6 ms·

$1B Solar and Battery Storage Project Breaks Ground in Utah

66 points by m463 2y ago

KennyBlanken 2y ago
[flagged]
- asah 2y ago
  You want NIMBY/NIMBY, let Manhattan into the chat! You have Elizabeth Street garden getting bulldozed for affordable housing, Chinatown bulldozed for a megajail (yes, in Manhattan), and who knows what'll happen with casinos in Hudson Yards. Then rezoning stopped in Soho, Noho, UWS, even Gowanus.
- lizknope 2y ago
  Where does your electricity come from currently? I looked up Emery County on the map and I see I've driven through it on I-70 multiple times while visiting national parks. I've driven through Cottonwood Canyon Road in Grand Staircase Escalante National Monument and there are power lines from Glen Canyon dam that are parallel to the dirt road. Do those lines extend to Emery County? Or do you have some other local power plants? Genuinely curious.
- linotype 2y ago
  Boomers will be dead before climate change impacts them. Therefore it is a non-issue.
  - beeflet 2y ago
    [dead]
jimt1234 2y ago
> ... Tesla is providing battery storage. This supports my theory that Elon has become a right wing warrior in order to gain credibility and political capital in right wing states, allowing him to obtain massive contracts for electricity storage (and production, too?). And I think it's worked extremely well. 5+ years ago Tesla was a California, tech-weenie company, and that in itself is gonna keep a lot of doors closed in red states.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  The Gigafactory Nevada site was selected back in 2014. Tesla is just a leader in this space. They are still doing grid level storage in left leaning California. In fact, a project more than 10 times this big was just announced in California. https://www.intersectpower.com/tesla-provides-intersect-power-with-15-3-gwh-of-megapacks-for-solar-storage-projects/ https://www.intersectpower.com/tesla-provides-intersect-powe...
- Loughla 2y ago
  I think it's probably more likely that he became a right wing warrior because he was always that thing, but finally felt that he was untouchable.
  - mustafa_pasi 2y ago
    To me it seems like the Democrats have a very weird hierarchy and Musk couldn't do any inroads there, because the incumbents at the top of that hierarchy consider him an outsider. So his options were to either suck it up and accept his status within hierarchy, or champion a Republican candidate which, if elected, would immediately propel him to the very front of the decision making.
    - Loughla 2y ago
      Again, it's a theory. But I'm still saying it's WAY more plausible that he felt empowered to do whatever he wantedn instead of masking.
      - cma 2y ago
        Lots of people seem to flip hard right after #metoo calls out their behavior. Musk had the horse for handjob thing and announced he was a Republican something like the day before it published after they had contacted him about it for the story.
    - ericd 2y ago
      Maybe he just got tired of dems doing stuff like saying that GM had been leading the way on EVs, and not mentioning Tesla at all, because it wasn’t politically expedient? Or trying to structure the rebates to benefit the big 3 more than Tesla. Etc etc.
_ea1k 2y ago
Can someone explain the economics of this to me? As I understand it, battery storage isn't cheaper than just base load generation (nuclear, combined cycle). However, it sounds like natural gas peaker plants are significantly more expensive. Can that be quantified? ~80% more, or more than $.03kwh difference? Are the levelized costs of battery storage, including financing, now less than this? Are incentives a part of it? I'm guessing the solar aspect plays into this as well, as a large plant like that likely produces at times when prices are relatively cheap. It'd be really to see it all quantified.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  I dont have the data you are looking for, but my take on California is that cost is largely an afterthought. regulatory pressure and regulatory costs drive up or eliminate the alternatives, and power companies have a captive market. As a result, I'm paying $0.50/kwh with a large green component, and have no choice on the matter. My only alternative is to try and reduce my use of the grid, which also means going solar.
  - energy123 2y ago
    There's private energy developers building multi-GW of utility scale battery storage in Texas at the moment.
  - _ea1k 2y ago
    One of the most compelling arguments that I hear from the anti-renewables types is that they do it in California and it doesn't work. I think there's more to it than that, though. TX has seen tremendous growth in renewables, and grid pricing is excellent there from the prices that I've seen.
    - energy123 2y ago
      > TX has seen tremendous growth in renewables, and grid pricing is excellent there from the prices that I've seen. Kansas and Iowa are 40-60% wind and have lower prices than the national average: https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...
tbrownaw 2y ago
> 400-megawatt (MW) solar and 400 MW/1,600-megawatt-hour battery storage So 4 hours worth of storage is apparently enough to make this sort of thing work.
- skybrian 2y ago
  It’s enough to shift power to the evening when demand is highest.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

66 points by m463 2y ago

KennyBlanken 2y ago

[flagged]

asah 2y ago
You want NIMBY/NIMBY, let Manhattan into the chat! You have Elizabeth Street garden getting bulldozed for affordable housing, Chinatown bulldozed for a megajail (yes, in Manhattan), and who knows what'll happen with casinos in Hudson Yards. Then rezoning stopped in Soho, Noho, UWS, even Gowanus.
lizknope 2y ago
Where does your electricity come from currently? I looked up Emery County on the map and I see I've driven through it on I-70 multiple times while visiting national parks. I've driven through Cottonwood Canyon Road in Grand Staircase Escalante National Monument and there are power lines from Glen Canyon dam that are parallel to the dirt road. Do those lines extend to Emery County? Or do you have some other local power plants? Genuinely curious.
linotype 2y ago
Boomers will be dead before climate change impacts them. Therefore it is a non-issue.
- beeflet 2y ago
  [dead]

jimt1234 2y ago

> ... Tesla is providing battery storage. This supports my theory that Elon has become a right wing warrior in order to gain credibility and political capital in right wing states, allowing him to obtain massive contracts for electricity storage (and production, too?). And I think it's worked extremely well. 5+ years ago Tesla was a California, tech-weenie company, and that in itself is gonna keep a lot of doors closed in red states.

s1artibartfast 2y ago
The Gigafactory Nevada site was selected back in 2014. Tesla is just a leader in this space. They are still doing grid level storage in left leaning California. In fact, a project more than 10 times this big was just announced in California. https://www.intersectpower.com/tesla-provides-intersect-power-with-15-3-gwh-of-megapacks-for-solar-storage-projects/ https://www.intersectpower.com/tesla-provides-intersect-powe...
Loughla 2y ago
I think it's probably more likely that he became a right wing warrior because he was always that thing, but finally felt that he was untouchable.
- mustafa_pasi 2y ago
  To me it seems like the Democrats have a very weird hierarchy and Musk couldn't do any inroads there, because the incumbents at the top of that hierarchy consider him an outsider. So his options were to either suck it up and accept his status within hierarchy, or champion a Republican candidate which, if elected, would immediately propel him to the very front of the decision making.
  - Loughla 2y ago
    Again, it's a theory. But I'm still saying it's WAY more plausible that he felt empowered to do whatever he wantedn instead of masking.
    - cma 2y ago
      Lots of people seem to flip hard right after #metoo calls out their behavior. Musk had the horse for handjob thing and announced he was a Republican something like the day before it published after they had contacted him about it for the story.
  - ericd 2y ago
    Maybe he just got tired of dems doing stuff like saying that GM had been leading the way on EVs, and not mentioning Tesla at all, because it wasn’t politically expedient? Or trying to structure the rebates to benefit the big 3 more than Tesla. Etc etc.

_ea1k 2y ago

Can someone explain the economics of this to me? As I understand it, battery storage isn't cheaper than just base load generation (nuclear, combined cycle). However, it sounds like natural gas peaker plants are significantly more expensive. Can that be quantified? ~80% more, or more than $.03kwh difference? Are the levelized costs of battery storage, including financing, now less than this? Are incentives a part of it? I'm guessing the solar aspect plays into this as well, as a large plant like that likely produces at times when prices are relatively cheap. It'd be really to see it all quantified.

s1artibartfast 2y ago
I dont have the data you are looking for, but my take on California is that cost is largely an afterthought. regulatory pressure and regulatory costs drive up or eliminate the alternatives, and power companies have a captive market. As a result, I'm paying $0.50/kwh with a large green component, and have no choice on the matter. My only alternative is to try and reduce my use of the grid, which also means going solar.
- energy123 2y ago
  There's private energy developers building multi-GW of utility scale battery storage in Texas at the moment.
- _ea1k 2y ago
  One of the most compelling arguments that I hear from the anti-renewables types is that they do it in California and it doesn't work. I think there's more to it than that, though. TX has seen tremendous growth in renewables, and grid pricing is excellent there from the prices that I've seen.
  - energy123 2y ago
    > TX has seen tremendous growth in renewables, and grid pricing is excellent there from the prices that I've seen. Kansas and Iowa are 40-60% wind and have lower prices than the national average: https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...

tbrownaw 2y ago

> 400-megawatt (MW) solar and 400 MW/1,600-megawatt-hour battery storage So 4 hours worth of storage is apparently enough to make this sort of thing work.

skybrian 2y ago
It’s enough to shift power to the evening when demand is highest.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]