7 ms·

I played around with Amazon Q and while setting it up, I needed to create an IAM identity center. Never did this before, so I was asking Q in the AWS docs how

by k__ 2y ago

I played around with Amazon Q and while setting it up, I needed to create an IAM identity center. Never did this before, so I was asking Q in the AWS docs how to do it. It refused to help, as it didn't answer security related questions. thank.

arianvanp 2y ago
This limitation is new. And it's so annoying. 95% of the time my questions I have surrounding AWS are IAM or security related and this thing refuses to answer anything. It's so annoying.
- el_benhameen 2y ago
  It’s an absolute disaster. It wouldn’t answer something along the lines of “what is IAM” when I asked increasingly simple “security” related questions. Very little chance I’ll try an aws AI offering again any time soon.
menacingly 2y ago
it’s similar asking the gemini-1.5 models about coding questions that involve auth one of my questions about a login form also tripped a harassment flag
- michaelt 2y ago
  I suspect the refusal to answer questions about auth aren't a matter of hacking or offensive material. I suspect instead the people training these models have identified areas of questioning where their model is 99% right, but because the 1% wrong is incredibly costly they dodge the entire question. Would you want your LLM to give out any legal advice, or medical advice, or can-I-eat-this-mushroom advice, if you knew due to imperfections in your training process, it sometimes recommended people put glue in their pizza sauce?
  - TeMPOraL 2y ago
    "If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." So sure, the LLM occasionally pranks someone, in a way similar to how random Internet posts do; it is confidently wrong, in a way similar to how most text on the Internet is confidently wrong because content marketers don't give a damn about correctness, that's not what the text is there for. As much as this state of things pains me, general population has mostly adapted. Meanwhile, people who would appreciate a model that's 99% right on things where the 1% is costly, rightfully continue to ignore Gemini and other models by companies too afraid to play in the field for real.
    - rockskon 2y ago
      AI is not like some random person posting on the Internet. A random person on the Internet often has surrounding context to help discern trustworthiness. A researcher can also query multiple sources to determine how much there is concensus about. You can't do that with LLMs. I cannot stress strongly enough that direct comparisons between LLMs and experts on the Internet are inappropriate.
      - TeMPOraL 2y ago
        > I cannot stress strongly enough that direct comparisons between LLMs and experts on the Internet are inappropriate. In this context, I very much agree. But I'd like to stress that "experts on the Internet" is not what 99% of the users read 99% of the time, because that's not what search engines surface by default. When you make e.g. food or law or health-related queries, what you get back isn't written by experts - it's written by content marketers. Never confuse the two. > A researcher can also query multiple sources to determine how much there is concensus about. > You can't do that with LLMs. A person like that will know LLMs hallucinate, and query multiple sources and/or their own knowledge, and/or even re-query the LLM several times. Such people are not in danger - but very much annoyed when perfectly reasonable queries get rejected on the grounds of "safety".
      - 2y ago
lhl 2y ago
I believe Amazon Q is running on Amazon's own Titan G1 model. I recently ran the "Premier" version (their highest end one) through my personal vibecheck test and was quite surprised by its RL. It was the only non-Chinese model I've tested to refuse to answer about Tiananmen Square and the only model I believe I've tested with this eval (over 50 at this point) that refused to answer about the LA riots. It also scored an impressive 0/6 on my reasoning/basic world understanding tests (underperforming most 3B models) but that's more capabilities than RL... Amazon claims the Titan model is suitable for: "Supported use cases: RAG, agents, chat, chain of thought, open-ended text generation, brainstorming, summarization, code generation, table creation, data formatting, paraphrasing, rewriting, extraction, and Q&A." (it is not, lol)
- malfist 2y ago
  It is Titian under the hood. And it's absolutely crap. Also fun fact, Titan's image generator will refuse any prompt that references Bezos because it "violates content policy" If you want to do something useful on bedrock use Claude
  - lhl 2y ago
    I've been poking around this week and there's actually quite a few useful models on Bedrock (this is region dependent!) https://docs.aws.amazon.com/bedrock/latest/userguide/models-regions.html https://docs.aws.amazon.com/bedrock/latest/userguide/models-... Claude Opus is supposedly only available in us-west-2, but is listed as "Unavailable" for me (Sonnet and Haiku are available). Cohere's Command R+ is also available and while less capable, for instruction following, I believe its superior to Anthropic's models. There's also Llama 3 70B Instruct and Mistral Large, both which are good for general tasks. For those that haven't been closely following/testing the models available, I think Artificial Analysis' Quality vs Price charts isn't too bad a place to start https://artificialanalysis.ai/models https://artificialanalysis.ai/models although if you have specific tasks, it's best to eval some models are surprisingly good/bad at specific things. Titan appears to be bad at everything though.
    - spmurrayzzz 2y ago
chuckadams 2y ago
I once asked Q to help me fix a broken policy (turns out we were using the wrong thing for the resource name). It gave me some completely unrelated documentation about setting up Cogito. I've never seen an AI as laughably bad as Q.
gverrilla 2y ago
Tried Amazon Q a few times, it was NEVER able to provide any help. Why do they keep that crap?
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
DonsDiscountGas 2y ago
In fairness to Amazon Q, the AWS docs are pretty confusing. Maybe it was just embarrassed and made an excuse. (Sidenote to Amazon and others: an LLM is a supplement to good documentation, not a replacement)
- throwaway48476 2y ago
  The LLM requires good documentation to train on.

by k__ 2y ago

arianvanp 2y ago

This limitation is new. And it's so annoying. 95% of the time my questions I have surrounding AWS are IAM or security related and this thing refuses to answer anything. It's so annoying.

el_benhameen 2y ago
It’s an absolute disaster. It wouldn’t answer something along the lines of “what is IAM” when I asked increasingly simple “security” related questions. Very little chance I’ll try an aws AI offering again any time soon.

menacingly 2y ago

it’s similar asking the gemini-1.5 models about coding questions that involve auth one of my questions about a login form also tripped a harassment flag

michaelt 2y ago
I suspect the refusal to answer questions about auth aren't a matter of hacking or offensive material. I suspect instead the people training these models have identified areas of questioning where their model is 99% right, but because the 1% wrong is incredibly costly they dodge the entire question. Would you want your LLM to give out any legal advice, or medical advice, or can-I-eat-this-mushroom advice, if you knew due to imperfections in your training process, it sometimes recommended people put glue in their pizza sauce?
- TeMPOraL 2y ago
  "If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." So sure, the LLM occasionally pranks someone, in a way similar to how random Internet posts do; it is confidently wrong, in a way similar to how most text on the Internet is confidently wrong because content marketers don't give a damn about correctness, that's not what the text is there for. As much as this state of things pains me, general population has mostly adapted. Meanwhile, people who would appreciate a model that's 99% right on things where the 1% is costly, rightfully continue to ignore Gemini and other models by companies too afraid to play in the field for real.
  - rockskon 2y ago
    AI is not like some random person posting on the Internet. A random person on the Internet often has surrounding context to help discern trustworthiness. A researcher can also query multiple sources to determine how much there is concensus about. You can't do that with LLMs. I cannot stress strongly enough that direct comparisons between LLMs and experts on the Internet are inappropriate.
    - TeMPOraL 2y ago
      > I cannot stress strongly enough that direct comparisons between LLMs and experts on the Internet are inappropriate. In this context, I very much agree. But I'd like to stress that "experts on the Internet" is not what 99% of the users read 99% of the time, because that's not what search engines surface by default. When you make e.g. food or law or health-related queries, what you get back isn't written by experts - it's written by content marketers. Never confuse the two. > A researcher can also query multiple sources to determine how much there is concensus about. > You can't do that with LLMs. A person like that will know LLMs hallucinate, and query multiple sources and/or their own knowledge, and/or even re-query the LLM several times. Such people are not in danger - but very much annoyed when perfectly reasonable queries get rejected on the grounds of "safety".
    - 2y ago

lhl 2y ago

I believe Amazon Q is running on Amazon's own Titan G1 model. I recently ran the "Premier" version (their highest end one) through my personal vibecheck test and was quite surprised by its RL. It was the only non-Chinese model I've tested to refuse to answer about Tiananmen Square and the only model I believe I've tested with this eval (over 50 at this point) that refused to answer about the LA riots. It also scored an impressive 0/6 on my reasoning/basic world understanding tests (underperforming most 3B models) but that's more capabilities than RL... Amazon claims the Titan model is suitable for: "Supported use cases: RAG, agents, chat, chain of thought, open-ended text generation, brainstorming, summarization, code generation, table creation, data formatting, paraphrasing, rewriting, extraction, and Q&A." (it is not, lol)

malfist 2y ago
It is Titian under the hood. And it's absolutely crap. Also fun fact, Titan's image generator will refuse any prompt that references Bezos because it "violates content policy" If you want to do something useful on bedrock use Claude
- lhl 2y ago
  I've been poking around this week and there's actually quite a few useful models on Bedrock (this is region dependent!) https://docs.aws.amazon.com/bedrock/latest/userguide/models-regions.html https://docs.aws.amazon.com/bedrock/latest/userguide/models-... Claude Opus is supposedly only available in us-west-2, but is listed as "Unavailable" for me (Sonnet and Haiku are available). Cohere's Command R+ is also available and while less capable, for instruction following, I believe its superior to Anthropic's models. There's also Llama 3 70B Instruct and Mistral Large, both which are good for general tasks. For those that haven't been closely following/testing the models available, I think Artificial Analysis' Quality vs Price charts isn't too bad a place to start https://artificialanalysis.ai/models https://artificialanalysis.ai/models although if you have specific tasks, it's best to eval some models are surprisingly good/bad at specific things. Titan appears to be bad at everything though.
  - spmurrayzzz 2y ago

chuckadams 2y ago

I once asked Q to help me fix a broken policy (turns out we were using the wrong thing for the resource name). It gave me some completely unrelated documentation about setting up Cogito. I've never seen an AI as laughably bad as Q.

gverrilla 2y ago

Tried Amazon Q a few times, it was NEVER able to provide any help. Why do they keep that crap?

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

DonsDiscountGas 2y ago

In fairness to Amazon Q, the AWS docs are pretty confusing. Maybe it was just embarrassed and made an excuse. (Sidenote to Amazon and others: an LLM is a supplement to good documentation, not a replacement)

throwaway48476 2y ago
The LLM requires good documentation to train on.