7 ms·

Show HN: Non SaaS – Directory of Non SaaS Apps

localfirst 2y ago
What a refreshing thing it is to pay for software once and never pay again! Already I can see several SaaS subscriptions that can be replaced here.
- bruce511 2y ago
  All coins have 2 sides. Paying once is great, and if uou are happy then that's good. I use a bunch of software purchased on this model. It's worth understanding though that the seller owes you nothing after this. Not support. Not development. Not keeping up with API or whatever changes. Not bug fixes (although most everyone ships some free updates for a while.) Obviously not hosting. And for lots of software this model is perfect. For other stuff it's imperfect (as anyone who desperately needs Google Support will sympathize with.) You get to choose what software I'd on your business-critical path, and what is on your "can replace anytime" path.
  - Intermernet 2y ago
    Buying things on subscription is no guarantee that the seller owes you anything in the future. This is the main fault of SaaS.
  - localfirst 2y ago
    I want to pay for software once and beyond certain version I would need to upgrade but I want that decision to be done by me at my own volition Laravel does this quite well
- manuelmoreale 2y ago
  I know some people don't like the company behind this but you might find the idea interesting: https://once.com https://once.com
- Terretta 2y ago
  > What a refreshing thing it is to pay for software once and never pay again! Already I can see several SaaS subscriptions that can be replaced here. Like adopting twenty for CRM, at just $9/user/month, so 2x the cost of Microsoft Teams, or about the same as M365! I'm not sure about the inclusion criteria.
ofey404 2y ago
The pages have good TDK metadata for SEO. Well designed with a low-code tool.
- nicoloren 2y ago
  What do you mean by TDK? Is it Title, Description, and Keywords? Do you consider low-code tool good enough for SEO now?
lolinder 2y ago
First entry I see: Pabbly Connect [0], a subscription web service that normally runs $20 a month and currently has a lifetime subscription offer advertised. Everything is hosted in the cloud, you sign in to access the product, they're SOC2 compliant, etc. This website has a very different definition of SaaS than I do, and it sounds like it rhymes with "subscription". A few more examples to make sure it wasn't a one-off: * Foxly, a URL shortener with a subscription or lifetime deal [1]. * CountVisits, web analytics. This one doesn't offer a subscription, but it's still all hosted on their servers and therefore has usage limits (which you can pay to upgrade) [2] [0] https://www.pabbly.com/connect/ https://www.pabbly.com/connect/ [1] https://foxlyme.com/pricing/ https://foxlyme.com/pricing/ [2] https://countvisits.com/ https://countvisits.com/
- spencerchubb 2y ago
  indeed. seems like a directory of pay-once saas
- frequentflyeru 2y ago
  Yes, I wasn't sure how to categorize these. This is V1 of the site and I will make adjustments based on feedback. There are no Non SaaS alternatives to those products, so I included them even though they are technically SaaS with a lifetime deal.
  - lolinder 2y ago
    If I were you I'd drop them outright. Better to have the directory live up to its name than to have it be more comprehensive but contain apps that are clearly SaaS.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
quaintdev 2y ago
We as Software developers need to be honest with ourselves and really think about pricing. The product should be priced as per the effort and time it took to develop. If application needs maintenance then charge it separately. But the customer should not have to pay for your SaaS because you don't want to work 9 to 5.
- apantel 2y ago
  That’s not how price works. Price is a function of supply and demand. The cost of goods sold is just part of what goes into price. So if you make something really compelling or scarce that people are willing to pay a lot of money for, you can charge more for it than it costs you to produce it. That’s business.
- bruce511 2y ago
  >> The product should be priced as per the effort and time it took to develop When I started programming I costed projects like this. Now I price things based on their value to the customer. There were a number of reasons for the switch; Firstly in the earlier model all I'm selling is my time. All time I don't have work is lost, and I can't make it back. This resulted in years of being underpaid because a month of no work was lost forever. There are lots of things you need to do running a business test are not "billable". Finding new eork is one of them. So costing just the time you spent on the app is naive. Pricing based on effort also allows no opportunity to grow. If I hire an employee I now need to find work for her as well. And so on. Lastly, when making products (to sell over and over) you can't base price on cost because we don't know up-front how many copies we'll sell. So we look at the value to the customer. Things that offer them higher value cost more. Sometimes there's a surplus, and that allows new, less certain, products to be developed. Sometimes it takes years for a product to return the investment. We moved some (not all) products to a subscription when it became obvious that it was not possible to support all existing clients from only new-sales revenue. We needed to hire full-time supporters and since they add value to existing customers they need to be paid for by customers. This means that if sales dried up tomorrow , existing customers could still get support ad infinitum. This is -much- more valuable to them than some small subscription amount. So here's my suggestion. If a service is costing you more than the value you are getting, just stop using it. By definition you will be ahead. You don't need yo feel aggrieved at how other people price their stuff. That's on rhem, not you.
alberth 2y ago
> Inspired by … @Chamath (8090ish) 8090ish is a fake site. https://www.8090ish.com/ https://www.8090ish.com/ Why did you make this fake site? I like the concept. I don't have any strong mutual connections to Chamath, I made this on the off chance that I can get his attention to learn more about his plan. If you're reading this Chamath, let's chat! I'll happily hand this site over, and I'm happy to work with your team to build the real one.
- frequentflyeru 2y ago
  Thanks I couldn't find any other info on it except what Chamath had said on a podcast, so I gave a link to the "fake" site since it explains the concept behind 80/90.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
alexander2002 2y ago
[flagged]
JensRantil 2y ago
Works badly on mobile.
- frequentflyeru 2y ago
  Thanks for letting me know. Will fix.
aitchnyu 2y ago
Do any self hosting sites include an "effort index"? For example, if its a binary which needs Sqlite/MySql and Nginx, it gets a perfect score; if it needs 5 docker containers...
- cqqxo4zV46cp 2y ago
  You’ve answered your own question, because I could very reasonably disagree with your assertion of which is the bigger ask, there.
- sofixa 2y ago
  On the contrary. Handwaving "oh bring your own DB" is drastically more complex than having a ready-made docker-compose.yml which includes said DB and whatever else is needed.
- Hamuko 2y ago
  I've built server applications that ship as a single binary and I'm still running them as Docker containers on my home server.
  - aitchnyu 2y ago
    Tell me why?
    - Hamuko 2y ago
      It just makes deploying much easier. I don't have to worry about system dependencies or some random trash being left on my filesystem, since the container has all of its dependencies and it only has access to whatever parts of the filesystem I give it.
- api 2y ago
  Ahh the lost art of writing installable deployable software. Another thing I don’t like about SaaS is that most of it is a yarn ball held together by snot and twist ties that can run on only one cloud… or only one cloud account with hard coded details about that account. As such it’s encouraged a generation of developers to write this slop.
udev4096 2y ago
Why are you using such a bloated website builder for a quite simple task of listing apps?
- r0fl 2y ago
  I love the design and the site loads very fast for me What would you suggest instead as a better alternative for this type of project
- KomoD 2y ago
  Because he's probably associated with it in some way. 9 of the sites listed are using the same thing and link to each other in the footer as "Mars Verse".
- Terretta 2y ago
  Maybe you should use a quick Directory builder non-SaaS instead. See if there are any there.
Andugal 2y ago
Great marketing strategy since the creator of this website is also the creator of several of these "non-SaaS".
- juujian 2y ago
  I mean if they're really into non-saas, it's just natural that there is this overlap in interest. Developing them and collecting information on them.
Crazyontap 2y ago
The concept is good but the site design is just awful. The page is non responsive. Can't search and the scroll is very slow. Not sure why a such a simple page is designed to take up so much CPU.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
da_rob 2y ago
Went through the list, all listed services are SaaS apps. :( Granted, most of them are self-hosted (not all!), but this list needs to be called norecurringfee.com ….

What a refreshing thing it is to pay for software once and never pay again! Already I can see several SaaS subscriptions that can be replaced here.

bruce511 2y ago
All coins have 2 sides. Paying once is great, and if uou are happy then that's good. I use a bunch of software purchased on this model. It's worth understanding though that the seller owes you nothing after this. Not support. Not development. Not keeping up with API or whatever changes. Not bug fixes (although most everyone ships some free updates for a while.) Obviously not hosting. And for lots of software this model is perfect. For other stuff it's imperfect (as anyone who desperately needs Google Support will sympathize with.) You get to choose what software I'd on your business-critical path, and what is on your "can replace anytime" path.
- Intermernet 2y ago
  Buying things on subscription is no guarantee that the seller owes you anything in the future. This is the main fault of SaaS.
- localfirst 2y ago
  I want to pay for software once and beyond certain version I would need to upgrade but I want that decision to be done by me at my own volition Laravel does this quite well
manuelmoreale 2y ago
I know some people don't like the company behind this but you might find the idea interesting: https://once.com https://once.com
Terretta 2y ago
> What a refreshing thing it is to pay for software once and never pay again! Already I can see several SaaS subscriptions that can be replaced here. Like adopting twenty for CRM, at just $9/user/month, so 2x the cost of Microsoft Teams, or about the same as M365! I'm not sure about the inclusion criteria.

ofey404 2y ago

The pages have good TDK metadata for SEO. Well designed with a low-code tool.

nicoloren 2y ago
What do you mean by TDK? Is it Title, Description, and Keywords? Do you consider low-code tool good enough for SEO now?

lolinder 2y ago

First entry I see: Pabbly Connect [0], a subscription web service that normally runs $20 a month and currently has a lifetime subscription offer advertised. Everything is hosted in the cloud, you sign in to access the product, they're SOC2 compliant, etc. This website has a very different definition of SaaS than I do, and it sounds like it rhymes with "subscription". A few more examples to make sure it wasn't a one-off: * Foxly, a URL shortener with a subscription or lifetime deal [1]. * CountVisits, web analytics. This one doesn't offer a subscription, but it's still all hosted on their servers and therefore has usage limits (which you can pay to upgrade) [2] [0] https://www.pabbly.com/connect/ https://www.pabbly.com/connect/ [1] https://foxlyme.com/pricing/ https://foxlyme.com/pricing/ [2] https://countvisits.com/ https://countvisits.com/

spencerchubb 2y ago
indeed. seems like a directory of pay-once saas
frequentflyeru 2y ago
Yes, I wasn't sure how to categorize these. This is V1 of the site and I will make adjustments based on feedback. There are no Non SaaS alternatives to those products, so I included them even though they are technically SaaS with a lifetime deal.
- lolinder 2y ago
  If I were you I'd drop them outright. Better to have the directory live up to its name than to have it be more comprehensive but contain apps that are clearly SaaS.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

quaintdev 2y ago

We as Software developers need to be honest with ourselves and really think about pricing. The product should be priced as per the effort and time it took to develop. If application needs maintenance then charge it separately. But the customer should not have to pay for your SaaS because you don't want to work 9 to 5.

apantel 2y ago
That’s not how price works. Price is a function of supply and demand. The cost of goods sold is just part of what goes into price. So if you make something really compelling or scarce that people are willing to pay a lot of money for, you can charge more for it than it costs you to produce it. That’s business.
bruce511 2y ago
>> The product should be priced as per the effort and time it took to develop When I started programming I costed projects like this. Now I price things based on their value to the customer. There were a number of reasons for the switch; Firstly in the earlier model all I'm selling is my time. All time I don't have work is lost, and I can't make it back. This resulted in years of being underpaid because a month of no work was lost forever. There are lots of things you need to do running a business test are not "billable". Finding new eork is one of them. So costing just the time you spent on the app is naive. Pricing based on effort also allows no opportunity to grow. If I hire an employee I now need to find work for her as well. And so on. Lastly, when making products (to sell over and over) you can't base price on cost because we don't know up-front how many copies we'll sell. So we look at the value to the customer. Things that offer them higher value cost more. Sometimes there's a surplus, and that allows new, less certain, products to be developed. Sometimes it takes years for a product to return the investment. We moved some (not all) products to a subscription when it became obvious that it was not possible to support all existing clients from only new-sales revenue. We needed to hire full-time supporters and since they add value to existing customers they need to be paid for by customers. This means that if sales dried up tomorrow , existing customers could still get support ad infinitum. This is -much- more valuable to them than some small subscription amount. So here's my suggestion. If a service is costing you more than the value you are getting, just stop using it. By definition you will be ahead. You don't need yo feel aggrieved at how other people price their stuff. That's on rhem, not you.

alberth 2y ago

> Inspired by … @Chamath (8090ish) 8090ish is a fake site. https://www.8090ish.com/ https://www.8090ish.com/ Why did you make this fake site? I like the concept. I don't have any strong mutual connections to Chamath, I made this on the off chance that I can get his attention to learn more about his plan. If you're reading this Chamath, let's chat! I'll happily hand this site over, and I'm happy to work with your team to build the real one.

frequentflyeru 2y ago
Thanks I couldn't find any other info on it except what Chamath had said on a podcast, so I gave a link to the "fake" site since it explains the concept behind 80/90.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

alexander2002 2y ago

[flagged]

JensRantil 2y ago

Works badly on mobile.

frequentflyeru 2y ago
Thanks for letting me know. Will fix.

aitchnyu 2y ago

Do any self hosting sites include an "effort index"? For example, if its a binary which needs Sqlite/MySql and Nginx, it gets a perfect score; if it needs 5 docker containers...

cqqxo4zV46cp 2y ago
You’ve answered your own question, because I could very reasonably disagree with your assertion of which is the bigger ask, there.
sofixa 2y ago
On the contrary. Handwaving "oh bring your own DB" is drastically more complex than having a ready-made docker-compose.yml which includes said DB and whatever else is needed.
Hamuko 2y ago
I've built server applications that ship as a single binary and I'm still running them as Docker containers on my home server.
- aitchnyu 2y ago
  Tell me why?
  - Hamuko 2y ago
    It just makes deploying much easier. I don't have to worry about system dependencies or some random trash being left on my filesystem, since the container has all of its dependencies and it only has access to whatever parts of the filesystem I give it.
api 2y ago
Ahh the lost art of writing installable deployable software. Another thing I don’t like about SaaS is that most of it is a yarn ball held together by snot and twist ties that can run on only one cloud… or only one cloud account with hard coded details about that account. As such it’s encouraged a generation of developers to write this slop.

udev4096 2y ago

Why are you using such a bloated website builder for a quite simple task of listing apps?

r0fl 2y ago
I love the design and the site loads very fast for me What would you suggest instead as a better alternative for this type of project
KomoD 2y ago
Because he's probably associated with it in some way. 9 of the sites listed are using the same thing and link to each other in the footer as "Mars Verse".
Terretta 2y ago
Maybe you should use a quick Directory builder non-SaaS instead. See if there are any there.

Andugal 2y ago

Great marketing strategy since the creator of this website is also the creator of several of these "non-SaaS".

juujian 2y ago
I mean if they're really into non-saas, it's just natural that there is this overlap in interest. Developing them and collecting information on them.

Crazyontap 2y ago

The concept is good but the site design is just awful. The page is non responsive. Can't search and the scroll is very slow. Not sure why a such a simple page is designed to take up so much CPU.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

da_rob 2y ago

Went through the list, all listed services are SaaS apps. :( Granted, most of them are self-hosted (not all!), but this list needs to be called norecurringfee.com ….