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Free speech is not something they value. Individual rights aren’t valued. Nonsense. Of course Europeans value those things, but they're also mindful of the fac

Free speech is not something they value. Individual rights aren’t valued. Nonsense. Of course Europeans value those things, but they're also mindful of the fact that such freedoms can be abused, sometimes with catastrophic consequences.

karpatic 2y ago
beguiling denial.
vdqtp3 2y ago
When you support literally jailing people for speech you don't like, you don't support free speech. The clear-cut example I usually pull out - there's PLENTY more. https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/31/23004339/uk-twitter-user-sentenced-grossly-offensive-tweet-tom-moore-joseph-kelly https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/31/23004339/uk-twitter-user-...
- croes 2y ago
  So he wasn't jailed.
  - walthamstow 2y ago
    So much for clear-cut example!
  - adammarples 2y ago
    It's still baffling that he could have been, and that this law exists at all
- DonHopkins 2y ago
  So we can all agree that Trump certainly doesn't support free speech. And he's AMERICAN.
- anigbrowl 2y ago
  I fail to see what this has to do with European conceptions of free speech in general. You may recall that Britain went out of its way to leave the EU, in part citing its dislike of the EU's legal concept of fundamental rights.
throw310822 2y ago
Of course people who don't value much free speech say that they're mindful of the fact that freedom can be abused etc. Nobody will ever say "yes I like censorship because I am a reactionary". In general, remember that villains almost always justify their action as necessary or just- only in movies their stated motive is obviously egoistical.
- TeMPOraL 2y ago
  > Nobody will ever say "yes I like censorship because I am a reactionary". Yes, because no one except idiots will say "I am reactionary", and no one except idiots believe that "because I am reactionary" is a valid explanation of anything. Political categories are dumb, and most people aren't stupid enough to define themselves by them.

karpatic 2y ago

beguiling denial.

vdqtp3 2y ago

When you support literally jailing people for speech you don't like, you don't support free speech. The clear-cut example I usually pull out - there's PLENTY more. https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/31/23004339/uk-twitter-user-sentenced-grossly-offensive-tweet-tom-moore-joseph-kelly https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/31/23004339/uk-twitter-user-...

croes 2y ago
So he wasn't jailed.
- walthamstow 2y ago
  So much for clear-cut example!
- adammarples 2y ago
  It's still baffling that he could have been, and that this law exists at all
DonHopkins 2y ago
So we can all agree that Trump certainly doesn't support free speech. And he's AMERICAN.
anigbrowl 2y ago
I fail to see what this has to do with European conceptions of free speech in general. You may recall that Britain went out of its way to leave the EU, in part citing its dislike of the EU's legal concept of fundamental rights.

throw310822 2y ago

Of course people who don't value much free speech say that they're mindful of the fact that freedom can be abused etc. Nobody will ever say "yes I like censorship because I am a reactionary". In general, remember that villains almost always justify their action as necessary or just- only in movies their stated motive is obviously egoistical.

TeMPOraL 2y ago
> Nobody will ever say "yes I like censorship because I am a reactionary". Yes, because no one except idiots will say "I am reactionary", and no one except idiots believe that "because I am reactionary" is a valid explanation of anything. Political categories are dumb, and most people aren't stupid enough to define themselves by them.