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It's crazy how far from scientific consensus these extremist states on both "sides" of the USA have strayed in their performative legislation. There is no such

It's crazy how far from scientific consensus these extremist states on both "sides" of the USA have strayed in their performative legislation. There is no such thing as social media addiction no matter how many times celebrities, politicians, and scammer detox camp repeat it. It's not that the DSM V or ICD 10 haven't addressed the issues. They repeatedly have and each time come away saying there's no evidence to support using the word addiction to describe computer or other rich multimedia system usage. If this were 1800s it'd be a bill banning newspaper addiction. 1900s banning electrical addiction. 1920s, radio addiction, 1950s TV addiction. Whatever is the big new thing involving lots of money (and so attention from these kinds of people). But it's not just funny sad: it also has real effects on real people and invokes the use of force in a situation where there is no coercion or damage being done.

tayo42 2y ago
Do you just not like the word "addiction" being used? Or you really don't think there are negative side effects from social media and how companies run it and encourage use?
- superkuh 2y ago
  I object mainly to the misuse of the word addiction. If they were not able to misuse this word then the causation of the proposed harms would shift. Imagine just for a moment that the concept of addiction does not apply here. How would the blame for the perceived harms (self reports of being sad, anxious, etc) shift? Addiction implies control and loss of volition. Removing addiction from this context and there is no control by the third parties and no loss of volition for the minors. The mitigations for the actual situation would be much different than the performative situation. Anxiety/depression in minors has indeed gone up since 2019. But the causes are not screens. Rising housing, food, etc prices relative to incomes, the whole worldwide pandemic, knowledge of environmental damage, and increasing totalitarianism and conflicts around the world account for most of that. In terms of what government can do, they can address the core issue of fractional reserve banking without periodic debt forgiveness meaning there is always more debt than money supply leading to worse lives and conflict for everyone including young people. To truly make peoples lives better we should have government act to create a sustainable system not pretend mandating what's on screens will fix things.
toomuchtodo 2y ago
Yes, social media is a cause of the epidemic of teenage mental illness - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39983233 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39983233 - April 2024 (1164 comments) Health advisory on social media use in adolescence - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35874670 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35874670 - May 2023 (169 comments) Smartphones and social media are destroying children’s mental health - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35095031 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35095031 - March 2023 (189 comments) Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34901571 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34901571 - February 2023 (640 comments) Taking a break from social media makes you happier and less anxious - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31405859 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31405859 - May 2022 (474 comments) Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31268222 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31268222 - May 2022 (1074 comments) Heavy social media use associated with lower mental health in adolescents - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25928310 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25928310 - January 2021 (348 comments) Quit Social Media, Your Career May Depend on It - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12998698 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12998698 - November 2016 (548 comments) Edit: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/social-media-teens-mental-health https://www.sciencenews.org/article/social-media-teens-menta... ("Social media harms teens’ mental health, mounting evidence shows. What now?") > Researchers delved into whether the platform’s introduction across college campuses in the mid 2000s increased symptoms associated with depression and anxiety. The answer was a clear yes, says MIT economist Alexey Makarin, a coauthor of the study, which appeared in the November 2022 American Economic Review. “There is still a lot to be explored,” Makarin says, but “[to say] there is no causal evidence that social media causes mental health issues, to that I definitely object.” https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.20211218 https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.20211218 ("Social Media and Mental Health") https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-29296-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-29296-3 ("Windows of developmental sensitivity to social media")
- Aeolun 2y ago
  Presumably similar articles existed in the 1950s for the TV
christianqchung 2y ago
This won't convince you, but heuristics obviously indicate people are using social media too much [1] and that it's bad [2]. Nobody used newspapers like this. People didn't watch TV at school 2 hours a day in the 90s. You're going to nitpick that the study doesn't say people use social media for 2 hours a day at school but that's a conservative estimate based on my experience in high school and college. That and like... talk to young people. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/08/10/teens-social-media-and-technology-2022/ https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/08/10/teens-social... [2] https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/social-media-teen-mental-health-a-parents-guide#:~:text=According%20to%20a%20research%20study,including%20depression%20and%20anxiety%20symptoms https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/social-media-teen-mental-h....
edm0nd 2y ago
>There is no such thing as social media addiction What a silly statement. There is 100% such a thing as social media addiction and it is real. Apps consume mass amounts of data in attempts to keep you using their app for as long as possible and build a uniquely tailored experience just for you to keep you coming back.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
itsharveenatwal 2y ago
You are so out of touch with reality. Unlike the other mediums you mentioned, you can't leave the house without your phone.

tayo42 2y ago

Do you just not like the word "addiction" being used? Or you really don't think there are negative side effects from social media and how companies run it and encourage use?

superkuh 2y ago
I object mainly to the misuse of the word addiction. If they were not able to misuse this word then the causation of the proposed harms would shift. Imagine just for a moment that the concept of addiction does not apply here. How would the blame for the perceived harms (self reports of being sad, anxious, etc) shift? Addiction implies control and loss of volition. Removing addiction from this context and there is no control by the third parties and no loss of volition for the minors. The mitigations for the actual situation would be much different than the performative situation. Anxiety/depression in minors has indeed gone up since 2019. But the causes are not screens. Rising housing, food, etc prices relative to incomes, the whole worldwide pandemic, knowledge of environmental damage, and increasing totalitarianism and conflicts around the world account for most of that. In terms of what government can do, they can address the core issue of fractional reserve banking without periodic debt forgiveness meaning there is always more debt than money supply leading to worse lives and conflict for everyone including young people. To truly make peoples lives better we should have government act to create a sustainable system not pretend mandating what's on screens will fix things.

toomuchtodo 2y ago

Yes, social media is a cause of the epidemic of teenage mental illness - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39983233 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39983233 - April 2024 (1164 comments) Health advisory on social media use in adolescence - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35874670 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35874670 - May 2023 (169 comments) Smartphones and social media are destroying children’s mental health - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35095031 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35095031 - March 2023 (189 comments) Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34901571 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34901571 - February 2023 (640 comments) Taking a break from social media makes you happier and less anxious - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31405859 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31405859 - May 2022 (474 comments) Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31268222 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31268222 - May 2022 (1074 comments) Heavy social media use associated with lower mental health in adolescents - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25928310 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25928310 - January 2021 (348 comments) Quit Social Media, Your Career May Depend on It - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12998698 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12998698 - November 2016 (548 comments) Edit: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/social-media-teens-mental-health https://www.sciencenews.org/article/social-media-teens-menta... ("Social media harms teens’ mental health, mounting evidence shows. What now?") > Researchers delved into whether the platform’s introduction across college campuses in the mid 2000s increased symptoms associated with depression and anxiety. The answer was a clear yes, says MIT economist Alexey Makarin, a coauthor of the study, which appeared in the November 2022 American Economic Review. “There is still a lot to be explored,” Makarin says, but “[to say] there is no causal evidence that social media causes mental health issues, to that I definitely object.” https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.20211218 https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.20211218 ("Social Media and Mental Health") https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-29296-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-29296-3 ("Windows of developmental sensitivity to social media")

Aeolun 2y ago
Presumably similar articles existed in the 1950s for the TV

christianqchung 2y ago

This won't convince you, but heuristics obviously indicate people are using social media too much [1] and that it's bad [2]. Nobody used newspapers like this. People didn't watch TV at school 2 hours a day in the 90s. You're going to nitpick that the study doesn't say people use social media for 2 hours a day at school but that's a conservative estimate based on my experience in high school and college. That and like... talk to young people. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/08/10/teens-social-media-and-technology-2022/ https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2022/08/10/teens-social... [2] https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/social-media-teen-mental-health-a-parents-guide#:~:text=According%20to%20a%20research%20study,including%20depression%20and%20anxiety%20symptoms https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/social-media-teen-mental-h....

edm0nd 2y ago

>There is no such thing as social media addiction What a silly statement. There is 100% such a thing as social media addiction and it is real. Apps consume mass amounts of data in attempts to keep you using their app for as long as possible and build a uniquely tailored experience just for you to keep you coming back.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

itsharveenatwal 2y ago

You are so out of touch with reality. Unlike the other mediums you mentioned, you can't leave the house without your phone.