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AMD's Zen 5 is a missed opportunity in messaging
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- ComputerGuru 2y agoI get an SSL error. Alternative link: https://archive.is/SOJ91 https://archive.is/SOJ91
- tromp 2y agoLoads fine on my macOS 10.15.7 on all of FireFox, Chrome, Brave, and Safari.
- lmz 2y agoThe Wordpress instance seems to be compromised. It's showing me gambling ads instead of the article.
- lloydatkinson 2y agoDefinitely glad I tried to view it on my iPhone and not computer then…
- notanote 2y agoThe SSL error happens because the server sends a certificate which is only valid for the www subdomain. So this link should work: https://www.semiaccurate.com/2024/07/24/amds-zen-5-is-a-missed-opportunity-in-messaging/ https://www.semiaccurate.com/2024/07/24/amds-zen-5-is-a-miss...
- bravetraveler 2y agoSAN certificates, Semi Accurate Name
- TacticalCoder 2y ago> The SSL error happens because the server sends a certificate which is only valid for the www subdomain. This happens more and more to me, even now with two of my banks' websites. Did anything change recently in the standard / browser-enforcement of the standard that'd make that more common? Or in the way some CA emits these? I'm really noticing that more and more. It's also not clear why many people have no issue and are hence posting links that work for some and not for others: is a major browser fine with these while another would be stricter?
- jbverschoor 2y agoProbably more and more people doing ops without apt knowledge and tests
- bravetraveler 2y agoNot necessarily this specific manifestation... but something still worth considering. Large enough businesses tend to clam up for changes in certain quarters. This makes hot spots for renewals/expiration or really anything potentially risky. Nobody wants to do twice the paperwork for maintenance when it lands in sales-season 'change freezes'. I actually burned half a year of lifetime once just to get a more favorable schedule
- LilBytes 2y agoThe domain of the site makes senses, huh.
- difosfor 2y agoAs far as I understood the Ryzen 9000 CPUs were also disappointing in actual benchmarks at about the same performance for gaming as last generation for a much higher price. I've gone for a good old 7800X3D in a recent build.
- diffeomorphism 2y ago> same performance at much lower power consumption! Every time a new processor comes around, lots of people complain that they don't need faster but want less heat and less noise. Now they get it and still complain.
- tarnith 2y agoYeah, if they'd messaged this release as a significant architecture change (that will be more significant over time, and in specific cases, like anything actually using a 512-bit data pipeline) and an efficiency gain they wouldn't be getting this reaction. It's a much better release than many of the Intel refreshes, but the marketing leading up to it was quite bizarre compared to launch performance. Moving the same performance down ~40w is great. Having better branch prediction, more registers, lower latency on many ops and double the SIMD width for no cost? Fantastic. They sold it as a huge gaming gain that hasn't materialized, and then tried to say it was due to windows admin modes interfering with branch prediction (True, but equally seems to apply to Zen3/4) If they'd sold this as a perf/W and backend architecture shift, they wouldn't be getting the reaction they're currently earning.
- tracker1 2y agoI think charging upwards of 1/3 more than prior gen sale pricing (today) also don't help the messaging.
- difosfor 2y agoNot really, from what I understand they're now upselling lower core count processors if you look at for example 7700 vs 9700. If you compare 9700 vs 7600 it makes more sense and the power usage is more comparable. Another 'fix' proposed by AMD also was basically to enable PBO which would then result in a marginal performance improvement, but no longer at a lower power usage.
- PaulKeeble 2y agoNone of the architectural differences seem to have done much for general performance of the CPU which is what has made it such a disappointing release. I guess even AMD realised no one is going to care about the underlying changes if they didn't work to improve performance.
- nullc 2y agoHm? IPC improvement appears to be extremely impressive. If you're put off by gaming comparisons with X3D parts, that isn't really an apples to apples comparison. The current Zen5 parts don't have the huge additional caches that are such a win on some applications, but parts with those are planned for later release. Similarly, going to 128 cores with the full arch or 192 cores with the cut down one is a big step up from 96/128, but these parts are also not shipping yet. Separately, the performance/joule improvement looks very good-- for plenty of applications the total cost is dominated by energy usage so zen5 looks like a big win for those. Though again, this is mostly a factor for server parts that aren't shipping yet. I think it would be fair to say zen5 is impressive while the initial zen5 offerings are less so.
- CuriousCosmic 2y agoI'd also argue that some of the Zen5 features have the potential to be a big boost for gaming but the adoption just isn't there yet. AMD's AVX512 is a big deal because unlike Intel's implementation it doesn't trigger a 50 thousand cycle delay to start using it along with a massive downclock. That means you can do SIMD way faster on these CPUs and there's virtually no induced latency (occasionally a 50 cycle delay for the 4x512 to presumably to finish charging caps if they are still depleted) and importantly no downclock which allows you to do burst AVX512 operations wherever you see a use instead of needing to carefully apply their use to compensate for a massive perf hit. And while games generally push expensive SIMD to the GPU, having no-cost AVX512 lets you accelerate SIMD ops that aren't big enough to justify the latency of GPU offload or the hit to GPU occupancy. It'll require engines and devs to adopt but there is a performance opportunity there if they are willing to take advantage of it.
- theandrewbailey 2y ago> AMD’s Zen 4 vs Zen 5 cores > There is a lot of cool stuff in the Zen 5 core but at this point we would rather chew our hands off than lose two days of sleep trying in vain to write it up and failing because of lack of time. AMD did this by design, again, so we aren’t going to ruin our lives to make up for that crap. Hilarious.
- Pet_Ant 2y agoI have a conspiracy theory that these parts were supposed to be faster at the same power level but after seeing what was happening with Intel they decided to turn down the power usage till they met the same performance of the previous generation until they can figure out what is going on. I wonder what these chips will look like under over clocking.
- CuriousCosmic 2y agoThe counter side of that is that the chips were supposed to be faster but AMD has a history of their chips not consistently hitting advertised clock speeds so they chose to clock down and make sure everything hit advertised rather than some of the lower samples not always hitting it. This seems to be "Intel got bad press for their stuff and we don't want any semblance of a defect in our launch" and is a minor bit of kneecapping to avoid the occasional weak sample missing advertised speeds in less than ideal conditions. I love AMD to death but they do have a tendency to oversell on clock speeds even if their performance is stellar otherwise.
- 3np 2y ago> the lower end Ryzen APUs, we won’t use the AI crap names, are not something we would deploy, anywhere, ever, due to the hardware security backdoor that is Pluton. If you think the latest Crowdstrike ‘whoopsie’ was bad, imagine it baked into hardware in the near future. First time I hear about Pluton and, wow, yeah, no joke. I guess it's on to other CPU architectures for us when it gets time to replace current generation... :\
- jitl 2y agoThis is Microsoft’s version of Apple’s “Secure Enclave” root of trust on Apple silicon devices. I’m always surprised about the negative reaction to TPM or Pluton, given (what I perceive as) the positive security/privacy opinion on Secure Enclave
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- yoyohello13 2y agoYou presumably opt-in to Secure Enclave when you by Apple. With all the new CPUs implementing Pluton you can't opt out. I'm sure Linux users aren't interested in a backdoor created by Microsoft.
- lern_too_spel 2y agoThe OS decides whether or not to expose it.
- eightysixfour 2y agoWhat do you mean you can't opt out? It just turns into a normal TPM if the OS doesn't use it.
- goosedragons 2y agoI'm more concerned with companies using it as a trust source to make running not-Windows not viable.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- frankharv 2y agoTell us how you really feel Charlie..... That was pretty brutal on the marketeers..