5 ms·

As much as I would like an alternative, the downsides to not using Google Play Services is too great for me to seriously consider a degoogled phone. This may be

As much as I would like an alternative, the downsides to not using Google Play Services is too great for me to seriously consider a degoogled phone. This may be a use case for PWAs but until banking apps and ride sharing apps are fully functional on the webs this isn't an option.

gspencley 2y ago
This obviously isn't 100% "de-Googled' but I use GrapheneOS with the sand-boxed Google Play Services and Aurora Store for the few proprietary apps that I use. I don't do online banking using my phone so I'm not sure how well that works (GrapheneOS' documentation has some words of warning about banking apps), but for ride sharing and other stuff that I occasionally need it has worked pretty well. The one thing that didn't work well was Location services when my wife and I travelled to Walt Disney World. The My Disney Experience app worked great for the most part, but occasionally I would get errors related Location claiming that I was outside of the country. Uber worked fine though. Fortunately we were travelling together and had her phone to fall back on when we needed it.
- jraph 2y ago
  This looks like something microG would handle (a free software reimplementation of Google Play Services, including push notifications and location services). I see GrapheneOS is unwilling to support it.
  - codethief 2y ago
    Yes, because according to the GrapheneOS devs it would weaken the security properties of the OS. Besides, GrapheneOS already supports the native Google Play Services (with additional sandboxing), so I have a hard time seeing how MicroG would help here. (I used MicroG on LineageOS for years and it certainly wasn't without bugs.) Also, regarding what GP wrote, I haven't encountered a single app in a long time that wouldn't run on GrapheneOS.
- e12e 2y ago
  I assume you give up Google pay? I'm surprised at how convenient it turned out to not have to carry a credit/debit card around - just tap with phone.
  - NotPractical 2y ago
    How do you avoid carrying credit cards? Do you not carry a wallet? What happens if your phone dies?
    - e12e 2y ago
      > How do you avoid carrying credit cards? In Norway practically any place that accept cards also accept Google/Apple pay - as all pos terminals support "tap"/NFC as does practically all debit/credit cards issued here. I was recently on vacation in France - and only needed my phone there as well. > Do you not carry a wallet? No. [Ed: no longer, no] > What happens if your phone dies? Either I don't buy anything - or I'd borrow a usb-c charger from the person behind the bar/at the restaurant etc.
  - gspencley 2y ago
    Yes. GrapheneOS can't support NFC payments because Google won't certify the OS nor does it provide any avenue for getting certified / "approved." I can see how this could be a deal breaker for some. Speaking only for myself, personally, I'm 42 years-old and have been a very slow adopter of smart phones in general. GrapheneOS let me feel like it's finally my phone and I've started using it more. Mostly as an mp3 player while exercising, and I've got an open source password manager that I've started using a lot. But I've never been comfortable with the idea of my phone replacing my wallet. I mean, sure it can do everything that my wallet can do but it's also susceptible to malware or attack and if I lose it then not only do I lose all of the data on my phone but I lose access to my identification and payment methods as well? That is a terrifying prospect to me. I don't like the idea of single points of failure. Losing my wallet would ruin my day. Losing my phone would suck but nothing catastrophic would happen. For most people losing both would be a nightmare scenario. But I don't even do online banking on my phone. I probably could. I choose not to.
lawn 2y ago
For what it's worth, all the banking apps I've tried have worked without issue using microG on CalyxOS.
- fmajid 2y ago
  My banking apps work just fine on GrapheneOS.
  - papascrubs 2y ago
    Rooted? Mainly just curious

gspencley 2y ago

This obviously isn't 100% "de-Googled' but I use GrapheneOS with the sand-boxed Google Play Services and Aurora Store for the few proprietary apps that I use. I don't do online banking using my phone so I'm not sure how well that works (GrapheneOS' documentation has some words of warning about banking apps), but for ride sharing and other stuff that I occasionally need it has worked pretty well. The one thing that didn't work well was Location services when my wife and I travelled to Walt Disney World. The My Disney Experience app worked great for the most part, but occasionally I would get errors related Location claiming that I was outside of the country. Uber worked fine though. Fortunately we were travelling together and had her phone to fall back on when we needed it.

jraph 2y ago
This looks like something microG would handle (a free software reimplementation of Google Play Services, including push notifications and location services). I see GrapheneOS is unwilling to support it.
- codethief 2y ago
  Yes, because according to the GrapheneOS devs it would weaken the security properties of the OS. Besides, GrapheneOS already supports the native Google Play Services (with additional sandboxing), so I have a hard time seeing how MicroG would help here. (I used MicroG on LineageOS for years and it certainly wasn't without bugs.) Also, regarding what GP wrote, I haven't encountered a single app in a long time that wouldn't run on GrapheneOS.
e12e 2y ago
I assume you give up Google pay? I'm surprised at how convenient it turned out to not have to carry a credit/debit card around - just tap with phone.
- NotPractical 2y ago
  How do you avoid carrying credit cards? Do you not carry a wallet? What happens if your phone dies?
  - e12e 2y ago
    > How do you avoid carrying credit cards? In Norway practically any place that accept cards also accept Google/Apple pay - as all pos terminals support "tap"/NFC as does practically all debit/credit cards issued here. I was recently on vacation in France - and only needed my phone there as well. > Do you not carry a wallet? No. [Ed: no longer, no] > What happens if your phone dies? Either I don't buy anything - or I'd borrow a usb-c charger from the person behind the bar/at the restaurant etc.
- gspencley 2y ago
  Yes. GrapheneOS can't support NFC payments because Google won't certify the OS nor does it provide any avenue for getting certified / "approved." I can see how this could be a deal breaker for some. Speaking only for myself, personally, I'm 42 years-old and have been a very slow adopter of smart phones in general. GrapheneOS let me feel like it's finally my phone and I've started using it more. Mostly as an mp3 player while exercising, and I've got an open source password manager that I've started using a lot. But I've never been comfortable with the idea of my phone replacing my wallet. I mean, sure it can do everything that my wallet can do but it's also susceptible to malware or attack and if I lose it then not only do I lose all of the data on my phone but I lose access to my identification and payment methods as well? That is a terrifying prospect to me. I don't like the idea of single points of failure. Losing my wallet would ruin my day. Losing my phone would suck but nothing catastrophic would happen. For most people losing both would be a nightmare scenario. But I don't even do online banking on my phone. I probably could. I choose not to.

lawn 2y ago

For what it's worth, all the banking apps I've tried have worked without issue using microG on CalyxOS.

fmajid 2y ago
My banking apps work just fine on GrapheneOS.
- papascrubs 2y ago
  Rooted? Mainly just curious