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... Isn't capitalism great? I remember a thread on here a while back where some folks were sharing their peloton-alike setups and sadly I've lost the bookmark

... Isn't capitalism great? I remember a thread on here a while back where some folks were sharing their peloton-alike setups and sadly I've lost the bookmark for it. Isn't it possible to hook a road bike up to some kind of 'bike treadmill' or such and go on virtual rides (maybe with an iPad or a tv or something infront of it?). With the kinds of money Peloton are charging, it did seem like a much better deal, and you get a road bike included...

nsxwolf 2y ago
A Peloton is just an old-fashioned stationary bike with a SaaS. You can still buy plain old stationary bikes (aka "Spinning Bikes"), no need to rig up a real bike.
- 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
  I believe it is even possible to use a different stationary bike hardware and connect it to the Peloton subscription if you enjoy the service.
CivBase 2y ago
> Isn't capitalism great? Does "capitalism" now just mean that businesses can do whatever they want? Consumer rights are awful in the United States, but that isn't because our economy is capitalistic. It's because our government is inept.
- manuelmoreale 2y ago
  I think by “capitalism” they mean this pervasive attitude of trying to extract money to customer in every way possible.
  - tgv 2y ago
    As long as the government allows it, greed will make corporations try to grab more and more, especially since the finance/MBA types have taken over. It's not strange to call that capitalism, since it is in its very nature.
    - manuelmoreale 2y ago
      I don’t disagree with that and I’m no fan of the current situation.
  - CivBase 2y ago
    But that's litterally not what capitalsim is. Calling that "capitalism" is no better than calling all regulations "communism". It just serves to poison conversations on the subject.
    - manuelmoreale 2y ago
      I’m not saying it’s a good definition. It’s just how I see people using the term. I personally don’t think there’s a good discussion to be had around the subject of this post btw. There’s literally no good reason for that fee. None.
- RIMR 2y ago
  >Consumer rights are awful in the United States, but that isn't because our economy is capitalistic. It's because our government is inept. Well, look at the precise manner in which our government is inept. Capitalism is basically a religious ideology here. Any time anyone suggests anything pro-worker or pro-consumer, there are no shortage of people who will call it "communism", and demand completely unregulated corporate power as the solution, claiming that to be the path to free market capitalism. We have decided that making money = success, and do absolutely nothing when companies charge $95 just to allow you the opportunity to subscribe to a paid service, as a punishment for buying your equipment used. So yes, Capitalism as an economic practice can exist in tandem with strong worker and consumer rights and protections, but Capitalism as an ethos is the reason why we are lacking so many worker and consumer rights and protections.
  - KilgoreBass 2y ago
    Yeah it's wild have free market capitalists want small government and don't want regulations and then when a private company does something people they still manage to blame the government. There's a weird juxtaposition where a lot of libertarians are really into right to repair. And look I'm all for right to repair but I am not a libertarian. Frankly, I'm not convinced capitalism is the best method to organize society at all. But it's fascinating now when private companies do terrible things, they still manage to blame the government even though they are against a large government regulations. Definitely a strange dynamic rossmann community. Because
- drdaeman 2y ago
  I think the root issue is lack of consumer awareness and informedness. In an ideal spherical free market in a vacuum, nobody would buy even slightly enshittified things, because a rational educated consumer understands how it erodes the whole market and thus harms them personally. In reality, of course, consumers frequently barely know anything about what they’re buying, and en masse will happily trade away any rights for a meager discount (or nothing at all), without even really knowing it. The worst part is that there is no effort to fix this - only some crutches and legal duct tape to protect consumers from most blatant abuse. I suspect that with information gaps and lack of full transparency, no matter if it’s some perfect free market capitalism, textbook utopian communism, or anything realistic in between - things are still going to be broken (just with different flavors). In other words, capitalism is a distraction, and lack of even just a strive to have true well-informed competition (which is fundamental to any socioeconomic model, not just capitalism) is the reason we can’t have nice things.
- KilgoreBass 2y ago
  I thought capitalists don't want big government. Now you're saying it's the government's fault for not regulating the business more sufficiently? So which is it? You want larger government regulating stuff like this or not?
repeekad 2y ago
You clearly aren’t their target audience if you’re even thinking about price, it’s a luxury brand that people bought into because their cool rich friends did and they wanted to be part of the club, nothing more nothing less there are plenty of normal alternatives for people who just want exercise, bad example of broken capitalism to me
- tiahura 2y ago
  Envy much?
  - monkeywork 2y ago
    I don't see Envy there - simply truth. It's a lux brand at a premium price, an item many people buy to be in a social group rather than focusing as fitness tool, and there are cheaper and arguably better solutions available out there. Do you debate any of those statements?
    - CamperBob2 2y ago
      No. So why bother complaining?
      - monkeywork 2y ago
        think you replied with the wrong alt account mate....
matsemann 2y ago
If you want a more bike like experience, and not a spinning bike experience, what you want is a "direct drive trainer". You take off your back wheel and mount your normal bike and chain on that. A trainer like that can be used with all kinds of software. Personally I like the social aspects of Zwift. Group rides, competitions, just biking along the map with other people around. For structured workouts Trainerroad is great, but it's also possible to do in Zwift. Other apps like Rouvy exist, probably apps for more traditional spinning sessions as well, or you can just make your own workout in any of the apps matching a YouTube video and put the video on.
- MrMetlHed 2y ago
  Zwift is pretty great for all of that. The biggest challenge I had with the whole ecosystem is finding something that doesn't have a monthly sub. I don't really do a lot of the racing / social aspects -- and I really only use it in the Phoenix summer when it's just too hot to go outside and hike. What I've found that works for me is cancelling Zwift in the cooler weather and using courses and workouts on my Garmin watch or Edge computer, which works and is free.
TuringNYC 2y ago
You can get pretty far just attaching your regular bicycle to a "stationary bike stand", which turns it into a stationary bike. Add in Strava and you have the social aspect. Strava has a pretty good free tier. If you want classes, etc that is separate. I already get that via Apple Health. If you want real-time competition, you could use Zwift, but then you're increasing the cost (albiet, you are using a best of breed system and composing from parts.)
matwood 2y ago
It does seem odd for Peloton to put any friction up to a new subscriber, given that's where they really make their money. There are plenty of other setups with various levels of connectedness. Cyclists I know love Zwift, though they also sell a bike type thing and their kickers are not exactly cheap. I'd argue that Peloton is likely still the best at home spin studio replacement if that's what people are looking for. One last point is that I think Peloton gets unfairly targeted for non-use. Gyms, all fitness equipment, even things like boats and motorcycles are frequently bought and never used. Just how consumerism works.
- sahila 2y ago
  > One last point is that I think Peloton gets unfairly targeted for non-use. Gyms, all fitness equipment, even things like boats and motorcycles are frequently bought and never used. Just how consumerism works. What's different with a Peloton vs others is that there's a ongoing subscription cost, so it sitting around unused with a subscription is a real monthly cost. A better comparison would be a gym membership. Also the Peloton takes a lot of floor place in your home and can't really be stored away.
- timeon 2y ago
  Zwift is maybe more popular with road cyclist because they want to ride actual road bike. Another possibility is marketing. Zwift is promoted at events like Tour de France and is main sponsor of woman's TDF. Now when I thinking about it, it would be odd if Peloton was promoted in bike races. Because the name is so generic in that context.
  - matsemann 2y ago
    Peloton is actually quite hated in cycling circles because of their name clash, and how they're lodging trademark complaints about clubs or events with Peloton in their name...
FredPret 2y ago
Capitalism is fantastic. Capitalism will also sell you a regular bike with a bike treadmill if you think that's a better solution. Capitalism gave us a million different ways to get in a workout - Peloton is just one. Nobody's making you sign up for biking as a service. It sounds like a dumb idea to me but some people have one and love it.
notesinthefield 2y ago
Until the app changes, I just put my road bike on a mag trainer with all of my normal sensors (cadence, heart rate, virtual power and speed) and followed along with the heart rate zone cycling classes. My whole setup is cheaper than a peloton bike by at least $500.
- matwood 2y ago
  > My whole setup is cheaper than a peloton bike by at least $500 Including your road bike? Obviously there are cyclists who also use a Peloton, but I've found that's not who it's targeted at. It's the spin studio crowd who the Peloton is aimed at. I'm guessing many of those haven't ridden an actual bike in long time.
  - notesinthefield 2y ago
    Yes, I dont have an expensive bike by any means.

nsxwolf 2y ago

A Peloton is just an old-fashioned stationary bike with a SaaS. You can still buy plain old stationary bikes (aka "Spinning Bikes"), no need to rig up a real bike.

0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
I believe it is even possible to use a different stationary bike hardware and connect it to the Peloton subscription if you enjoy the service.

CivBase 2y ago

> Isn't capitalism great? Does "capitalism" now just mean that businesses can do whatever they want? Consumer rights are awful in the United States, but that isn't because our economy is capitalistic. It's because our government is inept.

manuelmoreale 2y ago
I think by “capitalism” they mean this pervasive attitude of trying to extract money to customer in every way possible.
- tgv 2y ago
  As long as the government allows it, greed will make corporations try to grab more and more, especially since the finance/MBA types have taken over. It's not strange to call that capitalism, since it is in its very nature.
  - manuelmoreale 2y ago
    I don’t disagree with that and I’m no fan of the current situation.
- CivBase 2y ago
  But that's litterally not what capitalsim is. Calling that "capitalism" is no better than calling all regulations "communism". It just serves to poison conversations on the subject.
  - manuelmoreale 2y ago
    I’m not saying it’s a good definition. It’s just how I see people using the term. I personally don’t think there’s a good discussion to be had around the subject of this post btw. There’s literally no good reason for that fee. None.
RIMR 2y ago
>Consumer rights are awful in the United States, but that isn't because our economy is capitalistic. It's because our government is inept. Well, look at the precise manner in which our government is inept. Capitalism is basically a religious ideology here. Any time anyone suggests anything pro-worker or pro-consumer, there are no shortage of people who will call it "communism", and demand completely unregulated corporate power as the solution, claiming that to be the path to free market capitalism. We have decided that making money = success, and do absolutely nothing when companies charge $95 just to allow you the opportunity to subscribe to a paid service, as a punishment for buying your equipment used. So yes, Capitalism as an economic practice can exist in tandem with strong worker and consumer rights and protections, but Capitalism as an ethos is the reason why we are lacking so many worker and consumer rights and protections.
- KilgoreBass 2y ago
  Yeah it's wild have free market capitalists want small government and don't want regulations and then when a private company does something people they still manage to blame the government. There's a weird juxtaposition where a lot of libertarians are really into right to repair. And look I'm all for right to repair but I am not a libertarian. Frankly, I'm not convinced capitalism is the best method to organize society at all. But it's fascinating now when private companies do terrible things, they still manage to blame the government even though they are against a large government regulations. Definitely a strange dynamic rossmann community. Because
drdaeman 2y ago
I think the root issue is lack of consumer awareness and informedness. In an ideal spherical free market in a vacuum, nobody would buy even slightly enshittified things, because a rational educated consumer understands how it erodes the whole market and thus harms them personally. In reality, of course, consumers frequently barely know anything about what they’re buying, and en masse will happily trade away any rights for a meager discount (or nothing at all), without even really knowing it. The worst part is that there is no effort to fix this - only some crutches and legal duct tape to protect consumers from most blatant abuse. I suspect that with information gaps and lack of full transparency, no matter if it’s some perfect free market capitalism, textbook utopian communism, or anything realistic in between - things are still going to be broken (just with different flavors). In other words, capitalism is a distraction, and lack of even just a strive to have true well-informed competition (which is fundamental to any socioeconomic model, not just capitalism) is the reason we can’t have nice things.
KilgoreBass 2y ago
I thought capitalists don't want big government. Now you're saying it's the government's fault for not regulating the business more sufficiently? So which is it? You want larger government regulating stuff like this or not?

repeekad 2y ago

You clearly aren’t their target audience if you’re even thinking about price, it’s a luxury brand that people bought into because their cool rich friends did and they wanted to be part of the club, nothing more nothing less there are plenty of normal alternatives for people who just want exercise, bad example of broken capitalism to me

tiahura 2y ago
Envy much?
- monkeywork 2y ago
  I don't see Envy there - simply truth. It's a lux brand at a premium price, an item many people buy to be in a social group rather than focusing as fitness tool, and there are cheaper and arguably better solutions available out there. Do you debate any of those statements?
  - CamperBob2 2y ago
    No. So why bother complaining?
    - monkeywork 2y ago
      think you replied with the wrong alt account mate....

matsemann 2y ago

If you want a more bike like experience, and not a spinning bike experience, what you want is a "direct drive trainer". You take off your back wheel and mount your normal bike and chain on that. A trainer like that can be used with all kinds of software. Personally I like the social aspects of Zwift. Group rides, competitions, just biking along the map with other people around. For structured workouts Trainerroad is great, but it's also possible to do in Zwift. Other apps like Rouvy exist, probably apps for more traditional spinning sessions as well, or you can just make your own workout in any of the apps matching a YouTube video and put the video on.

MrMetlHed 2y ago
Zwift is pretty great for all of that. The biggest challenge I had with the whole ecosystem is finding something that doesn't have a monthly sub. I don't really do a lot of the racing / social aspects -- and I really only use it in the Phoenix summer when it's just too hot to go outside and hike. What I've found that works for me is cancelling Zwift in the cooler weather and using courses and workouts on my Garmin watch or Edge computer, which works and is free.

TuringNYC 2y ago

You can get pretty far just attaching your regular bicycle to a "stationary bike stand", which turns it into a stationary bike. Add in Strava and you have the social aspect. Strava has a pretty good free tier. If you want classes, etc that is separate. I already get that via Apple Health. If you want real-time competition, you could use Zwift, but then you're increasing the cost (albiet, you are using a best of breed system and composing from parts.)

matwood 2y ago

It does seem odd for Peloton to put any friction up to a new subscriber, given that's where they really make their money. There are plenty of other setups with various levels of connectedness. Cyclists I know love Zwift, though they also sell a bike type thing and their kickers are not exactly cheap. I'd argue that Peloton is likely still the best at home spin studio replacement if that's what people are looking for. One last point is that I think Peloton gets unfairly targeted for non-use. Gyms, all fitness equipment, even things like boats and motorcycles are frequently bought and never used. Just how consumerism works.

sahila 2y ago
> One last point is that I think Peloton gets unfairly targeted for non-use. Gyms, all fitness equipment, even things like boats and motorcycles are frequently bought and never used. Just how consumerism works. What's different with a Peloton vs others is that there's a ongoing subscription cost, so it sitting around unused with a subscription is a real monthly cost. A better comparison would be a gym membership. Also the Peloton takes a lot of floor place in your home and can't really be stored away.
timeon 2y ago
Zwift is maybe more popular with road cyclist because they want to ride actual road bike. Another possibility is marketing. Zwift is promoted at events like Tour de France and is main sponsor of woman's TDF. Now when I thinking about it, it would be odd if Peloton was promoted in bike races. Because the name is so generic in that context.
- matsemann 2y ago
  Peloton is actually quite hated in cycling circles because of their name clash, and how they're lodging trademark complaints about clubs or events with Peloton in their name...

FredPret 2y ago

Capitalism is fantastic. Capitalism will also sell you a regular bike with a bike treadmill if you think that's a better solution. Capitalism gave us a million different ways to get in a workout - Peloton is just one. Nobody's making you sign up for biking as a service. It sounds like a dumb idea to me but some people have one and love it.

notesinthefield 2y ago

Until the app changes, I just put my road bike on a mag trainer with all of my normal sensors (cadence, heart rate, virtual power and speed) and followed along with the heart rate zone cycling classes. My whole setup is cheaper than a peloton bike by at least $500.

matwood 2y ago
> My whole setup is cheaper than a peloton bike by at least $500 Including your road bike? Obviously there are cyclists who also use a Peloton, but I've found that's not who it's targeted at. It's the spin studio crowd who the Peloton is aimed at. I'm guessing many of those haven't ridden an actual bike in long time.
- notesinthefield 2y ago
  Yes, I dont have an expensive bike by any means.