4 ms·

Isn't the US' debt almost twice as high as China's?

by culi 2y ago

seanmcdirmid 2y ago
It depends if you include SOE debt as a part of China's national debt or not. One thinking is that SOEs are almost private companies, but everyone assumes their loans are backed by local governments at least. Kind of a mess when you try to sort out what is private and public in China's debt. Should the debt of state owned railroads who heavily bond out the development of the HSR network be counted as public debt, or private debt since it is held by private entities? Considering that default is still a possibility (only BJ - SH is profitable), the government will probably have to transfer these to public debt eventually (or alternatively tell lots of private chinese citizens their retirement is SOL).
- culi 2y ago
  When talking about national debt we include both private and public debt. By this measure China's debt stands at around $45 trillion while the US' stands at around $70 trillion. China also has a larger GDP (PPP) and 4.25x the population. However you spin it, you'd be hard pressed to defend the claim that China is facing a worse debt crisis than the US is
  - seanmcdirmid 2y ago
    China has a smaller GDP, if you want to talk about PPP yuan then you need to talk about PPP debt, otherwise it isn't meaningful. As for your wonky definition of national debt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_St... Maybe you are using a different chinese definition? If so, we are comparing apples and oranges. By the English definition of national debt, China should be pretty good since most debt in China is offloaded to localities or SOEs, or are hidden off books in some weird local lending scheme far away from Beijing.
  - m101 2y ago
    A debt crisis will be triggered by lack of confidence, and in that regard China's debt crisis is far worse than that of the US.
  - PixyMisa 2y ago
    You can't pay your debt with PPP, though. You have to pay it with real money.

Isn't the US' debt almost twice as high as China's?

by culi 2y ago

Isn't the US' debt almost twice as high as China's?

It depends if you include SOE debt as a part of China's national debt or not. One thinking is that SOEs are almost private companies, but everyone assumes their loans are backed by local governments at least. Kind of a mess when you try to sort out what is private and public in China's debt. Should the debt of state owned railroads who heavily bond out the development of the HSR network be counted as public debt, or private debt since it is held by private entities? Considering that default is still a possibility (only BJ - SH is profitable), the government will probably have to transfer these to public debt eventually (or alternatively tell lots of private chinese citizens their retirement is SOL).

culi 2y ago
When talking about national debt we include both private and public debt. By this measure China's debt stands at around $45 trillion while the US' stands at around $70 trillion. China also has a larger GDP (PPP) and 4.25x the population. However you spin it, you'd be hard pressed to defend the claim that China is facing a worse debt crisis than the US is
- seanmcdirmid 2y ago
  China has a smaller GDP, if you want to talk about PPP yuan then you need to talk about PPP debt, otherwise it isn't meaningful. As for your wonky definition of national debt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_St... Maybe you are using a different chinese definition? If so, we are comparing apples and oranges. By the English definition of national debt, China should be pretty good since most debt in China is offloaded to localities or SOEs, or are hidden off books in some weird local lending scheme far away from Beijing.
- m101 2y ago
  A debt crisis will be triggered by lack of confidence, and in that regard China's debt crisis is far worse than that of the US.
- PixyMisa 2y ago
  You can't pay your debt with PPP, though. You have to pay it with real money.