4 ms·

> There is another reason: the addresses are long and impossible to remember and hard to type. If only there was some mechanism in which we could use a human-f

> There is another reason: the addresses are long and impossible to remember and hard to type. If only there was some mechanism in which we could use a human-friendly label and have that translated to a computer-usable address… > I always bring this up and it’s always dismissed because tech people continue to dismiss usability concerns. I don't bother remembering IPv4 addresses, so I'm not sure why I would bother to remember IPv6 addresses. Heck, phone numbers are generally short as well, and who remembers them nowadays? ("0118 999 881 999 119 725… 3") Maybe it's dismissed because people see it as a non-issue. I regularly work at OSI Layer 2 (and even 1, pulling fibres in a DC), and Layer 3, and am not sure what the concerns are about.

api 2y ago
The problem is that DNS is not zero configuration. ARP and NDP are which is why nobody complains about Ethernet being hard to type. DNS has to be “stood up” which is a whole extra deployment. In modern devops in particular it is common to create and tear down IP networks in seconds and sling stuff everywhere. The extra moving part is an extra thing to break. DNS also runs over IP which means if IP is down DNS doesn’t work. What do you have to do then? You have to debug IP without DNS. There is mDNS but it’s not reliable and doesn’t scale to large networks. It also runs on the IP layer so if there is a problem there it can break.
- throw0101d 2y ago
  > The problem is that DNS is not zero configuration. Certainly it is not-zeroconf, but it is the same not-zeroconf for both IPv4 and IPv6. But extra work with DHCP is needed for IPv4, and extra-extra work if you need to do things like configure 'IP helper', whereas IPv6 can be configured using only a router (which you need regardless) and some on-link packets (RAs). > DNS also runs over IP which means if IP is down DNS doesn’t work. What do you have to do then? You have to debug IP without DNS. And? At least you have fe80/64 as a basic starting point. Run a tcpdump to see if you're on-link in any way (or in the correct VLAN), and if you are, you can then ping(6) ff02::2 to find if there any on-link routers. You've now debugged Layer 2 and Layer 3 connectivity. Tada. You're making IPv6 (sound) way more complicated than it is. It is no more or less complicated than IPv4 or IPX/SPX or …. It's protocol data units at OSI Layer 2 or 3 in different formats with different fields.
louthy 2y ago
> who remembers them nowadays? 0118 999 881 999 119 725… 3 Me, that’s the new number for the emergency services. Actually, that’s the only phone number I can remember :D
- adolph 2y ago
  Eight six seven five three oh nine Eight six seven five three oh nine

api 2y ago

The problem is that DNS is not zero configuration. ARP and NDP are which is why nobody complains about Ethernet being hard to type. DNS has to be “stood up” which is a whole extra deployment. In modern devops in particular it is common to create and tear down IP networks in seconds and sling stuff everywhere. The extra moving part is an extra thing to break. DNS also runs over IP which means if IP is down DNS doesn’t work. What do you have to do then? You have to debug IP without DNS. There is mDNS but it’s not reliable and doesn’t scale to large networks. It also runs on the IP layer so if there is a problem there it can break.

throw0101d 2y ago
> The problem is that DNS is not zero configuration. Certainly it is not-zeroconf, but it is the same not-zeroconf for both IPv4 and IPv6. But extra work with DHCP is needed for IPv4, and extra-extra work if you need to do things like configure 'IP helper', whereas IPv6 can be configured using only a router (which you need regardless) and some on-link packets (RAs). > DNS also runs over IP which means if IP is down DNS doesn’t work. What do you have to do then? You have to debug IP without DNS. And? At least you have fe80/64 as a basic starting point. Run a tcpdump to see if you're on-link in any way (or in the correct VLAN), and if you are, you can then ping(6) ff02::2 to find if there any on-link routers. You've now debugged Layer 2 and Layer 3 connectivity. Tada. You're making IPv6 (sound) way more complicated than it is. It is no more or less complicated than IPv4 or IPX/SPX or …. It's protocol data units at OSI Layer 2 or 3 in different formats with different fields.

louthy 2y ago

> who remembers them nowadays? 0118 999 881 999 119 725… 3 Me, that’s the new number for the emergency services. Actually, that’s the only phone number I can remember :D

adolph 2y ago
Eight six seven five three oh nine Eight six seven five three oh nine