5 ms·

Why ban them instead of incentivize better behavior?

rad_gruchalski 2y ago
How. You can’t fix stupid. Edit: I can think of a way. These things move in a regular traffic. To drive a car, I had to do a driving license. 40 hours with an instructor, a theory test, and a practical exam. How come any clueless chimp can get one of these and ride in traffic? They are dangerous to themselves and others. It’s a celebration when they wear a crash helmet. So here are my ideas: 1. Require a license for these things. 2. Collect and remove illegally parked scooters. Rental companies know who rode one, they can claim the cost of a scooter removal fee from the rider who parked it illegally. If they are concerned about people randomly moving scooters into illegal parking positions… well, come up with dedicated parking areas where the rider has to bring them back and lock them. Until then: ban them.
- cinntaile 2y ago
  A license for an electrical scooter... It's like getting a (hypothetical) license for a bicycle. Completely unnecessary. No special skills are needed to ride one of these, it's super simple. You should try it sometime. A license won't fix stupid anyway, you just said so yourself.
  - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
    I don't tell people what they should be doing. Everyone so entitled to tell others how they should go about their lives. But there you go: you should try to understand my argument about these things moving in between the traffic. But it's interesting you mention a bicycle license. In the 1990s I did one in Poland as a young teenager. It was called "karta rowerowa". Not exactly a license but it taught me about traffic rules and probably saved me from trouble. It was worth it. Some cyclists in Aachen could make use of something similar, maybe they'll know that cycling 5kph in the presence of the StVO VZ 277.1 just aggravates everybody.
    - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
      Furthermore, I have learned today that in Poland until the age of 18 one is required to have the cycling card (karta rowerowa), or a moped driving license. „Karta rowerowa” is a one day training where one learns traffic rules, signs, and proper technique in navigating the traffic. Of course barely anyone checks for it. But if one gets involved in an accident, there will be financial and insurance consequences.
  - Spooky23 2y ago
    You don’t need special skills to drive a car. A big part of licensing is that you can take it away. Cyclists and scooter riders often ignore traffic controls that apply to them. We ignore it because the likelihood and impact of injury to others is low.
- whiplash451 2y ago
  Unfortunately, 2 cannot make the difference between a renter who parked illegally and a renter who parked well but a random person kicked the e-scooter on the ground. I see this a lot with e-bikes in my neighborhood.
  - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
    People lose the ability to read to the end: > well, come up with dedicated parking areas where the rider has to bring them back and lock them
    - whiplash451 2y ago
      I did read to the end but in large European cities those dedicated parking spaces are in contact with the sidewalks and the other parking spaces. Apparently some people enjoy dragging all the nicely parked e-bikes into the ground.
      - aziaziazi 2y ago
        > lock them I think GP mean lock them to a solid pole, as a bike. Make the pole deliver electricity (non trivial) and you have a recharge station.
        rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        That’s what I meant, yes.
        whiplash451 2y ago
        Makes sense. I do think that would change the game entirely but the margin of operators goes mmmmmm…
        rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        Yes, the profit opportunity before legislating the hell out of it.
- denizener 2y ago
  Not having a license is crazy. I walk daily for exercise and have almost been hit several times by some kid doing crazy things on them. I would say it is at least once a week I see someone do something stupid on one. Without needing a license there is nothing to lose for driving stupid. Comparing these to a bike is obvious bullshit.

How. You can’t fix stupid. Edit: I can think of a way. These things move in a regular traffic. To drive a car, I had to do a driving license. 40 hours with an instructor, a theory test, and a practical exam. How come any clueless chimp can get one of these and ride in traffic? They are dangerous to themselves and others. It’s a celebration when they wear a crash helmet. So here are my ideas: 1. Require a license for these things. 2. Collect and remove illegally parked scooters. Rental companies know who rode one, they can claim the cost of a scooter removal fee from the rider who parked it illegally. If they are concerned about people randomly moving scooters into illegal parking positions… well, come up with dedicated parking areas where the rider has to bring them back and lock them. Until then: ban them.

cinntaile 2y ago
A license for an electrical scooter... It's like getting a (hypothetical) license for a bicycle. Completely unnecessary. No special skills are needed to ride one of these, it's super simple. You should try it sometime. A license won't fix stupid anyway, you just said so yourself.
- rad_gruchalski 2y ago
  I don't tell people what they should be doing. Everyone so entitled to tell others how they should go about their lives. But there you go: you should try to understand my argument about these things moving in between the traffic. But it's interesting you mention a bicycle license. In the 1990s I did one in Poland as a young teenager. It was called "karta rowerowa". Not exactly a license but it taught me about traffic rules and probably saved me from trouble. It was worth it. Some cyclists in Aachen could make use of something similar, maybe they'll know that cycling 5kph in the presence of the StVO VZ 277.1 just aggravates everybody.
  - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
    Furthermore, I have learned today that in Poland until the age of 18 one is required to have the cycling card (karta rowerowa), or a moped driving license. „Karta rowerowa” is a one day training where one learns traffic rules, signs, and proper technique in navigating the traffic. Of course barely anyone checks for it. But if one gets involved in an accident, there will be financial and insurance consequences.
- Spooky23 2y ago
  You don’t need special skills to drive a car. A big part of licensing is that you can take it away. Cyclists and scooter riders often ignore traffic controls that apply to them. We ignore it because the likelihood and impact of injury to others is low.
whiplash451 2y ago
Unfortunately, 2 cannot make the difference between a renter who parked illegally and a renter who parked well but a random person kicked the e-scooter on the ground. I see this a lot with e-bikes in my neighborhood.
- rad_gruchalski 2y ago
  People lose the ability to read to the end: > well, come up with dedicated parking areas where the rider has to bring them back and lock them
  - whiplash451 2y ago
    I did read to the end but in large European cities those dedicated parking spaces are in contact with the sidewalks and the other parking spaces. Apparently some people enjoy dragging all the nicely parked e-bikes into the ground.
    - aziaziazi 2y ago
      > lock them I think GP mean lock them to a solid pole, as a bike. Make the pole deliver electricity (non trivial) and you have a recharge station.
      - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        That’s what I meant, yes.
        whiplash451 2y ago
        Makes sense. I do think that would change the game entirely but the margin of operators goes mmmmmm…
        rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        Yes, the profit opportunity before legislating the hell out of it.
denizener 2y ago
Not having a license is crazy. I walk daily for exercise and have almost been hit several times by some kid doing crazy things on them. I would say it is at least once a week I see someone do something stupid on one. Without needing a license there is nothing to lose for driving stupid. Comparing these to a bike is obvious bullshit.