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Just as russian bots, israeli bots spreading fake news are worst thing that happened to our society. Crazy that people are falling for this but here we are

greenavocado 2y ago
How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? This is even worse. Also, AIPAC is allowed to exist. As a thought experiment replace Israeli with Russian citizenship for the Israeli dual citizens in Congress and replace AIPAC with a hypothetical Russian ARPAC. Imagine how crazy this would be. Yet the current situation is somehow completely acceptable.
- golergka 2y ago
  > As a thought experiment replace Israeli with Russian citizenship for the Israeli dual citizens in Congress and replace AIPAC with a hypothetical Russian ARPAC Is Russia the main American ally in the region that contributes enormously to American intelligence and R&D, while also supporting American military operations?
  - Hikikomori 2y ago
    South Africa was also their ally in that region.
  - throw310822 2y ago
    Have you considered that things might go the other way around: if Russia had such a strong influence on the US through its political action lobby as Israel does, Russia would be considered by politicians the main ally of the US, and the economic and military ties between the two countries would be unbreakable. Because the purpose of these lobbies is exactly to influence how a certain country feels and acts about another.
    - golergka 2y ago
      So, in your scenario, US would get another valuable ally? You make lobbying look positively fantastic.
      - throw310822 2y ago
        No. The US would be convinced it got another valuable ally- which is not the same as actually having one. In pretty much the same way, those who fall for long distance romance scams didn't find the love of their life, despite believing so. They found someone who is taking advantage of them.
  - mardifoufs 2y ago
    What operations did Israel support? If anything the US is over involved in the MENA area because of Israel. Before the cringy evangelical push for total support for Israel, the middle east wasn't hostile to the US. Actually the US was seen as the good guys (in the 50s and arguably 60s) because they were strictly pushing Great Britain and France for decolonisation.
- jhp123 2y ago
  > How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? Zero? I can't find a reliable source for any congress member being an Israeli citizen
  - wonderwonder 2y ago
    OP means Jews https://www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/defining-antisemitism-dual-loyalty https://www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/defining-antisem... Lots of people going masks off now that is cool to be anti-semitic again but now we call it anti-zionist.
    - vsuperpower2020 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - jhp123 2y ago
        are you trying to get Nazi talking points bingo? Don't forget the race science stuff or "ouch! my neck"
        vsuperpower2020 2y ago
        Sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about.
    - tumsfestival 2y ago
      This post was brought to you by the IDF, remember if you don't agree with us you're as bad as Nazis.
      - wonderwonder 2y ago
        so did OP not mean Jews or are we saying that anyone inferring that someone is anti semitic is working for the IDF?
- wonderwonder 2y ago
  "How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship" By this do you mean Jews? Should be prevent Jewish people from being allowed in congress? "AIPAC is allowed to exist" Should we prevent it from existing becuase it supports a Jewish state? You have no issue with the hundreds of other lobbying groups, just the jewish one.
  - throw310822 2y ago
    It's not Jewish, it's pro-Israel (American Israel Public Affair Committee). Israel is a foreign country whose interests might be conflicting with those of the US. That's different, don't you think?
    - wonderwonder 2y ago
      you going to ignore OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews? Odd that people are only concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is? https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs/foreign-connected-pacs/2022 https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...
      - throw310822 2y ago
        > OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews "Dual citizens" clearly means "dual citizens". If the OP had the information that many Jews in Congress were dual citizens, he was wrong- although in fairness it's an understandable false belief when you have US politicians coming to Congress wearing their IDF uniform or propose laws to give IDF veterans the same benefits that US veterans receive. > concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is? Just look at the the first PAC in the list you mentioned: it's Accenture. Classified as foreign because their headquarter is in an empty office of a tax haven. AIPAC is not even in this list: it's in the "ideology/ single issue" list, where it stands as the only pro-<some country> PAC in the list (and the 4th largest). https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs/industry-detail/Q/2024 https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...
- mountainofdeath 2y ago
  To my knowledge, zero. If you really mean Jews, I think there are roughly 40 between both houses of Congress. None of them are Israeli citizens. Jews are not automatically citizens of Israel though they do have dedicated pathway to obtaining it, but it's not as simple as merely showing up and claim you are Jewish.
- wk_end 2y ago
  > How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? I don't know. How many? I was curious and Googled, and couldn't find any good authoritative lists. This Quora answer [0] implies that the answer is zero, as does this Snopes article [1]. Both answers mention that there's various incorrect lists going around that are white supremacist propaganda. [0] https://www.quora.com/Which-current-members-of-Congress-have-dual-citizenship/answer/Dennis-Webber-5 https://www.quora.com/Which-current-members-of-Congress-have... [1] https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/02/05/dual-citizenship-elected-representatives/ https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/02/05/dual-citizenship-elec...
  - mardifoufs 2y ago
    They have defacto Israeli citizenship because of the law of return, no? Not saying I agree with who you're replying to, but if a few dozen congressmen had the same status in Russia, wouldn't you see them as being connected to said country?
    - wk_end 2y ago
      I mean, they’re “connected” insofar as they have the potential legal right to move there and acquire citizenship. The question is - is that kind of connection meaningful here? Speaking personally - I am ethnically Jewish, although I’ve never practiced, and of Polish descent. Technically, if I were to go through the necessary processes, I could acquire citizenship of Israel or Poland. Despite that: I’ve never been to either country, have no known family there, I don’t speak either Hebrew or Polish…the notion that I have any meaningful connection to these foreign countries beyond trivial historical facts is absurd to me. And the idea that, were Poland or Israel to become geopolitical adversaries of Canada, I would be viewed with mistrust, as less Canadian because, through quirks of family history and bureaucracy I’ve been made an offer I never accepted, is pretty disheartening. At any rate, the upshot of this line of thinking - that we must be wary of Jews with matters of national importance because they are, through no choice of their own, supposedly beholden to a foreign power - is enormously problematic and, yes, anti-Semitic. Similar logic was used to justify Japanese internment camps.

greenavocado 2y ago

How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? This is even worse. Also, AIPAC is allowed to exist. As a thought experiment replace Israeli with Russian citizenship for the Israeli dual citizens in Congress and replace AIPAC with a hypothetical Russian ARPAC. Imagine how crazy this would be. Yet the current situation is somehow completely acceptable.

golergka 2y ago
> As a thought experiment replace Israeli with Russian citizenship for the Israeli dual citizens in Congress and replace AIPAC with a hypothetical Russian ARPAC Is Russia the main American ally in the region that contributes enormously to American intelligence and R&D, while also supporting American military operations?
- Hikikomori 2y ago
  South Africa was also their ally in that region.
- throw310822 2y ago
  Have you considered that things might go the other way around: if Russia had such a strong influence on the US through its political action lobby as Israel does, Russia would be considered by politicians the main ally of the US, and the economic and military ties between the two countries would be unbreakable. Because the purpose of these lobbies is exactly to influence how a certain country feels and acts about another.
  - golergka 2y ago
    So, in your scenario, US would get another valuable ally? You make lobbying look positively fantastic.
    - throw310822 2y ago
      No. The US would be convinced it got another valuable ally- which is not the same as actually having one. In pretty much the same way, those who fall for long distance romance scams didn't find the love of their life, despite believing so. They found someone who is taking advantage of them.
- mardifoufs 2y ago
  What operations did Israel support? If anything the US is over involved in the MENA area because of Israel. Before the cringy evangelical push for total support for Israel, the middle east wasn't hostile to the US. Actually the US was seen as the good guys (in the 50s and arguably 60s) because they were strictly pushing Great Britain and France for decolonisation.
jhp123 2y ago
> How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? Zero? I can't find a reliable source for any congress member being an Israeli citizen
- wonderwonder 2y ago
  OP means Jews https://www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/defining-antisemitism-dual-loyalty https://www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/defining-antisem... Lots of people going masks off now that is cool to be anti-semitic again but now we call it anti-zionist.
  - vsuperpower2020 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - jhp123 2y ago
      are you trying to get Nazi talking points bingo? Don't forget the race science stuff or "ouch! my neck"
      - vsuperpower2020 2y ago
        Sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about.
  - tumsfestival 2y ago
    This post was brought to you by the IDF, remember if you don't agree with us you're as bad as Nazis.
    - wonderwonder 2y ago
      so did OP not mean Jews or are we saying that anyone inferring that someone is anti semitic is working for the IDF?
wonderwonder 2y ago
"How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship" By this do you mean Jews? Should be prevent Jewish people from being allowed in congress? "AIPAC is allowed to exist" Should we prevent it from existing becuase it supports a Jewish state? You have no issue with the hundreds of other lobbying groups, just the jewish one.
- throw310822 2y ago
  It's not Jewish, it's pro-Israel (American Israel Public Affair Committee). Israel is a foreign country whose interests might be conflicting with those of the US. That's different, don't you think?
  - wonderwonder 2y ago
    you going to ignore OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews? Odd that people are only concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is? https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs/foreign-connected-pacs/2022 https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...
    - throw310822 2y ago
      > OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews "Dual citizens" clearly means "dual citizens". If the OP had the information that many Jews in Congress were dual citizens, he was wrong- although in fairness it's an understandable false belief when you have US politicians coming to Congress wearing their IDF uniform or propose laws to give IDF veterans the same benefits that US veterans receive. > concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is? Just look at the the first PAC in the list you mentioned: it's Accenture. Classified as foreign because their headquarter is in an empty office of a tax haven. AIPAC is not even in this list: it's in the "ideology/ single issue" list, where it stands as the only pro-<some country> PAC in the list (and the 4th largest). https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs/industry-detail/Q/2024 https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...
mountainofdeath 2y ago
To my knowledge, zero. If you really mean Jews, I think there are roughly 40 between both houses of Congress. None of them are Israeli citizens. Jews are not automatically citizens of Israel though they do have dedicated pathway to obtaining it, but it's not as simple as merely showing up and claim you are Jewish.
wk_end 2y ago
> How many congressmen are dual citizens with Israeli citizenship? I don't know. How many? I was curious and Googled, and couldn't find any good authoritative lists. This Quora answer [0] implies that the answer is zero, as does this Snopes article [1]. Both answers mention that there's various incorrect lists going around that are white supremacist propaganda. [0] https://www.quora.com/Which-current-members-of-Congress-have-dual-citizenship/answer/Dennis-Webber-5 https://www.quora.com/Which-current-members-of-Congress-have... [1] https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/02/05/dual-citizenship-elected-representatives/ https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/02/05/dual-citizenship-elec...
- mardifoufs 2y ago
  They have defacto Israeli citizenship because of the law of return, no? Not saying I agree with who you're replying to, but if a few dozen congressmen had the same status in Russia, wouldn't you see them as being connected to said country?
  - wk_end 2y ago
    I mean, they’re “connected” insofar as they have the potential legal right to move there and acquire citizenship. The question is - is that kind of connection meaningful here? Speaking personally - I am ethnically Jewish, although I’ve never practiced, and of Polish descent. Technically, if I were to go through the necessary processes, I could acquire citizenship of Israel or Poland. Despite that: I’ve never been to either country, have no known family there, I don’t speak either Hebrew or Polish…the notion that I have any meaningful connection to these foreign countries beyond trivial historical facts is absurd to me. And the idea that, were Poland or Israel to become geopolitical adversaries of Canada, I would be viewed with mistrust, as less Canadian because, through quirks of family history and bureaucracy I’ve been made an offer I never accepted, is pretty disheartening. At any rate, the upshot of this line of thinking - that we must be wary of Jews with matters of national importance because they are, through no choice of their own, supposedly beholden to a foreign power - is enormously problematic and, yes, anti-Semitic. Similar logic was used to justify Japanese internment camps.