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If you are asking if we'd reject a well-paying job that is a good career boost because of a philosophical problem with how they operate... great, I'm all in fav

If you are asking if we'd reject a well-paying job that is a good career boost because of a philosophical problem with how they operate... great, I'm all in favor of applying personal ethics to your work. But I'd encourage everyone to apply those same ethics to all jobs, not just Meta. After all, when you dig deep enough, most corporations are evil at some level. (Not all.) And most people are decent (or so I choose to believe.) So which is worse? Refusing to get some personal gain from an evil corporation with an evil leader? Or accepting the reality of it, taking a job from them, and using some of the resulting wealth to create positive impact in other areas of our world? There is no right answer to that question, BTW. Everyone has their own ethics. But there is more depth to be considered than just "Meta is evil, so reject job." (For the record, I don't know anyone in leadership at Meta, so I cannot say if they are actually evil or not, that statement is just for the sake of argument.)

meiraleal 2y ago
This reasoning is the same thought that led millions of germans to become nazis. Meta is not your common "evil" business.
- shrimp_emoji 2y ago
  No, the reasoning was that they were saving their nation and dignity after the abuse they suffered in the peace terms from WW1 and from the looming Soviet Union. If it was an /r/amitheasshole post, the Nazis would definitely be the biggest asshole, but everyone in the situation would be assholes.
- codingdave 2y ago
  Whoa - either I expressed myself really poorly, or you are just bent on applying Godwin's law as fast as you can.
  - meiraleal 2y ago
    Not really (I really like most if not all of your comments, this is the first time I recall disagreeing). Working for a company that brings such a net negative to society is not a matter of "most corporations are evil at some level". Facebook/Instagram/Meta (and Google) have such a negative influence in the minds of billions of people that honestly, they both already rival or might surpass how big and influential Nazi Germany ever was. If Meta was a company like others, this kind of Ask HN wouldn't be so common.
    - drstewart 2y ago
      That's funny, because I think the same about companies that work on AI, which will be 10x worse than social media ever was. So, what do you do?
      - meiraleal 2y ago
        I will hope for you to put up a fight against them, then. I don't think a hypothetical bigger evil in the future is worse than current big evil tho and what's going to come from AI is still up to grab, at least much more than social media or search.
  - muzani 2y ago
    Nazis are a simple evil everyone agrees on. The reality is most of the biggest tech companies work with defense. Some of it is actually defense. I think we should come up with a "Are we the baddies?" checklist. 1. Do we justify killing 10 innocents to save one life? 2. Are the enemies not given proper burials, i.e. are body parts kept as trophies or mounted on sticks? Mass graves and cremations are still okay. 3. Do our commanders show joy at killing an unarmed civilian? 4. Do we perform experiments on live prisoners? 5. Do we rape or kill anyone under the age of 9? 6. Do we use starvation as a weapon? Most of the cruelest societies would be around 5/6. Something like Holodomor was cruel, but only about 1/6. WW2 Allies would be around 3/6, but well, they were fighting the ones who were at 5/6. So maybe it was justified if you're defending against a bigger threat? Scale probably counts too, but it's simpler to measure intent and cruelty. I would wager that no tech company scores anywhere near 5 like Nazis. But some may be complicit on at least 1, like human trafficking or enabling serial killers.

meiraleal 2y ago

This reasoning is the same thought that led millions of germans to become nazis. Meta is not your common "evil" business.

shrimp_emoji 2y ago
No, the reasoning was that they were saving their nation and dignity after the abuse they suffered in the peace terms from WW1 and from the looming Soviet Union. If it was an /r/amitheasshole post, the Nazis would definitely be the biggest asshole, but everyone in the situation would be assholes.
codingdave 2y ago
Whoa - either I expressed myself really poorly, or you are just bent on applying Godwin's law as fast as you can.
- meiraleal 2y ago
  Not really (I really like most if not all of your comments, this is the first time I recall disagreeing). Working for a company that brings such a net negative to society is not a matter of "most corporations are evil at some level". Facebook/Instagram/Meta (and Google) have such a negative influence in the minds of billions of people that honestly, they both already rival or might surpass how big and influential Nazi Germany ever was. If Meta was a company like others, this kind of Ask HN wouldn't be so common.
  - drstewart 2y ago
    That's funny, because I think the same about companies that work on AI, which will be 10x worse than social media ever was. So, what do you do?
    - meiraleal 2y ago
      I will hope for you to put up a fight against them, then. I don't think a hypothetical bigger evil in the future is worse than current big evil tho and what's going to come from AI is still up to grab, at least much more than social media or search.
- muzani 2y ago
  Nazis are a simple evil everyone agrees on. The reality is most of the biggest tech companies work with defense. Some of it is actually defense. I think we should come up with a "Are we the baddies?" checklist. 1. Do we justify killing 10 innocents to save one life? 2. Are the enemies not given proper burials, i.e. are body parts kept as trophies or mounted on sticks? Mass graves and cremations are still okay. 3. Do our commanders show joy at killing an unarmed civilian? 4. Do we perform experiments on live prisoners? 5. Do we rape or kill anyone under the age of 9? 6. Do we use starvation as a weapon? Most of the cruelest societies would be around 5/6. Something like Holodomor was cruel, but only about 1/6. WW2 Allies would be around 3/6, but well, they were fighting the ones who were at 5/6. So maybe it was justified if you're defending against a bigger threat? Scale probably counts too, but it's simpler to measure intent and cruelty. I would wager that no tech company scores anywhere near 5 like Nazis. But some may be complicit on at least 1, like human trafficking or enabling serial killers.