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Can't wait for the moment when the majority of cars on the road will be self-driving. I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises. The sheer

Can't wait for the moment when the majority of cars on the road will be self-driving. I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises. The sheer amount of victims from driving is insane - we'll look back on it as we now look to infectious diseases of the past.

dyauspitr 2y ago
I’m looking forward to it but it’s sad in a way too. The self driving cars are going to be heavily regulated. In a really dystopian setup, you would be restricted from leaving your zone.
- jfoster 2y ago
  Two things: 1. If you judge new technology by the absolute worst way that it can be used, you are going to spend your life worrying about a million things that will never happen. Focus on stuff that's happening instead of hypotheticals. 2. In a really dystopian setup, you can be restricted from leaving "your zone" regardless of autonomous vehicles. There's plenty of existing technology that can help with that. (number plates, cellular networks, facial recognition, etc.)
  - kevinventullo 2y ago
    Not only is #2 possible today, it is in fact a lived reality for people in some parts of the world.
  - badsectoracula 2y ago
    > Focus on stuff that's happening instead of hypotheticals. How do you prevent "hypotheticals" from becoming "stuff that's happening" if you never pay any attention to them in the first place and let them happen?
    - sdrinf 2y ago
      Because hypotheticals have a process of moving into "stuff that's happening", on the timescale of years, decades. Once it's starts happening, speak; if speaking doesn't work, fight; if fighting doesn't work, move. This works.
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
      - badsectoracula 2y ago
        The problem is that for many things once something starts happening it is very hard or even impossible to stop it. It is way better to prevent something from happening than try to stop it after the fact - especially if someone with power can benefit from that something happening.
  - noncoml 2y ago
    “a million things that will never happen” Like cameras and AI used to enforce the “not allowed to sing while driving” policy for Amazon drivers? The only way to make sure things never happen is by worrying about the worst possible misuse of the technology. Because someone will misuse it that way if it gets him money or power.
    - jfoster 2y ago
      People worried about surveillance but it didn't stop surveillance from happening. I'm not saying to be naive to possibilities, especially as they begin to move from the "possibilities" bucket to the "realities" bucket, but isn't it better to focus on making progress against stuff that's already happening? If Amazon are preventing drivers from singing, I think those drivers might be able to change that.
  - whiplash451 2y ago
    On 1, technology sometimes brings a worse than humanity could not even anticipate.
- MattGaiser 2y ago
  You can already be restricted from leaving your “zone”. Ankle bracelets, police, lack of infrastructure, etc.
a-dub 2y ago
> when the majority of cars on the road will be self-driving. i wonder how much of a different technical problem that is from what they do today...
deleted 2y ago
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xyst 2y ago
> majority of cars on the road will be self-driving Surveillance state would love that! Hundreds of thousands of cars with 360 degree cameras and sensors capturing everything inside and outside the vehicle. Forget installing CC cameras. just claim “nAtIoNaL sEcUrItY”, get a rubber stamped warrant from FISA court, and go to town. A problem created by cars (pedestrian vs car, MVA accidents) may be solved by self driving cars. But we introduced a perfect system to allow a foreign or domestic state to perform over reaching surveillance. Ripe for abuse as well. All of this nonsense could have been avoided if cities were just built with alternative transportation methods in mind. But nope, we have to use cars for every stupid little activity. Wasteful. Polluting.
- threatofrain 2y ago
  Alternative transportation like light rail or subway are centrally managed. Government is totally legit in monitoring that infra and can shut it down at will to disrupt protest.
  - whiplash451 2y ago
    City roads are subject to the exact same risk.
- plutoh28 2y ago
  You don’t even need self driving cars for cabin surveillance. Modern cars are already being equipped with data harvesting suites and selling your data. What’s one step further for 24/7 audio video surveillance?
bmitc 2y ago
I'd rather wait for the self-driving transportation we have to actually be used and built: trains and subways. It makes nearly zero sense to replace single low occupancy cars with the exact same occupancy but orders of magnitude more cost and blurred responsibility. > I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises. I assume that safety will drastically decrease as self-driving cars are introduced.
- meowtimemania 2y ago
  Unlike cars, trains and subways can't get you door to door (especially in suburban areas)
  - mitthrowaway2 2y ago
    If your neighbourhood is pleasant and walkable, you don't need to be dropped off at the door. In most cases, the key barrier to walkability is removing the cars.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    That's why you have to build and live more densely. The US absolutely refuses to do that, outside of Manhattan and a few select other places. It won't be a place where local trains make any economic sense until this changes. However, for your "door to door" point, that's not desirable anyway. Even here in Tokyo, you have to walk a lot to get between your home and work or wherever you're going. That's a big, big part of why people here are so much thinner than Americans. Having transport that takes you door-to-door without any significant walking is terrible for your health.
    - minwcnt5 2y ago
      Tokyo has taxis and Ubers. I take them quite frequently when there, even though the public transit is amazing. The fact it's blatantly obvious that robotaxis make a ton of sense in even one of the most transit-friendly cities in the world shows how wrong the OP is.
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exabrial 2y ago
The issue I have with it is its being setup with connected, centralized, monitored, control.
hulitu 2y ago
> I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises As a computer, i find your trust in technology amusing. /s
soramimo 2y ago
Same here - I'm biking to work every day (in LA) and am feeling much more at ease when passing by a Waymo vs. average human driver.

dyauspitr 2y ago

I’m looking forward to it but it’s sad in a way too. The self driving cars are going to be heavily regulated. In a really dystopian setup, you would be restricted from leaving your zone.

jfoster 2y ago
Two things: 1. If you judge new technology by the absolute worst way that it can be used, you are going to spend your life worrying about a million things that will never happen. Focus on stuff that's happening instead of hypotheticals. 2. In a really dystopian setup, you can be restricted from leaving "your zone" regardless of autonomous vehicles. There's plenty of existing technology that can help with that. (number plates, cellular networks, facial recognition, etc.)
- kevinventullo 2y ago
  Not only is #2 possible today, it is in fact a lived reality for people in some parts of the world.
- badsectoracula 2y ago
  > Focus on stuff that's happening instead of hypotheticals. How do you prevent "hypotheticals" from becoming "stuff that's happening" if you never pay any attention to them in the first place and let them happen?
  - sdrinf 2y ago
    Because hypotheticals have a process of moving into "stuff that's happening", on the timescale of years, decades. Once it's starts happening, speak; if speaking doesn't work, fight; if fighting doesn't work, move. This works.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - badsectoracula 2y ago
      The problem is that for many things once something starts happening it is very hard or even impossible to stop it. It is way better to prevent something from happening than try to stop it after the fact - especially if someone with power can benefit from that something happening.
- noncoml 2y ago
  “a million things that will never happen” Like cameras and AI used to enforce the “not allowed to sing while driving” policy for Amazon drivers? The only way to make sure things never happen is by worrying about the worst possible misuse of the technology. Because someone will misuse it that way if it gets him money or power.
  - jfoster 2y ago
    People worried about surveillance but it didn't stop surveillance from happening. I'm not saying to be naive to possibilities, especially as they begin to move from the "possibilities" bucket to the "realities" bucket, but isn't it better to focus on making progress against stuff that's already happening? If Amazon are preventing drivers from singing, I think those drivers might be able to change that.
- whiplash451 2y ago
  On 1, technology sometimes brings a worse than humanity could not even anticipate.
MattGaiser 2y ago
You can already be restricted from leaving your “zone”. Ankle bracelets, police, lack of infrastructure, etc.

a-dub 2y ago

> when the majority of cars on the road will be self-driving. i wonder how much of a different technical problem that is from what they do today...

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

xyst 2y ago

> majority of cars on the road will be self-driving Surveillance state would love that! Hundreds of thousands of cars with 360 degree cameras and sensors capturing everything inside and outside the vehicle. Forget installing CC cameras. just claim “nAtIoNaL sEcUrItY”, get a rubber stamped warrant from FISA court, and go to town. A problem created by cars (pedestrian vs car, MVA accidents) may be solved by self driving cars. But we introduced a perfect system to allow a foreign or domestic state to perform over reaching surveillance. Ripe for abuse as well. All of this nonsense could have been avoided if cities were just built with alternative transportation methods in mind. But nope, we have to use cars for every stupid little activity. Wasteful. Polluting.

threatofrain 2y ago
Alternative transportation like light rail or subway are centrally managed. Government is totally legit in monitoring that infra and can shut it down at will to disrupt protest.
- whiplash451 2y ago
  City roads are subject to the exact same risk.
plutoh28 2y ago
You don’t even need self driving cars for cabin surveillance. Modern cars are already being equipped with data harvesting suites and selling your data. What’s one step further for 24/7 audio video surveillance?

bmitc 2y ago

I'd rather wait for the self-driving transportation we have to actually be used and built: trains and subways. It makes nearly zero sense to replace single low occupancy cars with the exact same occupancy but orders of magnitude more cost and blurred responsibility. > I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises. I assume that safety will drastically decrease as self-driving cars are introduced.

meowtimemania 2y ago
Unlike cars, trains and subways can't get you door to door (especially in suburban areas)
- mitthrowaway2 2y ago
  If your neighbourhood is pleasant and walkable, you don't need to be dropped off at the door. In most cases, the key barrier to walkability is removing the cars.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  That's why you have to build and live more densely. The US absolutely refuses to do that, outside of Manhattan and a few select other places. It won't be a place where local trains make any economic sense until this changes. However, for your "door to door" point, that's not desirable anyway. Even here in Tokyo, you have to walk a lot to get between your home and work or wherever you're going. That's a big, big part of why people here are so much thinner than Americans. Having transport that takes you door-to-door without any significant walking is terrible for your health.
  - minwcnt5 2y ago
    Tokyo has taxis and Ubers. I take them quite frequently when there, even though the public transit is amazing. The fact it's blatantly obvious that robotaxis make a ton of sense in even one of the most transit-friendly cities in the world shows how wrong the OP is.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

exabrial 2y ago

The issue I have with it is its being setup with connected, centralized, monitored, control.

hulitu 2y ago

> I assume that safety will only increase as the proportion rises As a computer, i find your trust in technology amusing. /s

soramimo 2y ago

Same here - I'm biking to work every day (in LA) and am feeling much more at ease when passing by a Waymo vs. average human driver.