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> "you also have to wonder where the salaries would be at in tech, and how many more citizens would be training for these roles if it weren't for H-1B visa" On
by pavlov 2y ago
> "you also have to wonder where the salaries would be at in tech, and how many more citizens would be training for these roles if it weren't for H-1B visa"
On the flip side, you have to wonder where the American tech industry would be without immigrants.
Nvidia was founded by the son of Taiwanese parents who sent their children to live with an uncle in the US. That's one of the many immigration paths that the MAGAs want to close.
Was the creation of Nvidia a "handout to corporations"? Intel sure would be happy if Jensen Huang had never made it to America.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- carom 2y agoI don't disagree, getting smart and ambitious people to move to your country is a really good policy overall. It is just worth weighing it against the opportunity cost for the citizens of the country.
- the_real_cher 2y agodoesn't it beg the question though... if they're so good for America why aren't they good for their own country?
- echelon 2y agoThe value and commensurate compensation of talent depends on location. Proximity to colleagues, decision makers, and capital.
- the_real_cher 2y agoSomebody has to sacrifice to be the first to start something like that in their own country. In America we built companies art and music out of our garages just for the love of it... not because "that's where the compensation was."
- t43562 2y agoYou guys move around for opportunity all the time.
- the_real_cher 2y agoSome not most
- pacerier 2y agoI think you meant all. All moves when disaster comes. Meanwhile where there is food there is no need to move.
- the_real_cher 2y agosome people are farmers
- pacerier 2y agoFarmers move too when disaster comes. You are out of job, out of food, you move. Meanwhile where there is food there is no need to move.
- pacerier 2y agoWhat are you talking about? Is this fact or romance? The country certainly did not become what it is through love of sacrifice.
- asimpletune 2y agoIt makes sense for big fish to seek big ponds
- the_real_cher 2y agoIndia and China arent big ponds?
- pacerier 2y agoMany pockets of the pond are not yet deep, making it unsuitable for many species.
- foldr 2y agoThey are. When a doctor immigrates from Nigeria to the US, then that's broadly speaking good for the US and bad for Nigeria.
- the_real_cher 2y agois it though...
- foldr 2y agoBoth countries have a shortage of doctors, so yes.
- pacerier 2y agoThat's not how it works. It depends on whether (how much) they are paid and if so what do they buy with that payment. Are they settled in US buying pizzas and Netflix? Because if not, then investments to Nigeria past $x will grant it the upperhand since all that money can get you another doctor and more.
- foldr 2y agohttps://www.bmj.com/content/381/bmj.p1234 https://www.bmj.com/content/381/bmj.p1234
- pacerier 2y ago5 years is truly a big kill. looks like its a reaction to 99% of them refusing to send money back home and invest in Nigeria, preferring to buy-US and -Europe.
- foldr 2y agoNot sure if you are deliberately misunderstanding at this point, but the problem is obviously not where the doctors spend their money, but the fact that they are not practicing medicine in Nigeria – as Nigeria might reasonably have hoped them to do once they completed their training.
- jyounker 2y agoWhen they leave their country it's called Brain Drain.
- shiroiushi 2y agoBecause their country doesn't offer the same opportunities to achieve the things they believe they can in their new country. It's the main reason people emigrate. No one's going to build Nvidia in India or China, for instance, at least not back in the time that it was created in America.
- the_real_cher 2y agoAmerica didn't used to be the country that offered those opportunities. Yet people built it and made it that way. Nothing is static people csn change anything These people need to do that in their own countries.
- shiroiushi 2y agoThe people that built it and made it that way in America were all immigrants.
- the_real_cher 2y agoI didn't know Bell labs employees Steve Jobs and Bill Gates were all immigrants
- ivewonyoung 2y agoSteve Jobs' father and grandparents were Syrian.
- decremental 2y ago[dead]
- surgical_fire 2y agoKind of ironic, considering the whole original population of America (the whole continent) was mostly replaced by immigrants, starting some time after 1492 AD.
- pacerier 2y agoBut they are. Yet men being men will go where they think the money/food is.
- pacerier 2y agoWhat opportunity cost? Expensive healthcare? Expensive housing? Hey pal, why not everything else under the sun? Immigrants have made the country rich enough to give everyone ubi free housing and free healthcare. But Then Billionaires. #immigrants-are-the-new-jews #stop-blaming-the-hand-that-feeds ( Of course, it's not billionaires per se, but Greed. Eg in countries like singapore, the Politicians are the problem. ) For a living example, take a look at UAE, although I'd say they could have treated immigrants a bit better.
- indoordin0saur 2y agoOne thing I seldom see discussed is how if you're attracting the best and brightest it is leaving the original country poor. These places invest in their children hoping that they'll start businesses and then all that investment just ends up going to those countries that are already the richest. I certainly don't blame anyone for wanting to move to improve their situation (I did it too!) but I wonder if developing countries would have caught up to the West decades ago if this brain drain wasn't going on.
- the_real_cher 2y ago[flagged]
- waciki 2y ago> If an immigrant didn't start the company a legacy American like Mark Cuban or Gates would have. Or somebody in another country?
- the_real_cher 2y agoOther countries have had 20 times the population of America for centuries and yet pre H1b America invented all modern computing, the internet, etc etc as we know it. Not worried about other countries AT ALL.
- waciki 2y ago> all modern computing not true > the internet www was invented at CERN by tim berner-lee though?
- the_real_cher 2y agowell DARPA net but still I should expand my claim to say all modern computing was invented by Western countries
- AnimalMuppet 2y agoPre H1B America was still pulling a large number of people from Europe, many of whom were fleeing WWII or its aftermath. John Von Neumann, for example, was Hungarian (though he came to the US in 1930, so not a WWII refugee). Europe didn't do as much of inventing modern computing (though Bletchley Park would like a word) because it was still trying to recover from the destruction of WWII, and that set them back a decade. China and India didn't, because they were more than a decade behind. Having 20 times the population doesn't mean you're at the cutting edge.
- raverbashing 2y ago
- yunohn 2y ago> the son of Taiwanese parents who sent their children to live with an uncle in the US. That's one of the many immigration paths that the MAGAs want to close. Is this an actual immigration path that still remains open? I find it hard to believe.
- varjag 2y agoNo not really. Maybe in Ellis Island days. Most born Americans certainly have no fainest clue how hard it is to legally immigrate to the USA already.
- the_real_cher 2y agothere's a lot of businesses simply built around hacking the US immigration system. the people most likely to immigrate aren't the smartest but the people with the most money who can pay to hack the system
- varjag 2y agoThere really isn't much "hacking" going on, it's mostly fraud. Fictional marriages, fake jobs and so on. I was talking about legal ways.
- pacerier 2y agoActually it is incredibly easy. But keyword is not "productivity", it is "family". Who knew.. that the racist plan to ensure the population stays white actually had the reverse effect.. 2024 and nothing's still being done about it because That's racist doh!