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There isn’t enough time for a random walk evolution to result in the structure we see. It’s more complicated than that. It seems the universe in the form of hu
by mensetmanusman 2y ago
There isn’t enough time for a random walk evolution to result in the structure we see. It’s more complicated than that.
It seems the universe in the form of humans was meant to contemplate itself.
- bell-cot 2y agoObviously, no human has any experience, nor any expertise, on whether there was enough time. So the argument pretty much turns into "my feelings" vs. Occam's Razor.
- User23 2y agoAmusingly, I suspect that supporters of both the teleological position and the non-teleological position think Occam supports them. For what it’s worth, the only empirical macroevolution we’ve done, from domestication, to Monte Carlo simulations, to genetic algorithms, to LLM training, is all goal directed.
- bell-cot 2y ago> Amusingly, I suspect... Yes...though I'd say that the teleological folks have emotional reasons to judge an ever-so-specific deity (who they already believe in) to be a conveniently minimal hypothesis. Which is a good example of a usually-necessary heuristic - pushing complexity, costs, unknowns, and other unhappy things far enough away (in real or metaphorical space/time) that you don't have to worry about them now. > FWIW, the only empirical... All the budget requests for sextillions of organisms, simulated for billions of years, were rejected. So, unfortunately, some large corners had to be cut...
- User23 2y agoOut of curiosity do you have any kind of argument or supporting evidence for your position or just straw men and snark?
- mensetmanusman 2y agoIf you dramatically redefine random to include choices between useful outcomes (ie. the non random boundary conditions to the decision tree), then Occam’s razor works well here.
- beepbooptheory 2y agoDid not expect an earnest argument for a cosmological teleology on HN today, thank you. I would just say its a whole lot of trouble to get humans to do something they aren't even doing!
- Bluestein 2y agoI would gladly hear more of your take on this.-
- mensetmanusman 2y agoWould require beer near Minneapolis! And a jar of organoid bioprocessors.