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The entire industry has a monopoly problem with the expected set of related interoperability problems. There's no logical reason we should be running so much i

The entire industry has a monopoly problem with the expected set of related interoperability problems. There's no logical reason we should be running so much infrastructure on Microsoft's monoculture.

k8sToGo 2y ago
I hope you are aware the same thing happened on Linux recently.
- lucianbr 2y ago
  Still, it did not happen at the same time, did it? Diversity has advantages, even if none of the systems is perfect.
- orwin 2y ago
  If "Linux" mean RHEL, and "same thing" mean "redhat eBPF implementation was buggy and caused kernel panic after a few minutes, but you could deactivate it", i'm aware.
irjustin 2y ago
Running a different OS for each business function is my favorite absurd solution to this problem.
- akira2501 2y ago
  > absurd solution What's absurd about it? It's absurd that I want the software operating my MRI and providing doctors with necessary information during surgeries to be different from what accountants using Excel and video game players use? What's absurd is congress hoping to solve the fundamental problem by asking the CrowdStrike CEO to come in for a one on one. Even if we took this process at face value and assumed they were earnest it would be laughable. Meanwhile.. the government is the largest healthcare payer in the world. For not particularly great reasons. This _is_ one of the downstream impacts of that reality.
  - mlazos 2y ago
    Yes it is absurd to rewrite your entire software stack when 99% of scenarios have the same requirements: CPU, I/O, drivers. You know how many bugs you have with one stack? Multiply by 2x for each of your custom OSes. I’ve seen the fragmentation in edge devices and no thanks, I don’t want more “secure” “proprietary” software.
    - akira2501 2y ago
      > rewrite your entire software stack This has nothing to do with there being a healthy market of operating systems to choose from. > I’ve seen the fragmentation in edge devices How many versions and patch levels of Windows exist? How many are currently deployed? How many must stay on the current version because of fragmentation? > You know how many bugs you have with one stack? The scenario that started this discussion is a single bug in a single piece of software impacting a large number of businesses, some of which are safety and life critical, all of which are on a single OS. It's not a question of "how many bugs," because you can't fully eliminate them in any system which is actually updated _ever_, it's a question of "how many people does this single bug impact?" Will this require more time and labor? Yes, of course. Does that make it "absurd" to consider? No, that's pure hyperbole.
pixelfarmer 2y ago
The problem at hand is not one of monopoly, but of awareness of what is actual infrastructure and what is not. More and more systems enter the gray area towards becoming full blown infrastructure, but at the same time nothing is done to increase their reliability accordingly. Worse, the ever increasing complexity also hides an increasing number of weak spots in the systems. This incident shows exactly that, but just look at the comments ... it is NOT the wake-up call it needs to be, the discussions are going sideways in all sorts of directions, even among those who should see the things for what they are.

k8sToGo 2y ago

I hope you are aware the same thing happened on Linux recently.

lucianbr 2y ago
Still, it did not happen at the same time, did it? Diversity has advantages, even if none of the systems is perfect.
orwin 2y ago
If "Linux" mean RHEL, and "same thing" mean "redhat eBPF implementation was buggy and caused kernel panic after a few minutes, but you could deactivate it", i'm aware.

irjustin 2y ago

Running a different OS for each business function is my favorite absurd solution to this problem.

akira2501 2y ago
> absurd solution What's absurd about it? It's absurd that I want the software operating my MRI and providing doctors with necessary information during surgeries to be different from what accountants using Excel and video game players use? What's absurd is congress hoping to solve the fundamental problem by asking the CrowdStrike CEO to come in for a one on one. Even if we took this process at face value and assumed they were earnest it would be laughable. Meanwhile.. the government is the largest healthcare payer in the world. For not particularly great reasons. This _is_ one of the downstream impacts of that reality.
- mlazos 2y ago
  Yes it is absurd to rewrite your entire software stack when 99% of scenarios have the same requirements: CPU, I/O, drivers. You know how many bugs you have with one stack? Multiply by 2x for each of your custom OSes. I’ve seen the fragmentation in edge devices and no thanks, I don’t want more “secure” “proprietary” software.
  - akira2501 2y ago
    > rewrite your entire software stack This has nothing to do with there being a healthy market of operating systems to choose from. > I’ve seen the fragmentation in edge devices How many versions and patch levels of Windows exist? How many are currently deployed? How many must stay on the current version because of fragmentation? > You know how many bugs you have with one stack? The scenario that started this discussion is a single bug in a single piece of software impacting a large number of businesses, some of which are safety and life critical, all of which are on a single OS. It's not a question of "how many bugs," because you can't fully eliminate them in any system which is actually updated _ever_, it's a question of "how many people does this single bug impact?" Will this require more time and labor? Yes, of course. Does that make it "absurd" to consider? No, that's pure hyperbole.

pixelfarmer 2y ago

The problem at hand is not one of monopoly, but of awareness of what is actual infrastructure and what is not. More and more systems enter the gray area towards becoming full blown infrastructure, but at the same time nothing is done to increase their reliability accordingly. Worse, the ever increasing complexity also hides an increasing number of weak spots in the systems. This incident shows exactly that, but just look at the comments ... it is NOT the wake-up call it needs to be, the discussions are going sideways in all sorts of directions, even among those who should see the things for what they are.