog entry.

zbruhnke 14y ago
Thanks for the feedback. I typically italicize and bold things in an effort to break up the black/white monotony of my site but I'll keep the advice in mind and maybe go back and make some edits. As for the 'fucking' I agree, it was actually pretty hard to write too. I grew up in a middle class family in the South most of whom would be appalled by the way this post was written(the language) but I thought it put some fire to the post, and the title as well.
- Zimahl 14y ago
  I wasn't sure why the 'F' was capitalized, that choice made both occurrences very odd with or without the bold/italic artistic license. I would assume someone with the title of 'Fucking Janitor' would be in a very different line of work than what tends to be talked about on HN.
  - kbronson 14y ago
    I also though the Fucking Janitor was some kind of special job, like a personal coach, a do-not-fuck-in-the-peeroom guard or shit. You know, because of the cap letter. But it's just another case of cussing, how disappointing.
- orthecreedence 14y ago
  Don't change it. People on here have weak stomachs. I like a bit of strong writing once in a while, especially after having to sift through all the "I'm a CEO too lol" garbage that makes it to the front page. It's not out of place here. I completely share your view on this one. I'm not a CEO (CTO, heh) but leaders do what it takes. While ego can have its place in business, being the CEO of a shitty little startup is nothing to brag about. Once you're making millions a year in profit, then I think you're allowed to let it get to your head (although the best ones don't). I think the best leaders in the world recognize that being a leader is just another job. It doesn't make you better than anybody else, and it's not an excuse to look down on people, whether they're willing to learn from you or not.

rickdale 14y ago

I work with a small pharmacy that only has 5-6 employees. Every time I go there to meet with the owner hes on his hands and knees vacuuming or cleaning something. The last time I saw him there he was calking a chair back together. His exact words were, "Back to basics."

pbiggar 14y ago

I heard an anecdote a while back. One day, the employees of a small company arrive at work to discover that someone has taken a shit on the floor. Who's going to clean it? The owner of course. He didn't hire anyone whose job is to clean shit up, he can't reasonably expect any of them to do it, so he has to do it.

ams6110 14y ago
At the last small company I worked for, I came in one morning to find the CFO plunging the toilet and mopping the floor where it had overflowed. I laughed and made some comment about dedication to the company, he laughed and said well we don't have a cleaning staff so someone's gotta do it.
- sharkweek 14y ago
  My dad owns a janitorial company of about 15 employees who service one local area of commercial offices. The janitorial service of the warehouse is paid separately to the employee who handles it. I always thought this was funny, but I appreciate the fairness.
jkahn 14y ago
Great comment. Funny and true. A CEO's job is also to clean up the metaphorical shit that gets dumped: I had one of those days today. Someone's got to do it.

smiler 14y ago

Seriously, does anyone take anyone seriously who calls themselves CEO, CTO or CFO of a 5 man company? How about owner or founder. Maybe it's a cultural thing but here in the UK we'd definitely laugh at someone calling themselves that unless it was a company of a considerable size.

rachelbythebay 14y ago
There was a similar phenomenon some years back when Linux (and other systems which could run on ordinary computers) started getting big. People thought running their own machine and/or having root was a big deal. They had to be reminded that "you aren't really a sysadmin until you have some users". It seems the same would apply here.
- Evbn 14y ago
  They have at least one user, and they are learning how the system works more than on a win98 system. Did your first machine have multiple users?
caseyohara 14y ago
I don't understand this phenomenon either. The 5-man company of all C-level executives. Or the software shop with only "Senior" developers. I suspect it might be peacocking in an attempt to make the company appear bigger than it really is, or to have structure in place when the company grows (see: premature optimization). In the case of the "senior developers", I imagine it might be to instill a kind of trust with the company's clients that their business is being handled by 'senior' employees. Either way, I think it's silly.
gedrap 14y ago
I think it's more about the way you say/use it rather than the name you use. All those sayings would be equally (more or less) stupid/annoying if you replace C by (co-)founder. > I want you to think about this, how many interns get to go sit down and talk to the FOUNDER of a company about its inter-workings every day? it just does not make sense”
14y ago

jayzee 14y ago

What's wrong with being a janitor?

zbruhnke 14y ago
Nothing at all. That's something I think I did not portray clearly enough in this post. There is nothing wrong with being a janitor. Someone has to do it, the point was really to display that you have to do anything and everything necessary to make your company successful. Titles are bullshit and egos should be checked at the door.
- jayzee 14y ago
  In that case it would be nice if people would stop bashing janitors.
  - mattdeboard 14y ago
    Who is bashing janitors?
mattdeboard 14y ago
Nothing, that's the point. Did you read the article?
- jayzee 14y ago
  I did. The comparison seems to imply that being a CEO is not all that it's made out to be. It's like being the fucking janitor. Which is why I ask what is wrong with being a janitor.
  - pbiggar 14y ago
    That's not what I got from the article. I think it says that titles are bullshit, and that you do what has to be done to make a company succeed.
vacri 14y ago

MaxGabriel 14y ago

If you can make a definite judgement of someone based on their job title alone ('Intern'), you're already lost.

zbruhnke 14y ago
Could not agree more Max

swlkr 14y ago

Working in a cubicle isn't glamorous either. At my last job I took out the trash when it needed to be taken out and I was a software engineer, that's just common courtesy. Being a CEO would be an upgrade for me in every way no matter how many articles swear that it's the worst thing in the world.

molossus 14y ago

With all due respect, when you submit your own blog post to HN, you could at least have the courtesy to take 5 minutes to proofread it. And when you don't, it comes across as unprofessional and undermines any ethos you may have had, and I am very unlikely to read past the second paragraph.

xarien 14y ago

I completely agree which is why I always refer to myself as the monkey and not the CEO.

iuguy 14y ago

In the UK we tend not to use CEO, we tend to use the term director or managing director. In my day job I'm the technical director at Mandalorian. It's a cool job, but I'm generally pretty overloaded and usually underpaid. I don't do it for the cash or free time, that's for sure, but I do love making a difference for our customers. In a strange way I took this approach to 44Con. Everything I do at 44Con is about making sure the delegates have a good time and learn something. If we need to put leaflets on seats, I'm out there. If a delegate has a problem, I want to know so I can fix it. A large part of startup success seems to be sales, but we shouldn't undersell the delivery and relationship aspects. If your customer is struggling to deal with you, then you're doing it wrong. If your customer has problems that you just can't fix, you're doing it wrong. I'll be the first to admit I've failed on both parts on occasion, sometimes simultaneously, but it's our ability to learn from these things that sets the smaller guys apart from the bigger. I'm the equivalent of a CEO at Mandalorian, but I'll proudly clean toilets if it makes for a better experience.

tdorrance 14y ago

Good post Zach. In fact, even though the CEO is company leader and the vision, if you got a startup of five I'd say everybody's the janitor! Titles mean very little in the early days when you're trying to launch a product. Everybody needs to be marketing, sales, product development, finance and legal - and of course the janitor crew. btw, good content outweighs format any day...

iuguy 14y ago

In the UK we tend not to use CEO, we tend to use the term director or managing director. In my day job I'm the technical director at Mandalorian. It's a cool job, but I'm generally pretty overloaded and usually underpaid. I don't do it for the cash or free time that's for sure, but I do love making a difference for our customers. In a strange way I took this approach to my other thing, 44Con. Everything I do at 44Con is about making sure the delegates have a good time and learn something. If we need to put leaflets on seats, I'm out there. If a delegate has a problem, I want to know so I can fix it. A large part of startup success seems to be sales, but we shouldn't undersell the delivery and relationship aspects. If your customer is struggling to deal with you, then you're doing it wrong. If your customer has problems that you just can't fix, you're doing it wrong. If you're sat in an ivory tower and refuse to get out and fix it when these things happen then you're doing it wrong. I'll be the first to admit I've failed on all parts on occasion, sometimes simultaneously, but it's our ability to learn from these things that sets the smaller guys apart from the bigger ones. Startups can make small mistakes, the established companies make far bigger ones without noticing. I'm the equivalent of a CEO at Mandalorian, but I'll proudly clean toilets if it makes for a better experience for our customers. Hoops? I live to jump through them, and I expect that from everyone I work with.

guynamedloren 14y ago

I almost completely agree with this post. However, if you spend a huge chunk of your time as a CEO (or founder/owner/whatever) performing a single task (or multiple rudimentary tasks) that could be performed better and more efficiently by a hired employee instead of using your experience to grow and propel the company, then you're doing something wrong.

peapicker 14y ago

Enough with the articles with curse words in the title. Grow up, little boys.

vacri 14y ago
I find it ironic that you have a problem with curse words as they represent immaturity, but you're fine with throwing demeaning insults at people.
- peapicker 14y ago
  No irony in called a spade a spade. In my opinion, it the sign of a weak mind to need to use profanity to express strong emotion, of trying to 'write with fire' but failing utterly. A great writer never will need to resort to that so frequently, and then, when used super rarely, it is powerful. Used a lot, just meh -- and weak. Like an unrefined learner, a boy.
  - Retric 14y ago
    Only a child responds strongly to the world fuck. Most teenagers go through a phase of using it every third word. But, most adults I know only revert to peppering there language with it when they feel a type of mild annoyance. Normal speech and strong emotions evoke their own unique responses, but dealing with self absorbed idiots for to long and you think they might have Tourette syndrome while they unwind.
tomjen3 14y ago
Not all of us are prudish Americans. Fuck is a useful word.
jff 14y ago
I've made a policy of routinely downvoting anyone who complains about those naughty naughty swears, and I hope others will too. Enjoy!

mthreat 14y ago

At my previous company (where I stayed for 7 years), I remember seeing our CTO doing the dishes in the kitchen/break room once. This wasn't just in the first year, but about 5 years in. It didn't surprise me, it was more of a confirmation of what I already knew about him. The company is pretty successful today.

isalmon 14y ago

In my opinion CEO title should almost never be applied in a startup environment. It just shows how small you really are when you talk to people. I remember was working for one startup where we had CEO, CTO and me. How ridiculous it was before I came when the company consisted of exactly 2 people - CEO and CTO?

kevinalexbrown 14y ago

"In reality, there is, perhaps, no one of our natural passions so hard to subdue as pride. Disguise it, struggle with it, beat it down, stifle it, mortify it as much as one pleases, it is still alive, and will every now and then peep out and show itself; you will see it, perhaps, often in this history; for, even if I could conceive that I had completely overcome it, I should probably be proud of my humility." Benjamin Franklin (emphasis mine, and added only semi-seriously: how do I discuss the humility I take pride in?).

chernevik 14y ago
[From a senior devil, instructing a junior in the temptation of a human:] "Your patient has become humble; have you drawn his attention to the fact? All virtues are less formidable to us once the man is aware that he has them, but this is specially true of humility. Catch him at the moment when he is really poor in spirit and smuggle into his mind the gratifying reflection, 'By jove! I'm being humble', and almost immediately pride--pride at his own humility--will appear. If he awakes to the danger and tries to smother this new form of pride, make him proud of his attempt-- and so on, through as many stages as you please. But don't try this too long, for fear you awake his sense of humour and proportion in which case he will merely laugh at you and go to bed." "Screwtape Letters", C.S. Lewis
- SkyMarshal 14y ago
  Reminds me of the end of The Devil's Advocate, conveniently available on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGXvj2BjZLA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGXvj2BjZLA
sp332 14y ago
Humility isn't thinking poorly of yourself, humility is not thinking of yourself at all.
- chernevik 14y ago
  Yes. More from Mr. Lewis: ". . . . a man is not usually called upon to have an opinion of his own talents at all, since he can very well go on improving them to the best of his ability without deciding his own precise niche in the temple of Fame."

nothacker 14y ago

Really great post. The only thing I was expecting that wasn't there was something about having to be the janitor when it came to cleaning up other messes, like having to let people go, and then having to keep yourself from getting jaded and not taking firing someone seriously enough later.

cramborghini 14y ago

This really struck a chord with me. My Job title on my public facebook page has been CEO/Janitor for about a year now. It started off as a joke, but eventually I came to realize the truth behind it.

g-garron 14y ago

when I started my company (telecom supplier). I was the CEO (company of 5 at that time). I was also the sales guy, and very often the technician who was installing what was sold. If you really want to succeed you really need to do anything, once your company grows, you will have other people doing those tasks for you. Not because it is not good for you to do them, simply because you will have no time anymore. As an engineer, I still miss installing what we sell now a days.

g-garron 14y ago

:( another Wordpress site not ready for prime time. :(

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

davemel37 14y ago

I'll be impressed when the partner of a VC firm is caught sweeping the floors at a portfolio company :) I also believe that while humility is a great barometer for, "good guys," undervaluing your time as CEO and sweeping the floors is probably not the most productive or responsible thing to do as someone with fiduciary responsibilities to your investors, yourself, your employees and the overall success of the company.

andrewfelix 14y ago

"You're not the CEO - You're the Janitor" Would have been a perfectly fitting title. The use of the metaphor 'Janitor' was enough. Honestly does the profanity really add to the impact of the message?

faucet 14y ago
It's more fun if you are entitled to fuck.(excuse my profanity, but it's true!)

dpe82 14y ago

My company went through TechStars this Spring and on Friday closed a respectable seed round. On Sunday I was scrubbing the floor in our office. Being a startup CEO is glamorous only in the movies or in overly hyped bits and pieces. It doesn't completely suck, it's awesome at times and on average is more interesting than anything else I've done. But worthy of sharing intimate details as if I'm some amazingly interesting creature to be worshiped and followed? Please. Customers make a successful company, not CEOs.

miyudreams 14y ago

Great post, fun read. It's great to have a team where everyone contributes even if it includes cleaning up the office space and throwing out the trash.

flocial 14y ago

I love this post. We romanticize startups too much and I've seen too many people drunk on cheap venture capital and a C-level title on their business card. Some of it is inevitable because if we saw what being a CEO really is then less people would try it. Being a CEO is always hands on. You can't just manage from behind with a small team. Dave McClure recently said something like, "if you're the CEO and can't code, market, sell, or design then fire yourself now or we will."

munin 14y ago

all this talk about pride is hilarious. if you're the CEO of a startup or small company, you're not working for a paycheck - you're working for a payout of millions of dollars. I'll do the dishes if it leads indirectly to a $1.2bn exit. I'd do them twice.

steve8918 14y ago

A friend of mine is a multi-millionaire from running her own chain of nail salons. She is always going from store to store, checking on each store and if the store is busy, she'll be the first one taking the used foot water used for pedicures, sweeping, etc, doing whatever it takes to make sure the nail salonists can do their job, and also so that the customer is happy. She deserves every penny of her wealth.

teksquisite 14y ago

That was a great read and thank you! BTW - I recently made some new biz cards and switched "owner" to "CEO" (because I had my QR code printed on them :) and I still clean toilets and whack weeds... I think it is all in the mindset. I've met CEO's that think they can walk on water "Oh, Calgon - take it away..." And I've met CEO's who actually still do the grunt work. I prefer the latter because you should never forget where you began...

capex 14y ago

Empathy points for the average janitor: zero.

adrianhoward 14y ago

There was a startup I did some work for a few years back. The CEO attempted to remove himself from the washing up rota in the kitchen when a new employee came on board. At this point I knew the company was doomed :-)

brandoncapecci 14y ago

Anybody else think this guy seriously needs to pipe down? He sounds like 37signals minus the success. Every pleb thinks they can do a better job than the king. Nero thought that too...

zbruhnke 14y ago
Did not realize we were comparing successes. But just for your information I am 25. I had a seven figure exit before I could legally buy beer. I am a ycombinator alumni and I am building another startup right now that I hope will have it's own unique impact. So maybe I'm not DHH but I am certainly not just some guy with a big mouth and no track record
- brandoncapecci 14y ago
  We weren't. I also didn't think we were parading our medals though clearly I was wrong in that regard. Is it janitors I'm thinking of that arrogantly brag about successes? After all, you seem to be the expert on them ;) I have no desire to take shots at you, so please don't make it so goddamn easy. 37Signals is just a metaphor for any established company. Since you clearly know of them, you also know they take a lot of shit for claims they make. The only reason I would so much as give them a second thought is because of their track record, which, as you noted, isn't yours. In retrospect DHH is far from the idealistic person to ask this which by pure luck, supports my argument even better. Don't take it personally as some sort of attack: I'm just making the observation that there are people who fly around in jets and you are not one of them. Quite simply, this means your really not in the position to make assertations about them. You're giving marriage advice without ever being married. Any ideal is meaningless until it is thoroughly tested. Your post seems as childish as when people claim: "I will never steal". I call bullshit. Morality is nice and all but until you hold it up when you're fucking starving and have reason to steal, everything you said before is just words on a page.

gamzer 14y ago

When you finished being the janitor, you could be the web developer for a moment and fix the navigation which floats above the text of the article on my Android phone when zoomed in via double tap.

jefe78 14y ago
Second that. Was pretty annoying during my commute.

lcusack 14y ago

I was impressed a while ago when a CEO actually named himself the "janitor" Check out: http://www.thenoteboard.net/faq.html http://www.thenoteboard.net/faq.html Scroll to the bottom

anacrolix 14y ago

Is this language really necessary? Do entrepreneurial pundits find it necessary to reaffirm their values?

sl4yerr 14y ago

Your point would be more clear if the article wasn't troubled with spelling and grammatical errors. Just like a programming language, English has a syntactical and grammatical form for a reason: it makes it less likely to be interpreted incorrectly.

rcvassallo 14y ago

I just saw this at my job last week - literally. Walked into the bathroom and the CEO was in action with a mop in his hand. He looked up and said "Oh hey I'll be out of the way in a few seconds, sometimes the toilet in here leaks."

ryanisinallofus 14y ago

Is it possible to brag about humility?

ZoFreX 14y ago

Ichiro Lambe of Dejobaan Games actually goes by the title "CEO & Janitor", which I've always liked a lot.

meiji 14y ago

The problem doesn't just exist with small companies and startups. I've worked with C-level people from established companies who are no more self-aware; they feel the job title makes them important rather than responsible. They feel the job title means they work less rather than work more. In both cases the latter is true. I'd take someone seriously as a CEO if they behaved like one and that includes involving your colleagues in what you do, be they the board of a fortune 500 company or a few interns for a bootstrapping startup. The arrogance that you are the only person who has good ideas is what kills companies and that goes double for startups of any ilk.