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We converged on a system that protects the commercialization of copies because, in practice, "the first copy costs $X0,000" is not a viable way to pay your rent

We converged on a system that protects the commercialization of copies because, in practice, "the first copy costs $X0,000" is not a viable way to pay your rent. If we want art to be the province of the willfully destitute or the idle rich (and I do mean rich, the destruction of a functional middle class has compacted the available free time of huge swaths of society!), this is a good way to do it. I would rather other voices be included.

JoshTriplett 2y ago
We converged on a system that makes copying illegal because that system was invented in an era when the only people who could copy were those with specialized equipment (e.g. printing presses). In that world, those who might do the copying were often larger than those whose works were being copied, and copyright had more potential to be "protective". That system hasn't been updated for a world in which everyone can make perfect-fidelity copies or modifications at the touch of a key; on the contrary, it's been made stricter. And worse, per the story we're commenting on here, the much larger players who are mass-copying works largely by individuals or smaller entities have become effectively exempt from copyright, while copyright continues to restrict individuals and smaller entities, and the systems designed by those large players and trained on all those copied works are crowding individuals out of art and other creative endeavors. I don't think the current system deserves valorizing, nor can it be credited as being intentionally designed to bring about most of the effects it currently serves. I'm not suggesting that deleting copyright overnight will produce a perfect system, nor am I suggesting that it has zero positive effects. I'm suggesting that it's doing substantial harm and needs a massive overhaul, not minor tweaks.
- freejazz 2y ago
  > the much larger players who are mass-copying works largely by individuals or smaller entities have become effectively exempt from copyright That's not true. I'm a copyright attorney and I spend my day extracting money from the largest players on behalf of individuals.
  - JoshTriplett 2y ago
    I was referring to AI training here.
    - freejazz 2y ago
      We'll see, but hopefully they will not.

JoshTriplett 2y ago

We converged on a system that makes copying illegal because that system was invented in an era when the only people who could copy were those with specialized equipment (e.g. printing presses). In that world, those who might do the copying were often larger than those whose works were being copied, and copyright had more potential to be "protective". That system hasn't been updated for a world in which everyone can make perfect-fidelity copies or modifications at the touch of a key; on the contrary, it's been made stricter. And worse, per the story we're commenting on here, the much larger players who are mass-copying works largely by individuals or smaller entities have become effectively exempt from copyright, while copyright continues to restrict individuals and smaller entities, and the systems designed by those large players and trained on all those copied works are crowding individuals out of art and other creative endeavors. I don't think the current system deserves valorizing, nor can it be credited as being intentionally designed to bring about most of the effects it currently serves. I'm not suggesting that deleting copyright overnight will produce a perfect system, nor am I suggesting that it has zero positive effects. I'm suggesting that it's doing substantial harm and needs a massive overhaul, not minor tweaks.

freejazz 2y ago
> the much larger players who are mass-copying works largely by individuals or smaller entities have become effectively exempt from copyright That's not true. I'm a copyright attorney and I spend my day extracting money from the largest players on behalf of individuals.
- JoshTriplett 2y ago
  I was referring to AI training here.
  - freejazz 2y ago
    We'll see, but hopefully they will not.