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I'm sure they do, but that does not change the fact that all of the things Durov is accused of doing are only possible on the infrastructure provided by those s

I'm sure they do, but that does not change the fact that all of the things Durov is accused of doing are only possible on the infrastructure provided by those same internet companies. So yes, you are right they likely do cooperate already and this is a purely political prosecution flying in the face of Macron's statement.

theesadi 2y ago
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muglug 2y ago
There's no evidence it's purely political. In France the citizens want tech companies to cooperate with authorities to prevent the spread of CSAM. Durov is a French citizen. His tech company does not cooperate with authorities. The authorities wanted to have a chat with him about that. Most discussions in Telegram are not end-to-end encrypted, meaning Telegram could probably do much more to stop the spread of CSAM. It's not just about CSAM — they mention terrorism, and the French authorities also probably also want to know what sort of deal he made with Russia to allow him to travel freely to and from that country after they attempted to ban Telegram.
- orwin 2y ago
  > There's no evidence it's purely political. There is a lot of evidence it's not. In France, the executive power (president, government, prefect) always ask a "procureur" to indict someone (issue a warrant and direct the police). In this very case, it's a "Juge d'instruction", which are notoriously independent (And it caused enough issues to have a Sarkozy/Dati law that tried to curtail this liberty around 2010, and still you have conservatives and far-right people asking for less initiative from this kind of judges (one of them ordered former president Sarkozy's phone to be put under surveillance). Unless someone can draw a direct line from the OFMIN judge to Macron, i consider people talking about "political" bullshitter.
germandiago 2y ago
Yes, it is also only possible to kill with a knife if the seller sells you one. It is only possible to smash a car against a showcase and commit a robbery if you get the car from the seller. It is also... No, it is not a good argument in my opinion. By this measure, we could be deriving criminal responsibility from almost any action. Imagine that you sell forks and someone stabs a fork into the eye of another person. Would you be guilty? People can make bad use of anything. That does not makes us guilty. It is just absurd.
- wonderwonder 2y ago
  Right, I agree, arresting Durov because of what people do or do not do on Telegram is absurd.
  - ivan_gammel 2y ago
    …and this is not what is happening, so what’s the point in circling around this false argument?

theesadi 2y ago

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muglug 2y ago

There's no evidence it's purely political. In France the citizens want tech companies to cooperate with authorities to prevent the spread of CSAM. Durov is a French citizen. His tech company does not cooperate with authorities. The authorities wanted to have a chat with him about that. Most discussions in Telegram are not end-to-end encrypted, meaning Telegram could probably do much more to stop the spread of CSAM. It's not just about CSAM — they mention terrorism, and the French authorities also probably also want to know what sort of deal he made with Russia to allow him to travel freely to and from that country after they attempted to ban Telegram.

orwin 2y ago
> There's no evidence it's purely political. There is a lot of evidence it's not. In France, the executive power (president, government, prefect) always ask a "procureur" to indict someone (issue a warrant and direct the police). In this very case, it's a "Juge d'instruction", which are notoriously independent (And it caused enough issues to have a Sarkozy/Dati law that tried to curtail this liberty around 2010, and still you have conservatives and far-right people asking for less initiative from this kind of judges (one of them ordered former president Sarkozy's phone to be put under surveillance). Unless someone can draw a direct line from the OFMIN judge to Macron, i consider people talking about "political" bullshitter.

germandiago 2y ago

Yes, it is also only possible to kill with a knife if the seller sells you one. It is only possible to smash a car against a showcase and commit a robbery if you get the car from the seller. It is also... No, it is not a good argument in my opinion. By this measure, we could be deriving criminal responsibility from almost any action. Imagine that you sell forks and someone stabs a fork into the eye of another person. Would you be guilty? People can make bad use of anything. That does not makes us guilty. It is just absurd.

wonderwonder 2y ago
Right, I agree, arresting Durov because of what people do or do not do on Telegram is absurd.
- ivan_gammel 2y ago
  …and this is not what is happening, so what’s the point in circling around this false argument?