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> And that as soon as migrations happen, your storage costs will balloon, so you need a billing strategy on launch. Unless people somehow figure out a way of h

by diggan 2y ago

> And that as soon as migrations happen, your storage costs will balloon, so you need a billing strategy on launch. Unless people somehow figure out a way of hosting stuff somewhere else than Amazon/$host_that_charges_per_mb_transit (Hint: they exist) Considering it would have to be a lean operation (assuming bootstrapped), then figuring out basic stuff like "We don't want to pay per MB sent" should be a pretty high requirement.

DrillShopper 2y ago
What hosting providers would you recommend?
- diggan 2y ago
  Both OVH and Hetzner offers unmetered connections for their dedicated servers, only had good experience with both so far (besides when one of OVH's data centers burned down, but hoping that was a exceptional situation)
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    Backup to Backblaze B2, or, depending on architecture, rely on their object storage for hot data (depending on data cache and tier requirements). They partner with Cloudflare for free egress (on the Backblaze side) of public content as well. https://www.backblaze.com/cloud-storage/pricing https://www.backblaze.com/cloud-storage/pricing https://www.backblaze.com/blog/backblaze-and-cloudflare-partner-to-provide-free-data-transfer/ https://www.backblaze.com/blog/backblaze-and-cloudflare-part...
    - dexterdog 2y ago
      Cloudflare’s subscription agreement for self-serve accounts limits serving non-HTML content, including "video or a disproportionate percentage of pictures, audio files, or other non-HTML content."
      - toomuchtodo 2y ago
        Which seems to be a fine fit for a project management SaaS solution. If you have an origin with non text content, you can front it with Fastly or pay Cloudflare something enterprisey (which you should be able to do once you have traction). Regardless, this is an inexpensive content distribution and object storage architecture available vs AWS egress costs.
      - stogot 2y ago
        Can’t you embed images in html/js as base64 or binary?
  - closeparen 2y ago
    In Europe. Hosting for North American customers is a completely different story.
    - Aeolun 2y ago
      You can use IOFlood for something similar to Hetzner (if a much smaller operation).
    - diggan 2y ago
      I'm fairly sure Hetzner only host their dedicated from Germany or Finland, yeah. But OVH has dedicated servers in Europe, America and Asia if I recall correctly.
quesera 2y ago
All true, but I think we might underestimate the amount of data sitting in Pivotal.
- diggan 2y ago
  I don't think you'd have to consider migration all the data from Pivotal, but lets assume 10% just in case? Lets say that's 100TB in total (on disk), which you could host with 10x storage boxes from Hetzner, 24 EUR each per month, so 240 EUR in total, which includes 10 unmetered connections (1 per box).
  - simoncion 2y ago
    > I don't think you'd have to consider migration all the data from Pivotal... I do. You might not have demands to migrate all data from all of your potential customers, but far, far more people than you might expect treat their issue tracking system as a system of record and external memory for a HUGE assortment of things. One hugely (and obviously) useful query chain that such a system answers is "Hey, this customer problem sounds familiar. Did we investigate it before? Did we solve it? If so, how? If not, why not?". For long-running projects, it is impossible to select the correct 10% of data to retain to also retain the ability to reliably -er- service those query chains.
    - diggan 2y ago
      Obviously I meant 10% of all customers would hypothetically migrate from Pivotal to this new imaginary service, not that 10% of the data from each customer would be migrated... So 100% of the data migrated from 10% of the Pivotal user base, pretty generous assumptions I think.
      - simoncion 2y ago
        > Obviously I meant... Respectfully: if it was obvious, I wouldn't have come to the conclusion I did and written up what I wrote. > So 100% of the data migrated from 10% of the Pivotal user base... Yeah, maybe. I don't know how large the slice of the Pivotal Tracker userbase you'd be able to retain even if you had a perfect clone. I bet it would be notably larger than you imagine it would be... it's my understanding that it has some pretty rabid fans that used it.
thelittleone 2y ago
Dont OVH and Hetzner offer this? If you dont like bare metal perhaps run Coolify for your vercel like platform?

by diggan 2y ago

DrillShopper 2y ago

What hosting providers would you recommend?

diggan 2y ago
Both OVH and Hetzner offers unmetered connections for their dedicated servers, only had good experience with both so far (besides when one of OVH's data centers burned down, but hoping that was a exceptional situation)
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  Backup to Backblaze B2, or, depending on architecture, rely on their object storage for hot data (depending on data cache and tier requirements). They partner with Cloudflare for free egress (on the Backblaze side) of public content as well. https://www.backblaze.com/cloud-storage/pricing https://www.backblaze.com/cloud-storage/pricing https://www.backblaze.com/blog/backblaze-and-cloudflare-partner-to-provide-free-data-transfer/ https://www.backblaze.com/blog/backblaze-and-cloudflare-part...
  - dexterdog 2y ago
    Cloudflare’s subscription agreement for self-serve accounts limits serving non-HTML content, including "video or a disproportionate percentage of pictures, audio files, or other non-HTML content."
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      Which seems to be a fine fit for a project management SaaS solution. If you have an origin with non text content, you can front it with Fastly or pay Cloudflare something enterprisey (which you should be able to do once you have traction). Regardless, this is an inexpensive content distribution and object storage architecture available vs AWS egress costs.
    - stogot 2y ago
      Can’t you embed images in html/js as base64 or binary?
- closeparen 2y ago
  In Europe. Hosting for North American customers is a completely different story.
  - Aeolun 2y ago
    You can use IOFlood for something similar to Hetzner (if a much smaller operation).
  - diggan 2y ago
    I'm fairly sure Hetzner only host their dedicated from Germany or Finland, yeah. But OVH has dedicated servers in Europe, America and Asia if I recall correctly.

quesera 2y ago

All true, but I think we might underestimate the amount of data sitting in Pivotal.

diggan 2y ago
I don't think you'd have to consider migration all the data from Pivotal, but lets assume 10% just in case? Lets say that's 100TB in total (on disk), which you could host with 10x storage boxes from Hetzner, 24 EUR each per month, so 240 EUR in total, which includes 10 unmetered connections (1 per box).
- simoncion 2y ago
  > I don't think you'd have to consider migration all the data from Pivotal... I do. You might not have demands to migrate all data from all of your potential customers, but far, far more people than you might expect treat their issue tracking system as a system of record and external memory for a HUGE assortment of things. One hugely (and obviously) useful query chain that such a system answers is "Hey, this customer problem sounds familiar. Did we investigate it before? Did we solve it? If so, how? If not, why not?". For long-running projects, it is impossible to select the correct 10% of data to retain to also retain the ability to reliably -er- service those query chains.
  - diggan 2y ago
    Obviously I meant 10% of all customers would hypothetically migrate from Pivotal to this new imaginary service, not that 10% of the data from each customer would be migrated... So 100% of the data migrated from 10% of the Pivotal user base, pretty generous assumptions I think.
    - simoncion 2y ago
      > Obviously I meant... Respectfully: if it was obvious, I wouldn't have come to the conclusion I did and written up what I wrote. > So 100% of the data migrated from 10% of the Pivotal user base... Yeah, maybe. I don't know how large the slice of the Pivotal Tracker userbase you'd be able to retain even if you had a perfect clone. I bet it would be notably larger than you imagine it would be... it's my understanding that it has some pretty rabid fans that used it.

thelittleone 2y ago

Dont OVH and Hetzner offer this? If you dont like bare metal perhaps run Coolify for your vercel like platform?