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China is responding to provocative actions of the US in Taiwan, the same way russia responded in Ukraine. "The others are irrational actors, crazies. We are th

China is responding to provocative actions of the US in Taiwan, the same way russia responded in Ukraine. "The others are irrational actors, crazies. We are the normal ones" If you can't smell the propaganda you've been fed to believe this irrational racist statements probably you will enjoy the draft.

chii 2y ago
> provocative actions of the US in Taiwan which was started via China's provocations in the southern china seas. Not to mention the de-democratization of hong kong. As for russia, their "response" is due to the fact that they don't want ukraine to lean westwards, regardless of the desire of the populous. I personally don't believe russia should have any say in how ukraine leans, and if their populous wants to lean westwards, russia have no right to intervene.
exe34 2y ago
From the Pacific to the Himalayas, the republic of China will be free?
spookie 2y ago
No country should be subjugated to the desires of another. Ukraine wanted to join the EU, that was their provocation? Several paramilitary groups in its home soil have been funded by Russia, Russia took over Crimea, Russia has invaded them. Only then was NATO ever on the table. The provocateur is pretty obvious in this case.
- lenkite 2y ago
  > Ukraine wanted to join the EU, that was their provocation? Hello, 2014 American sponsored, Nuland-designed Maidan coup which got rid of an elected President whose election had been formally and successfully vetted by EU observers, following which a fifth of Ukraine's ethnic Russian regions rebelled. Remember - Nuland was so personally involved that she was handing over food and drinks to "protestors". If this had been a U.S. ally, there would have been howls of foreign interference 24x7 on TV. Ukraine even put joining NATO as a constitutional guideline and part of their National Security Strategy in 2020-21! Imagine Mexico as a member of a military Anti-USA coalition - you can bet that there would an American invasion the next year for "regime change". > No country should be subjugated to the desires of another. Remove U.S. military bases from Cuba, Iraq and Syria - and then talk about "subjugation" to the desires of another nation. The sanctimonious hypocrisy of Americans always astonishes non-NATO citizens.
  - philistine 2y ago
    You try to justify an invasion of Ukraine by explaining what Russia perceived as problems. Dude, we know Russia’s position on the matter: we don’t believe it is enough. Giving water to protestors, and the existence of Gunatanamo do not make Putin correct.
    - riehwvfbk 2y ago
      Hey, did the man in the telly ever tell you about how messy the process of setting Ukraine's borders was back in 1990? Independent countries had to be carved out from the corpse of the USSR, and how does one set their borders? Well, one convenient way would be to use some existing administrative boundary, and this Ukraine was created within the borders of the Ukrainian SSR... Except that it wasn't that easy. Even back then there as debate over what status Crimea should have. The region already was an autonomy, and even held elections and elected a president. And then got attached to Ukraine anyway and had its independence obliterated. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuriy_Meshkov https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuriy_Meshkov
      - philistine 2y ago
        Sure, because there is not 100% consensus on the political situation of Crimea, that gives the right of Russia to invade Ukraine and kill people as much as it wants. There is a mechanism to resolve those matters: referendums. Once again your arguments are left wanting. Messy and difficult internal politics surrounding fundamental issues does not allow the invasion of a neighbour. Crimea didn't need daddy Russia to forcibly integrate it into the Russian state. It could have done that all its own if it had wanted. The fact Russia has to lower itself to violence to integrate territory illustrates how poor its logic is.
        riehwvfbk 2y ago
        Funny, because just such a referendum was held. And ignored. And I'm not talking about the recent one, but the one back in the early 1990s.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
stareatgoats 2y ago
> "The others are irrational actors, crazies. We are the normal ones" Everyone believes this, not just those on "our" side. Geopolitics is currently best described as a forcefield, where a myriad of interests vie for influence at any cost. To believe that "the other side" is simply responding to the nefarious, expansionist ambitions of the west is not smelling the propaganda too. The good side is but one, the side that seeks to replace destructive, imperialist, selfish policies from all sides with cooperation and the rule of international law. That is unfortunately a fledgling position to take ATM. .

chii 2y ago

> provocative actions of the US in Taiwan which was started via China's provocations in the southern china seas. Not to mention the de-democratization of hong kong. As for russia, their "response" is due to the fact that they don't want ukraine to lean westwards, regardless of the desire of the populous. I personally don't believe russia should have any say in how ukraine leans, and if their populous wants to lean westwards, russia have no right to intervene.

exe34 2y ago

From the Pacific to the Himalayas, the republic of China will be free?

spookie 2y ago

No country should be subjugated to the desires of another. Ukraine wanted to join the EU, that was their provocation? Several paramilitary groups in its home soil have been funded by Russia, Russia took over Crimea, Russia has invaded them. Only then was NATO ever on the table. The provocateur is pretty obvious in this case.

lenkite 2y ago
> Ukraine wanted to join the EU, that was their provocation? Hello, 2014 American sponsored, Nuland-designed Maidan coup which got rid of an elected President whose election had been formally and successfully vetted by EU observers, following which a fifth of Ukraine's ethnic Russian regions rebelled. Remember - Nuland was so personally involved that she was handing over food and drinks to "protestors". If this had been a U.S. ally, there would have been howls of foreign interference 24x7 on TV. Ukraine even put joining NATO as a constitutional guideline and part of their National Security Strategy in 2020-21! Imagine Mexico as a member of a military Anti-USA coalition - you can bet that there would an American invasion the next year for "regime change". > No country should be subjugated to the desires of another. Remove U.S. military bases from Cuba, Iraq and Syria - and then talk about "subjugation" to the desires of another nation. The sanctimonious hypocrisy of Americans always astonishes non-NATO citizens.
- philistine 2y ago
  You try to justify an invasion of Ukraine by explaining what Russia perceived as problems. Dude, we know Russia’s position on the matter: we don’t believe it is enough. Giving water to protestors, and the existence of Gunatanamo do not make Putin correct.
  - riehwvfbk 2y ago
    Hey, did the man in the telly ever tell you about how messy the process of setting Ukraine's borders was back in 1990? Independent countries had to be carved out from the corpse of the USSR, and how does one set their borders? Well, one convenient way would be to use some existing administrative boundary, and this Ukraine was created within the borders of the Ukrainian SSR... Except that it wasn't that easy. Even back then there as debate over what status Crimea should have. The region already was an autonomy, and even held elections and elected a president. And then got attached to Ukraine anyway and had its independence obliterated. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuriy_Meshkov https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuriy_Meshkov
    - philistine 2y ago
      Sure, because there is not 100% consensus on the political situation of Crimea, that gives the right of Russia to invade Ukraine and kill people as much as it wants. There is a mechanism to resolve those matters: referendums. Once again your arguments are left wanting. Messy and difficult internal politics surrounding fundamental issues does not allow the invasion of a neighbour. Crimea didn't need daddy Russia to forcibly integrate it into the Russian state. It could have done that all its own if it had wanted. The fact Russia has to lower itself to violence to integrate territory illustrates how poor its logic is.
      - riehwvfbk 2y ago
        Funny, because just such a referendum was held. And ignored. And I'm not talking about the recent one, but the one back in the early 1990s.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

stareatgoats 2y ago

> "The others are irrational actors, crazies. We are the normal ones" Everyone believes this, not just those on "our" side. Geopolitics is currently best described as a forcefield, where a myriad of interests vie for influence at any cost. To believe that "the other side" is simply responding to the nefarious, expansionist ambitions of the west is not smelling the propaganda too. The good side is but one, the side that seeks to replace destructive, imperialist, selfish policies from all sides with cooperation and the rule of international law. That is unfortunately a fledgling position to take ATM. .